WtJen Posted March 15, 2014 at 11:12 PM Posted March 15, 2014 at 11:12 PM Today I was out shopping with the wife and carrying. I had some overdue books from the town library and decided to drop them off. Knowing this was a GFZ even though not posted, I unholstered and put my gun in the glove box. My wife decided to stay in the car while I was in the library. This is where they legality of what I did comes into play. My wife does not have a FCCL or a FOID and she is sitting in our car with a loaded gun in the glove box. If a weird set of circumstances happened whereby a LEO knocked on her car door while I was inside and asked if there was a firearm in the car, what would happen? 1) Does she have the duty to inform since she is not a permit holder?2) Is she committing a crime by being in a car with a gun even though it is not on her person? I suspect the above scenario will never happen but it did get me to thinking about maybe putting the gun in the trunk instead of the glove box if she decides to stay in the car when I do an errand inside a GFZ. Your thoughts?
KarlJ Posted March 15, 2014 at 11:31 PM Posted March 15, 2014 at 11:31 PM I would make sure the gun is not accessable to her, like in a locked glove box or container that she doesn't have a key for access. If she is the only one in the car, and it's accessable. She likely could be charged with possession.
ScopeEye Posted March 15, 2014 at 11:32 PM Posted March 15, 2014 at 11:32 PM My thoughts...Knowing how the Republic of IL thinks, if the person left in car is aware of loaded firearm, McCarthy would either shoot or arrest
WtJen Posted March 15, 2014 at 11:33 PM Author Posted March 15, 2014 at 11:33 PM I would make sure the gun is not accessable to her, like in a locked glove box or container that she doesn't have a key for access. If she is the only one in the car, and it's accessable. She likely could be charged with possession. This has been on my mind this afternoon. Can't think of anything worse than getting my wife in trouble over my own negligence in the matter.
papa Posted March 15, 2014 at 11:39 PM Posted March 15, 2014 at 11:39 PM I would make sure the gun is not accessable to her, like in a locked glove box or container that she doesn't have a key for access. If she is the only one in the car, and it's accessable. She likely could be charged with possession. This has been on my mind this afternoon. Can't think of anything worse than getting my wife in trouble over my own negligence in the matter. I would say either put in the trunk or have her take the books in. Even if the firearm were unloaded and in the passenger area , she would still have been in trouble should something have happened.
Stargeezer Posted March 15, 2014 at 11:49 PM Posted March 15, 2014 at 11:49 PM Yep. No matter what, she would be in trouble. The fact it was loaded would just add charges - up to the point that she would look like Ma Kelly on the way to your next bank job. Doesn't the place have a outside bookdrop? I'd rather do that or make her see reason and get a FOID card.
paulgl26 Posted March 15, 2014 at 11:55 PM Posted March 15, 2014 at 11:55 PM Get her a foid and unload when u leave it in the car Sent from my SPH-L720 using Tapatalk
handyflyer Posted March 16, 2014 at 12:05 AM Posted March 16, 2014 at 12:05 AM Get her a foid and unload when u leave it in the car Sent from my SPH-L720 using Tapatalk Best $10 you'll ever spend. I made sure my significant other had a FOID before I recievedy FCCL.
Booxone Posted March 16, 2014 at 12:14 AM Posted March 16, 2014 at 12:14 AM I would think that's an easy case to beat if the LEO wanted to be a ****** and charge your wife with that. Like the other people said, get her a FOID and avoid that hassle.
Tip Posted March 16, 2014 at 12:20 AM Posted March 16, 2014 at 12:20 AM Major reason why wife has FOID and is getting FCCL. If for any reason she needs to take control/possession of my firearm she's good to go. Plus she IS my BUG!
ScopeEye Posted March 16, 2014 at 03:11 AM Posted March 16, 2014 at 03:11 AM Any gun owners in IL should have their spouse or other family members get FOIDsIn the event of say a death, the remaining family members can legally deal with any firearms
matkinson Posted March 16, 2014 at 01:55 PM Posted March 16, 2014 at 01:55 PM I teach my students to never leave family members holding the bag. If you leave your gun in the car for any reason, anyone who is in your car or might borrow it should have a CCL. If they don't have a CCL, they should have a FOID and the gun should be unloaded. In the case of someone with neither, either they should not be in the car or the gun needs to be somewhere else.
sctman800 Posted March 16, 2014 at 01:59 PM Posted March 16, 2014 at 01:59 PM I allways recommend to everyone if one person in the family is a gun owner with FOID everyone should have a FOID. Jim.
Pete S Posted March 16, 2014 at 02:15 PM Posted March 16, 2014 at 02:15 PM Get her a FOID, or get her to bring the book in, and bring a sammich back.
xd9subcompact Posted March 16, 2014 at 02:56 PM Posted March 16, 2014 at 02:56 PM $10 and 15 minutes of her time, gets 10 years of insulation from possible FOID act violations. SOP in my household - if you are old enough to pick up a gun, you have a FOID card.
john_horstman Posted March 16, 2014 at 09:45 PM Posted March 16, 2014 at 09:45 PM Today I was out shopping with the wife and carrying. I had some overdue books from the town library and decided to drop them off. Knowing this was a GFZ even though not posted, I unholstered and put my gun in the glove box. My wife decided to stay in the car while I was in the library. This is where they legality of what I did comes into play. My wife does not have a FCCL or a FOID and she is sitting in our car with a loaded gun in the glove box. If a weird set of circumstances happened whereby a LEO knocked on her car door while I was inside and asked if there was a firearm in the car, what would happen? 1) Does she have the duty to inform since she is not a permit holder?2) Is she committing a crime by being in a car with a gun even though it is not on her person? I suspect the above scenario will never happen but it did get me to thinking about maybe putting the gun in the trunk instead of the glove box if she decides to stay in the car when I do an errand inside a GFZ. Your thoughts?I, personally, would instruct my wife to assert her right to remain silent and answer the officer's question with, "Hi, officer, I wish to remain silent, please. Thanks!" Of course, any demands for identification shall be immediately obeyed. Done.
aka Posted March 16, 2014 at 10:07 PM Posted March 16, 2014 at 10:07 PM Unless the LEO had a legitimate reason to stop and ask your wife any questions - the whole thing would be thrown out. If your wife is sitting in the car minding her own business - what reason does LEO have to talk to her or ask her any questions. Having said that get your wife a FOID and if possible a FCCL to avoid any hassles. While this sceneroio is very unlikely, there will be cases when you wife may need to take the firearm from you and keep it.
Gamma Posted March 16, 2014 at 11:59 PM Posted March 16, 2014 at 11:59 PM She needs a FOID if you have firearms. Locking container is the easiest solution to put the firearm into "transporation" vs "carry" and avoids the hazard of loading/unloading. She should get CCL if possible.
Drylok Posted March 17, 2014 at 12:06 AM Posted March 17, 2014 at 12:06 AM Lol you guys are killing me. Lets look at the probabilty of having to worry about and then ask ourselves who cares anyway?
AuroraInstructor Posted March 17, 2014 at 12:31 AM Posted March 17, 2014 at 12:31 AM In a shameless bid to be the thread winner, my advice comes in the form of a ququote from the Shawshank Redemption... "Do you trust your wife?" Now don't throw me off a roof!
mbrich Posted March 17, 2014 at 05:56 PM Posted March 17, 2014 at 05:56 PM I think it is pretty simple, as long as she doesn't remove it from the console, She can claim what ever she wants. Officer: Is there a gun in your car?Wife: Not that I'm aware of, why do you ask?Officer: Because the vehicle is registered to a FCCL person and is in a GFZ.Wife: Oh? well, I'm not a FCCL holder. Why would we take a gun to the Library?Officer: May I ask you to step out of the vehicle, and take a look?Wife: No, I'm pretty comfortable right here, and I never allow anyone to search anything without a warrant.Officer: Do you have something to hide?Wife: No sir, I just don't give away my rights. Officer: Thank you, have a pleasant day.
Tip Posted March 17, 2014 at 06:36 PM Posted March 17, 2014 at 06:36 PM Does sitting in a parked car in a parking lot constitute loitering?
DiSc0rd Posted March 17, 2014 at 08:34 PM Posted March 17, 2014 at 08:34 PM If a weird set of circumstances happened whereby a LEO knocked on her car door while I was inside and asked if there was a firearm in the car, what would happen?This isn't even that weird. Everyone thinks you need something crazy to happen. but what if a teen or any other driver wasn't paying attention and bang, fender bender, just so happened that a cop was around to see it and there you have it. No FOID and the plates will run with your name and it's attached to you CCL and next question out of his mouth is "Did you take the gun in with you? No. Oh, so you left it in the car with her? Can I see your FOID ma'am? You don't have one?"This is not a crazy scenario at all. Get her a FOID, fill it out for her take her picture get it cropped and mail it off.
mbrich Posted March 17, 2014 at 09:03 PM Posted March 17, 2014 at 09:03 PM If a weird set of circumstances happened whereby a LEO knocked on her car door while I was inside and asked if there was a firearm in the car, what would happen?This isn't even that weird. Everyone thinks you need something crazy to happen. but what if a teen or any other driver wasn't paying attention and bang, fender bender, just so happened that a cop was around to see it and there you have it. No FOID and the plates will run with your name and it's attached to you CCL and next question out of his mouth is "Did you take the gun in with you? No. Oh, so you left it in the car with her? Can I see your FOID ma'am? You don't have one?"This is not a crazy scenario at all. Get her a FOID, fill it out for her take her picture get it cropped and mail it off. As for a fender bender, you are right, that can happen right out of the blue. I've never had an officer ask me if I have a weapon on me after seeing me dealing politely and calmly with the other driver. Most police officers I have spoken with are of the mentality, The less paperwork the better. However just because you have a FCCL, doesn't mean you have to be either carrying or storing in the car. It could have been left at home just as well. I'm willing to bet, many people will not be carrying 100% of the time (although everyone on here will say they will, I doubt that will be the case at all). I plan on being gun free most days, since I travel via public transportation to and from work every day. I won't be locking it in my vehicle for it to be stolen. Unfortunately, until some rules are changed, I will be a weekend warrior, and an evening carrier. If an officer is wanting to jam you up, he will do it, I wouldn't offer any additional information which could incriminate, or facilitate additional jamming. I would then like to talk to a lawyer. However, I wouldn't mind using the excuse, "um, honey, I forgot I'm carrying, so either I need to take a few minutes to unload and lock this in the trunk, take my keys and your keys so you don't have access, while you sit out here in the hot car, or.... you could just run it in."
DiSc0rd Posted March 17, 2014 at 09:10 PM Posted March 17, 2014 at 09:10 PM If a weird set of circumstances happened whereby a LEO knocked on her car door while I was inside and asked if there was a firearm in the car, what would happen?This isn't even that weird. Everyone thinks you need something crazy to happen. but what if a teen or any other driver wasn't paying attention and bang, fender bender, just so happened that a cop was around to see it and there you have it. No FOID and the plates will run with your name and it's attached to you CCL and next question out of his mouth is "Did you take the gun in with you? No. Oh, so you left it in the car with her? Can I see your FOID ma'am? You don't have one?"This is not a crazy scenario at all. Get her a FOID, fill it out for her take her picture get it cropped and mail it off. As for a fender bender, you are right, that can happen right out of the blue. I've never had an officer ask me if I have a weapon on me after seeing me dealing politely and calmly with the other driver. Most police officers I have spoken with are of the mentality, The less paperwork the better. However just because you have a FCCL, doesn't mean you have to be either carrying or storing in the car. It could have been left at home just as well. I'm willing to bet, many people will not be carrying 100% of the time (although everyone on here will say they will, I doubt that will be the case at all). I plan on being gun free most days, since I travel via public transportation to and from work every day. I won't be locking it in my vehicle for it to be stolen. Unfortunately, until some rules are changed, I will be a weekend warrior, and an evening carrier. If an officer is wanting to jam you up, he will do it, I wouldn't offer any additional information which could incriminate, or facilitate additional jamming. I would then like to talk to a lawyer. However, I wouldn't mind using the excuse, "um, honey, I forgot I'm carrying, so either I need to take a few minutes to unload and lock this in the trunk, take my keys and your keys so you don't have access, while you sit out here in the hot car, or.... you could just run it in." I am not trying to imply that s/he is trying to pull a fast one on you, but the line of questioning seems standard. there was just an accendent, the plates show the owner has a ccw I'm a cop and i want to know if there is a gun near me. Questions like that are not to trick anyone but gather information.But i also like the excuse to not get out of the car
mbrich Posted March 17, 2014 at 09:12 PM Posted March 17, 2014 at 09:12 PM Does sitting in a parked car in a parking lot constitute loitering? Loitering: stand or wait around idly or without apparent purpose. Maybe, but what else is a parking lot for, other than to park your car? What else are you supposed to do with it once it's been accomplished? I guess just sit there...and wait around idly with no apparent purpose.
mbrich Posted March 17, 2014 at 09:24 PM Posted March 17, 2014 at 09:24 PM But i also like the excuse to not get out of the car If getting out of the car isn't a demand, why go along? Most people go along with it because they don't realize that they have a choice. There is usually a noticeable difference between a question and a demand. Most police demands end with exclamation points, and have a tendency to use foul language in the process. They also tend to allow for a search because they don't realize that the officer needs a warrant, or very strong probable cause. FCCL doesn't give probable cause. As soon as you step out, the next question will be, do you have any weapons on you? They will ask again to search your vehicle and person. Why give them that, even if you have nothing to hide. Not every police officer is on the straight and narrow. I know a majority are very honest people, but I do know a few crooks and you hear about them in the news when things go wrong. But even if I'm sitting there with an FCCL, no weapon, and he asks to search because he doesn't believe me, I won't consent without a warrant. I'm also a big fan of the phrase, "sure officer, I will gladly answer your questions and concerns, right after I consult with my attorney."
DiSc0rd Posted March 17, 2014 at 09:36 PM Posted March 17, 2014 at 09:36 PM However, I wouldn't mind using the excuse, "um, honey, I forgot I'm carrying, so either I need to take a few minutes to unload and lock this in the trunk, take my keys and your keys so you don't have access, while you sit out here in the hot car, or.... you could just run it in." That was a well thought out and great reply but i just meant the part about being lazy and making my wife take the books in
mbrich Posted March 17, 2014 at 09:50 PM Posted March 17, 2014 at 09:50 PM However, I wouldn't mind using the excuse, "um, honey, I forgot I'm carrying, so either I need to take a few minutes to unload and lock this in the trunk, take my keys and your keys so you don't have access, while you sit out here in the hot car, or.... you could just run it in." That was a well thought out and great reply but i just meant the part about being lazy and making my wife take the books in Yeah, that's even better. My wife knows me too well, and she would volunteer to run it in because she knows that's exactly what I would do, that way she feels like it is her idea not mine and I don't get credit for it.
john_horstman Posted March 19, 2014 at 01:59 AM Posted March 19, 2014 at 01:59 AM I think it is pretty simple, as long as she doesn't remove it from the console, She can claim what ever she wants. Officer: Is there a gun in your car?Wife: Not that I'm aware of, why do you ask?Officer: Because the vehicle is registered to a FCCL person and is in a GFZ.Wife: Oh? well, I'm not a FCCL holder. Why would we take a gun to the Library?Officer: May I ask you to step out of the vehicle, and take a look?Wife: No, I'm pretty comfortable right here, and I never allow anyone to search anything without a warrant.Officer: Do you have something to hide?Wife: No sir, I just don't give away my rights. Officer: Thank you, have a pleasant day.Careful, mbrich. You're implying that the wife lie to the officer, indeed, play him for a fool. Unwise. Most disrespectful, and could backfire in her face.
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