Can’t sell new hand guns that will accept over 15 rounds magazine

[Weed]

Was at the Canton Farm King today and was told they couldn’t sell a Glock 17 because it would accept a over 15 round magazine, did I miss something or is that a fact 

[ealcala31]

I call BS. I am thinking its company policy...

[Dumak_from_arfcom]

On 12/11/2023 at 6:59 PM, Weed said:

Was at the Canton Farm King today and was told they couldn’t sell a Glock 17 because it would accept a over 15 round magazine, did I miss something or is that a fact 

 

Some time last spring, the Outdoorsman in Winthrop Harbor wouldn't sell a Prodigy to me because "it has the capacity to hold over 15 rounds."  I asked them to just keep the mags and I'd pay the full price - I told them I could by 15 rounders from Staccato.  They still wouldn't do it. 

 

 

[top_notch]

My glock 26 holds 33 rounds with a stick mag.

[Capt_Destro]

Just buy a Glock 22, and pick up the 17 slide with RMR Cut, a barrel and parts kit. 😅

[Weed]

Thanks everybody.

They had several brands on display with red ribbons tied on them they wouldn't sell.

Kid at the counter said the feds came in and told them they couldn't sell them.

That's what got me wondering.

[soundguy]

On 12/11/2023 at 9:06 PM, Weed said:

Kid at the counter said the feds came in and told them they couldn't sell them.

That's what got me wondering.

 

Why would the Feds care...

 

 

Cheers,

Tim

[davel501]

On 12/12/2023 at 6:57 AM, soundguy said:

 

Why would the Feds care...

 

 

Cheers,

Tim

 

They require you to be compliant with all local laws too. 

[Glock43]

On 12/12/2023 at 9:15 AM, davel501 said:

 

They require you to be compliant with all local laws too. 

yeah,

 

but the Feds are asking them to enforce a non-existent law!

[Weed]

Don't they do that all the time?

[davel501]

On 12/12/2023 at 7:34 PM, Glock43 said:

yeah,

 

but the Feds are asking them to enforce a non-existent law!

 

There are others that have read the law the same way. The fixed magazine bit trips up a lot of people. It's a mess. 

 

"(720 ILCS 5/24-1.9)

    Sec. 24-1.9. Manufacture, possession, delivery, sale, and purchase of "assault weapons", .50 caliber rifles, and .50 caliber cartridges.
    (a) Definitions. In this Section:
   .

   . 

   . 

        (C) A semiautomatic pistol that has the capacity to accept a detachable magazine or that may be readily modified to accept a detachable magazine, if the firearm has one or more of the following:

            (i) a threaded barrel;
            (ii) a second pistol grip or another feature capable of functioning as a protruding grip that can be held by the non-trigger hand;

            (iii) a shroud attached to the barrel or that partially or completely encircles the barrel, allowing the bearer to hold the firearm with the non-trigger hand without being burned, but excluding a slide that encloses the barrel;

            (iv) a flash suppressor;
            (v) the capacity to accept a detachable magazine at some location outside of the pistol grip; or

            (vi) a buffer tube, arm brace, or other part that protrudes horizontally behind the pistol grip and is designed or redesigned to allow or facilitate a firearm to be fired from the shoulder.

        (D) A semiautomatic pistol that has a fixed magazine with the capacity to accept more than 15 rounds."

[vito]

What is a "fixed magazine"?

[davel501]

On 12/15/2023 at 2:19 PM, vito said:

What is a "fixed magazine"?

 

You really ought to sign up for the internet. It's petty cool. 

 

"(8) "Fixed magazine" means an ammunition feeding device that is permanently attached to a firearm, or contained in and not removable from a firearm, or that is otherwise not a detachable magazine, but does not include an attached tubular device designed to accept, and capable of operating only with, .22 caliber rimfire ammunition."

 

Full text:  

https://www.ilga.gov/legislation/ilcs/documents/072000050K24-1.9.htm

[3ddiver]

On 12/12/2023 at 6:57 AM, soundguy said:

 

Why would the Feds care...

 

 

Cheers,

Tim

The feds enforce the state gun laws as well. Not compliant with state laws then you aren't compliant in their mind.

[once0217]

You do realize that the ban includes every gun that can readily accept over 15 rounds? The IL ban basically bans every single semi auto in existence, thanks Promag? 

Section "C" subsection "A"

[davel501]

On 12/16/2023 at 7:52 PM, once0217 said:

You do realize that the ban includes every gun that can readily accept over 15 rounds? The IL ban basically bans every single semi auto in existence, thanks Promag? 

Section "C" subsection "A"

 

Section c has roman numerals under it. It would help us if you include the text that you are referring to. 

[ryr8828]

My son called for advice, I didn't have much to give him.

 

If you have an xdm .40 that has 16 round magazines (no threaded barrel) do you have to register it? Do you have to register the magazines?

 

If you take the xdm outside of your place of residence with the 16 round magazine in it are you breaking the pica law?

[davel501]

On 12/18/2023 at 4:10 PM, ryr8828 said:

My son called for advice, I didn't have much to give him.

 

If you have an xdm .40 that has 16 round magazines (no threaded barrel) do you have to register it? Do you have to register the magazines?

 

If you take the xdm outside of your place of residence with the 16 round magazine in it are you breaking the pica law?

 

No, you don't register unless it has one of the evil features - threaded barrel most likely, if anything, on an xdm. 

 

Can't go walking around with the 16 round mags loaded but they are fine to take to the range unloaded. 16 round mags loaded on your own property or at the range are fine. 

 

He's going to want to get some smaller mags for carry. 

 

[sdf4]

I wanted to buy a nice pistol a couple weeks ago. But it came with 16 round mags. Just one round over. Who came up with 15 rounds only? I wanted to buy the new Taurus ts9. I can get it new for 250.00. But it only comes with 17 rounders. 

[ealcala31]

On 12/31/2023 at 12:46 PM, sdf4 said:

I wanted to buy a nice pistol a couple weeks ago. But it came with 16 round mags. Just one round over. Who came up with 15 rounds only? I wanted to buy the new Taurus ts9. I can get it new for 250.00. But it only comes with 17 rounders. 

I'm sure a 10rd model will be available shortly...

[Billy Bob]

Brownell's wouldn't sell me a Glock 19 clone frame. I sent them a link to the law, and my FFL e-mailed them that he was OK with handling the transfer, but they wouldn't budge. It was the same story with a couple of other places. I've heard that a lot of venders just don't want to risk dealing with Illinois customers.

 

Palmetto State Armory has no issues with selling their compact dagger frames to Illinois customers, and they are basically a G19 clone.

Edited January 1, 2024 at 05:48 AM by Billy Bob

[Euler]

Gun dealers hire lawyers to interpret the law for them and provide advice. You are not their lawyer, therefore they will not take your legal advice.

In addition, customer service representatives and sales personnel are not the ones that form store policy. Giving them your interpretation of the law achieves nothing.

Unless you intend to sue an intransigent vendor to sell you a firearm, find another vendor.

[Mr. Fife]

On 12/18/2023 at 4:15 PM, davel501 said:

 

Can't go walking around with the 16 round mags loaded but they are fine to take to the range unloaded. 16 round mags loaded on your own property or at the range are fine. 

 

Can you point out where it says you can't walk around with a pistol, like an XDM in this example, with a 16 round mag loaded?

I'm have trouble locating something like that in the PiCA text.

Thanks in advance.

[John Q Public]

Not constitutionally, but ya, look at PICA. If you carry, you are limited to 15-1 right now. 

[davel501]

On 1/5/2024 at 3:45 PM, Mr. Fife said:

Can you point out where it says you can't walk around with a pistol, like an XDM in this example, with a 16 round mag loaded?

I'm have trouble locating something like that in the PiCA text.

Thanks in advance.

 

You're right, it's in a weird spot.

 

Quote

(720 ILCS 5/24-1.10)     Sec. 24-1.10. Manufacture, delivery, sale, and possession of large capacity ammunition feeding devices.     (a) In this Section:     "Handgun" has the meaning ascribed to it in the Firearm Concealed Carry Act.     "Long gun" means a rifle or shotgun.     "Large capacity ammunition feeding device" means:         (1) a magazine, belt, drum, feed strip, or similar

device that has a capacity of, or that can be readily restored or converted to accept, more than 10 rounds of ammunition for long guns and more than 15 rounds of ammunition for handguns; or

(2) any combination of parts from which a device

described in paragraph (1) can be assembled.

"Large capacity ammunition feeding device" does not include an attached tubular device designed to accept, and capable of operating only with, .22 caliber rimfire ammunition. "Large capacity ammunition feeding device" does not include a tubular magazine that is contained in a lever-action firearm or any device that has been made permanently inoperable.     (b) Except as provided in subsections (e) and (f), it is unlawful for any person within this State to knowingly manufacture, deliver, sell, purchase, or cause to be manufactured, delivered, sold, or purchased a large capacity ammunition feeding device.     (c) Except as provided in subsections (d), (e), and (f), and beginning 90 days after the effective date of this amendatory Act of the 102nd General Assembly, it is unlawful to knowingly possess a large capacity ammunition feeding device.     (d) Subsection (c) does not apply to a person's possession of a large capacity ammunition feeding device if the person lawfully possessed that large capacity ammunition feeding device before the effective date of this amendatory Act of the 102nd General Assembly, provided that the person shall possess such device only:         (1) on private property owned or immediately

controlled by the person;

(2) on private property that is not open to the

public with the express permission of the person who owns or immediately controls such property;

(3) while on the premises of a licensed firearms

dealer or gunsmith for the purpose of lawful repair;

(4) while engaged in the legal use of the large

capacity ammunition feeding device at a properly licensed firing range or sport shooting competition venue; or

(5) while traveling to or from these locations,

provided that the large capacity ammunition feeding device is stored unloaded and enclosed in a case, firearm carrying box, shipping box, or other container.

 

[Mr. Fife]

On 1/5/2024 at 4:04 PM, davel501 said:

 

You're right, it's in a weird spot.

 

 

I see, I was following the link in your sig, but this does not show up.

[davel501]

On 1/5/2024 at 4:10 PM, Mr. Fife said:

I see, I was following the link in your sig, but this does not show up.

 

Yeah, I didn't know it was there. Updated sig to include that and the FAQ. Let me know if you see any more missing. I can say for sure that there's no 1.11 :).

[Mr. Fife]

I would have looked earlier except that everything of mine is Cook County legal so I didn't look through the law until I saw your "walking around" comment.  I thought guns and their magazines fell under the Concealed Carry Act.

Edited January 5, 2024 at 10:45 PM by Mr. Fife

[soundguy]

On 1/5/2024 at 4:45 PM, Mr. Fife said:

I would have looked earlier except that everything of mine is Cook County legal so I didn't look through the law until I saw your "walking around" comment.  I thought guns and their magazines fell under the Concealed Carry Act.

They do fall under the CC Act… which now limits mags to 15 rounds… except for any grandfathered mags which must be empty when transporting off of your own property, at the range, at the home of a friend who says it’s OK. 
 

Kinda like Fanny Pack Carry but worse!

 

Cheers,

Tim

[djmarkla]

Is a backup Magazine with 15 or fewer rounds an issue while carrying?