Out of state applicants

[domin8]

What state do you live in again?

I live in Illinois, but as an active duty military member I have maintained my residency in Pennsylvania throughout my career (10 moves in 24+ years).

My wife's job in the Navy had us moving every 3 years. She's a pediatric RN. My neighbor, a JAG attorney, moves every 2 years.

[kwc]

My wife's job in the Navy had us moving every 3 years. She's a pediatric RN. My neighbor, a JAG attorney, moves every 2 years.

The challenges of frequent moves are just as significant, and perhaps more so, for spouses of active military. Thank you for the contributions and sacrifices you have made in support of our great nation.

[domin8]

I've been on both sides of it. What I have to say should not reflect an attitude that diminishes your sacrifices. Serving our country is not an easy task by any measure. Thank you for your service and sacrifice.

 

Being the spouse is definitely way more difficult than being the service member. I would gladly trade places with my wife. I am a Marine Infantryman veteran.

 

Edited January 4, 2014 at 03:44 PM by domin8

[kwc]

I've been on both sides of it. What I have to say should not reflect an attitude that diminishes your sacrifices. Serving our country is not an easy task by any measure. Thank you for your service and sacrifice.

 

Being the spouse is definitely way more difficult than being the service member. I would gladly trade places with my wife. I am a Marine Infantryman veteran.

 

To hear an Infantryman veteran say being a spouse is more difficult carries a tremendous amount of credibility. I believe and agree with you, and know how tough it is for my civilian spouse and our children.

 

If only states like Illinois would recognize these challenges and give both of us a break on things such as issuance of a CCL!

[AlphaKoncepts aka CGS]

Where can I find the approved list of states?

[kwc]

Where can I find the approved list of states?

It is posted on the ccl4illinois.com site. Look at the "Checklist prior to applying" link and scroll down to the non-resident section.

 

Hawaii is the only approved state at present. This list will probably grow, but it is anybody's guess how many or which states will eventually be added.

Edited January 4, 2014 at 07:31 PM by kwc

[Riverpilot]

Where can I find the approved list of states?

It is posted on the ccl4illinois.com site. Look at the "Checklist prior to applying" link and scroll down to the non-resident section.

 

Hawaii is the only approved state at present. This list will probably grow, but it is anybody's guess how many or which states will eventually be added.

 

I also found out the other day, if you click the "apply" or the "sign in" button, it takes you to the next page. Without actually signing in, just scroll down and it lists the same information.

 

I'm hoping that next week there will be more approved states, but... lol.. :crosses fingers:

[domin8]

The page after the TCN info in the app also addresses this issue and won't let you move past it.

[Riverpilot]

Anyone from out of state able to complete the process?

 

Congratulations to all of Illinois!

[AlphaKoncepts aka CGS]

Where can I find the approved list of states?

It is posted on the ccl4illinois.com site. Look at the "Checklist prior to applying" link and scroll down to the non-resident section.

 

Hawaii is the only approved state at present. This list will probably grow, but it is anybody's guess how many or which states will eventually be added.

That was the first thing I did before posting, and I didn't see anything. Thanks I will check again.

 

 

ETA: Jebus Cripes, there it is plain as day. How did I miss it?

Edited January 5, 2014 at 12:29 PM by cgs

[Riverpilot]

Where can I find the approved list of states?

It is posted on the ccl4illinois.com site. Look at the "Checklist prior to applying" link and scroll down to the non-resident section.

 

Hawaii is the only approved state at present. This list will probably grow, but it is anybody's guess how many or which states will eventually be added.

That was the first thing I did before posting, and I didn't see anything. Thanks I will check again.

 

 

ETA: Jebus Cripes, there it is plain as day. How did I miss it?

 

Lol.. no worries. There are other people stating, that particular section isn't showing up for them at all. So I don't know if it's their browser settings, or .. ? lol

 

Now..... Approve out-of-state residents for an Illinois CCL!

[Drylok]

Todd are you guys filing suit over this? Everone knows they did this on purpose with malicous intent.

[Riverpilot]

Todd are you guys filing suit over this? Everone knows they did this on purpose with malicous intent.

 

I really hope it doesn't need to come to that. You would think Illinois would WANT over $300 per non-resident in fees. :shrugs: Perhaps Illinois is doing better financially than what I thought.

 

Hopefully we'll see more states added next week, if not by the end of this month.

[domin8]

Todd are you guys filing suit over this? Everone knows they did this on purpose with malicous intent.

I'm a bit concerned about Todd's and Molly's silence. It's a bit unsettling. I'm stuck here for at least 18 more months, with a very good chance that will be extended to 4 1/2 years. Obviously my life means less to Illinois because I'm not a resident. Edited January 6, 2014 at 02:04 AM by domin8

[Riverpilot]

Todd are you guys filing suit over this? Everone knows they did this on purpose with malicous intent.

I'm a bit concerned about Todd's and Molly's silence. It's a bit unsettling. I'm stuck here for at least 18 more months, with a very good chance that will be extended to 4 1/2 years. Obviously my life means less to Illinois because I'm not a resident.

 

I'm sure Todd, at the very least, is up to his eyes in getting e-mails from people with problems applying in-state.

I know they're both aware of out-of-state residents not being able to apply. I am also pretty positive they are looking into it. If other states aren't added by the end of this month, or even if they are, I would think there will be attempts with new bills to change the law.

 

I also will presume there will be a few law suits filed soon.

 

Again, I go back to wondering why Illinois doesn't want the $300+ fee from non-residents. :shrugs:

At this point in time, I personally would like either 1) non-residents be able to apply for the CCL or 2) other states permits recognized.

[domin8]

Even if all Todd or Molly did was come in here and say, "We're working on it." and left it at that it would help.

[Riverpilot]

Even if all Todd or Molly did was come in here and say, "We're working on it." and left it at that it would help.

 

To be fair, Molly/Val and I have PM'd back and forth. She did state that Todd and other various persons are aware of it. Now, what they're doing, if anything, I really don't know.

[domin8]

That's good to hear. I did send Molly a PM almost a week ago with a question I had. She said she find out. I understand she's busy. That's why I'm trying to be very patient in waiting for her response.

[Riverpilot]

That's good to hear. I did send Molly a PM almost a week ago with a question I had. She said she find out. I understand she's busy. That's why I'm trying to be very patient in waiting for her response.

 

Patience is something I always need to work on. lol Especially when it comes to something I want to buy, like a new pistol, computer, et al.. lol

 

I certainly hope everyone made it safely through the brutal cold.

 

Now... Illinois! Release the other states as hostages!

[Riverpilot]

Just updated the first post. As of 1/8/14 Hawaii is STILL the only state where out-of-state residents are able to apply for an Illinois CCL.

[SFC Stu]

Are you all aware of the Shepard case and 7th Court of Appeals case? Illinois would not have any form of Concealed Carry if it were not for their decision and many years of hard work by a lot of people. Thank you all!!

[Riverpilot]

Are you all aware of the Shepard case and 7th Court of Appeals case? Illinois would not have any form of Concealed Carry if it were not for their decision and many years of hard work by a lot of people. Thank you all!!

 

Very aware of the case, and I have thanked, and will thank again all those who worked to get Illinois residents a way to protect themselves outside their homes.

 

Those of us in this thread are informing those out-of-state they cannot apply for an Illinois CCL unless they are from Hawaii.

 

Also, those out-of-state instructors. Even if Illinois states a CCL is not needed for instructors, unless they're instructing Illinois or Hawaii residents, there's not much point in running Illinois only classes.

[Gamma]

At this point in time, I personally would like either 1) non-residents be able to apply for the CCL or 2) other states permits recognized.

Anything other than carry (somehow) available to all Americans is unacceptable. Constitutionally I don't see how they can deny permit issue to anyone who meets the training and background check requirements. If they choose to accept some other permits, that's convenient also. Ideally they'd follow along with most of our neighbors, 14 states at the moment and simply recognize all permits for non-residents.

 

 

Those of us in this thread are informing those out-of-state they cannot apply for an Illinois CCL unless they are from Hawaii.

Even Hawaii residents can't apply because they also have to have a Hawaii resident carry permit, and Hawaii has never issued a carry permit to a private citizen. Only security guards or other professional users have ever been granted carry.

 

As I mentioned before, ISP seems to be applying an extreme standard of scrutiny for reciprocity, but instead applying that standard to a requirement to be able to even apply for an IL permit. It makes no sense other than as a bogus rationale to simply deny issue to all non residents.

Edited January 8, 2014 at 07:04 PM by Gamma

[domin8]

Are you all aware of the Shepard case and 7th Court of Appeals case? Illinois would not have any form of Concealed Carry if it were not for their decision and many years of hard work by a lot of people. Thank you all!!

I'm very well aware of it. Wasn't that ruling meant to be applicable to all people in Illinois, and not just residents? This may be a shock to some of you, but there are nonresidents lawfully living among you. I find it funny that in October I was blasted on here for "trying to get a carve out for military personnel from Highland Park's AWB," because it didn't include Illinois residents. That was not true, nor the case, and sadly those involved didn't speak up when all that happened. None of those same people that blasted me are here saying, "What about the nonresident exclusion?" Seems to me the residents got their "carve out" and have moved on. How funny that I got blasted and they aren't (until now). This is not how you make and keep allies IC.

 

:flamesuit_on:

Edited January 8, 2014 at 07:51 PM by domin8

[borgranta]

If the only requirement that was needed was that the applicant possessed a carry permit from their home state than Hawaii residents would still have a case to challenge the law as written claiming that it creates three classes of citizens non-residents without a carry permit from their home state aka Hawaiians among others which prevents them from being able to acquire an FCCL license. non-residents with home state carry permit which enables them to acquire an FCCL. and Residents of ILLINOIS that are free to acquire an FCCL.

[domin8]

How many states that allow nonresidents to obtain permits require the nonresident to have a permit from their home state? Although I agree with what you're saying, I feel we need to know this info before having a real conversation on it, because it's not just a permit issue it's a "May Issue" issue. Imo, the biggest deal is the "substantially similar" clause. Edited January 8, 2014 at 08:11 PM by domin8

[Broadhead]

the law seems clear.

 

...substantially similar...

I agree that the text of the law is clear. However recognizing only Hawaii (so far) is not remotely logical. Iliinois has a shall-issue law while Hawaii is may-issue. Any state that is shall-issue is substantially more similar to Illinois than any may-issue state.

 

Having relatives in IL and MI, I am keenly interested in acquiring an IL nonrez permit.

[Riverpilot]

How many states that allow nonresidents to obtain permits require the nonresident to have a permit from their home state? Although I agree with what you're saying, I feel we need to know this info before having a real conversation on it, because it's not just a permit issue it's a "May Issue" issue. Imo, the biggest deal is the "substantially similar" clause.

 

Considering I only have an Iowa, Arizona and Utah permit... Utah requires a copy. I'm sure the fine folks over at handgunlaw would know the answer.

[kwc]

Yes, everything hinges around the definition of "substantially similar." I posted this definition from the proposed admin rules in another thread:

 

 

-----

"Substantially Similar" means the comparable state regulates who may carry firearms, concealed or otherwise, in public; prohibits all who have mental health admissions, voluntary or involuntary, within the past 5 years or greater from carrying firearms, concealed or otherwise, in public; reports denied persons to NICS; and participates in reporting persons authorized to carry firearms, concealed or otherwise, in public through NLETs.

-----

 

You can break these requirements apart and explore the non-resident state's role in mental health admissions, NICS reporting, and NLET reporting if you wish.

 

Note that training requirements are not mentioned.

 

I believe there will be other states, including "shall issue" states, eventually added to the list along with Hawaii. But I also think any state that allows open carry without a permit/license will be immediately excluded since that doesn't meet the first requirement ("... or otherwise")

 

As a PA resident living full-time in Illinois that'll be a non-starter for me.

 

[Gamma]

How many states that allow nonresidents to obtain permits require the nonresident to have a permit from their home state? Although I agree with what you're saying, I feel we need to know this info before having a real conversation on it, because it's not just a permit issue it's a "May Issue" issue. Imo, the biggest deal is the "substantially similar" clause.

How many other states are under federal court order to allow concealed carry as a fundamental right? "Other states" have been treating carry as a regulated privilege.

 

The substantially similar clause as applied is obviously unreasonable and should be found unconstitutional if not eliminated by the legislature.

Edited January 8, 2014 at 09:19 PM by Gamma