ICPGV pushing ban on private sales

[Thirdpower]

SB3632, by our good buddy Kotowski, is being pushed by our local Joyce puppet group.

 

"Take Action: Help Close the Private Sale Loophole

 

Ask your Senator to co-sponsor SB 3632 today.

 

Right now in Illinois, anyone - including gang members, people with severe mental illness, and domestic violence offenders - can buy a gun from a private seller with no questions asked.

 

Senator Kotowski has introduced legislation to close this dangerous loophole and prevent guns from getting into the wrong hands. Now he needs your help to add co-sponsors to the bill. Please take the time to contact your Senator and urge them to co-sponsor SB 3632.

 

Click here to email your Senator and ask them to co-sponsor SB 3632."

[GarandFan]

Now that the "gun show loophole" is closed in Illinois, they are moving to close the "private sale loophole."

 

Of course, if they close that, they will move to close the "gun sale loophole."

 

Ah well ... we know about these folks and their ways.

 

And we know what to do about it.

[Black Flag]

Now that the "gun show loophole" is closed in Illinois, they are moving to close the "private sale loophole."

 

Of course, if they close that, they will move to close the "gun sale loophole."

 

Ah well ... we know about these folks and their ways.

 

And we know what to do about it.

There's always the "gun possession loophole".

[GarandFan]

Is there yet a companion bill in the house?

 

Wasn't there one last year that could potentially be resurrected from Rules (like the "dealer licensing" bill)?

 

ETA ... nevermind. That was HB48, killed by a very close floor vote last year.

[Lou]

Is there yet a companion bill in the house?

 

Wasn't there one last year that could potentially be resurrected from Rules (like the "dealer licensing" bill)?

 

ETA ... nevermind. That was HB48, killed by a very close floor vote last year.

 

 

I don't know what Katowski is up to but he filed two identical bills on the same day. SB3632 and SB3709. As far as I can tell there is no difference other than the bill number.

He's up to something! We need to watch this SAD very closely.

[45superman]

Is there yet a companion bill in the house?

 

Yeah--Osterman introduced HB 5480 last week.

 

Synopsis As Introduced

Amends the Firearm Owners Identification Card Act. Provides that a person who is not a federally licensed importer, manufacturer, or dealer and who desires to sell or transfer a firearm of a size that may be concealed upon the person to another person, who is not a federally licensed importer, manufacturer, or dealer, shall do so only at the place of business of a federally licensed firearm dealer. Provides that the federally licensed firearm dealer shall conduct a background check on the prospective recipient of the firearm and follow all other applicable federal, State, and local laws as if he or she were the seller of the firearm. Provides that the purchaser or transferee may be required by the federally licensed firearm dealer to pay a fee not to exceed $10 per firearm, plus other authorized fees. Makes exceptions for (i) the transfer of a firearm between spouses, a parent and child, or other family members, (ii) transfers by persons acting pursuant to operation of law or a court order, or (iii) transfers on the grounds of a gun show.

Note the last "exemption," which the ICPGV seems to tout as some kind of compromise:

 

Transfers at gun shows are also exempt, as they are already subject to background checks pursuant to state law.

That "exemption" is meaningless, unless it's supposed to prevent a requirement for two background checks for each handgun sale at gun shows.

 

Hey--just noticed this (my emphasis added):

 

By requiring those who privately sell or transfer concealable firearms, including handguns . . .

I've mentioned before that the "Handgun Dealer Licensing Act" bills get kinda vague on definitions, with "handgun dealer" defined as someone who sells "concealable firearms," without details about how "concealable" is to be defined. As I've said before:

 

Wearing a big enough trench coat, someone can conceal just about any firearm he can carry. For that matter, back in my paratrooper days as a howitzer crew member, we always erected a big camouflage net to "conceal" the 105mm howitzer. That means that, depending on how fast and loose the courts allow the state to play with the definitions, all gun shops--even those who don't sell handguns--can be forced out of business.

Even I had to wonder if I was being a bit paranoid with that kind of thinking, but ICPGV's wording makes me think I was perhaps onto something (keep in mind that short-barreled shotguns and short-barreled rifles are banned in IL, even for those willing and able to jump through the federal NFA hoops, so those aren't the other "concealable firearms" being referred to here).

[Silver Guardian]

Hey--just noticed this (my emphasis added):

 

By requiring those who privately sell or transfer concealable firearms, including handguns . . .

I've mentioned before that the "Handgun Dealer Licensing Act" bills get kinda vague on definitions, with "handgun dealer" defined as someone who sells "concealable firearms," without details about how "concealable" is to be defined. As I've said before:

 

Wearing a big enough trench coat, someone can conceal just about any firearm he can carry. For that matter, back in my paratrooper days as a howitzer crew member, we always erected a big camouflage net to "conceal" the 105mm howitzer. That means that, depending on how fast and loose the courts allow the state to play with the definitions, all gun shops--even those who don't sell handguns--can be forced out of business.

Even I had to wonder if I was being a bit paranoid with that kind of thinking, but ICPGV's wording makes me think I was perhaps onto something.

 

It's not paranoia when they are out to get you.

[GarandFan]

We need to watch this SAD very closely.

 

Absolutamente!

 

I think folks like Kotowski are freaking. Look what's going on (just off the top of my head)...

 

McDonald v Chicago

National Parks ban repeal effective 22 Feb

Guns in Starbucks

Firearms freedom acts

VA moving to repeal 1 gun per month

AZ and WY moving to repeal license requirement to carry

Indiana moving pro-carry bills

MS repealing ban in state parks

OK moving to further protect 2A rights

Gun free zones in universities being challenged

King county (Seattle) court killing ban on guns in parks

Etc ...

 

ETA ... What the hey!!!? The ICHV is sort of touting this "private sale loophole" bill as some sort of "equal protection" for all kind of thing. Those people are out of their fricking minds.

[anonymous too]

Right now in Illinois, anyone - including gang members, people with severe mental illness, and domestic violence offenders - can buy a gun from a private seller with no questions asked.

 

Liar!!!

 

Private sales can only be conducted in state by and to IL residents. Must ask for a valid FOID.

[papa]

SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[abolt243]

We need to watch this SAD very closely.

 

Absolutamente!

 

I think folks like Kotowski are freaking. Look what's going on (just off the top of my head)...

 

McDonald v Chicago

National Parks ban repeal effective 22 Feb

Guns in Starbucks

Firearms freedom acts

VA moving to repeal 1 gun per month

AZ and WY moving to repeal license requirement to carry

Indiana moving pro-carry bills

MS repealing ban in state parks

OK moving to further protect 2A rights

Gun free zones in universities being challenged

King county (Seattle) court killing ban on guns in parks

Etc ...

 

ETA ... What the hey!!!? The ICHV is sort of touting this "private sale loophole" bill as some sort of "equal protection" for all kind of thing. Those people are out of their fricking minds.

 

You can probably add to the list several small, local issues that never made the 6:00 o'clock news. One example, Festus MO city park last summer had signs banning carry of weapons in the park according to a city ordinance. Local activists contacted others in the state. Through contact with the state AG, and a letter from that office to the city, the signs were removed, the ordinance was changed and now Festus citizens can feel safer knowing that they can have the tools necessary to defend their families and themselves while in the city park.

 

Thread showing progression of action by grass roots activists

Letter from AG to Festus

 

The national and state issues are terribly important. But, it's these small, local issues that grassroots action corrects that make me think the tide is turning throughout this land!

 

Tim

[Drylok]

We need to watch this SAD very closely.

 

Absolutamente!

 

I think folks like Kotowski are freaking. Look what's going on (just off the top of my head)...

 

McDonald v Chicago

National Parks ban repeal effective 22 Feb

Guns in Starbucks

Firearms freedom acts

VA moving to repeal 1 gun per month

AZ and WY moving to repeal license requirement to carry

Indiana moving pro-carry bills

MS repealing ban in state parks

OK moving to further protect 2A rights

Gun free zones in universities being challenged

King county (Seattle) court killing ban on guns in parks

Etc ...

 

ETA ... What the hey!!!? The ICHV is sort of touting this "private sale loophole" bill as some sort of "equal protection" for all kind of thing. Those people are out of their fricking minds.

 

You can probably add to the list several small, local issues that never made the 6:00 o'clock news. One example, Festus MO city park last summer had signs banning carry of weapons in the park according to a city ordinance. Local activists contacted others in the state. Through contact with the state AG, and a letter from that office to the city, the signs were removed, the ordinance was changed and now Festus citizens can feel safer knowing that they can have the tools necessary to defend their families and themselves while in the city park.

 

Thread showing progression of action by grass roots activists

Letter from AG to Festus

 

The national and state issues are terribly important. But, it's these small, local issues that grassroots action corrects that make me think the tide is turning throughout this land!

 

Tim

It's the trickle up affect! That is a good example of Jeffersons quote about "in time and by slow operations" exept in reverse that I spoke of in another thread. I understand that not everything can work this way, but I wish more of it did

This is a great revolution we are having, and not a drop of blood is having to be shed!

[moparcardave]

Do these guys wear girls panties with "I am scared of firearms" printed on them? I mean it is not the legal firearm owner that they have to worry about. They can pass all these bills they want along with huge penalities for firearm useage and will it stop one criminal from doing it???

 

I wish they would just come out and say their real agenda and not beat around the bush. They simply in 3 words "ban all firearms." Well that is except for those that are used by their bodyguards, by themselves for protection and for the whomever they say should have firearms to keep the citiizenry at bag. Lastly the criminal, do you think they will walk in and say I want to sell this to my buddy here, look him up make the transfer legal?

[anonymous too]

Do these guys wear girls panties with "I am scared of firearms" printed on them?

 

Basically yes. Kotowski has been a victim. Held up on an L train or platform if I remember correctly. He knows first hand how he is incabable of defending himself. It's not a fear of firearms. It's that they are incabable of any type of self-reliance.

 

Eggheads and bedwetters

 

The psychological argument is since these people are incapable of any type of self-reliance we should be deprived of the ability so they don't feel inferior. In their minds we should be made to feel as inferior and defenseless as they are.

[Lou]

Legislators need to ask themselves two questions:

1) Will criminals obey this new law? [of course not, that's why they're called criminals]

2) How will punishing law abiding people by passing this bill make us safer? [it won't]

[kermit315]

forgive me, but I havent been to an Illinois gun show in years. Somebody made mention of closing the "gun show loophole" as if it had happened in Illinois. Is this the case? What are the current gun show rules for Illinois?

[abolt243]

forgive me, but I havent been to an Illinois gun show in years. Somebody made mention of closing the "gun show loophole" as if it had happened in Illinois. Is this the case? What are the current gun show rules for Illinois?

 

Probably some fine nuances that I'll miss, but basically this: Any sale of a firearm on the GROUNDS of a gun show MUST have a background check id number attached. That includes parking lot sales between individuals. There is usually a separate booth set up where individuals can go have an FFL run a BG check prior to a private sale. The charge runs from $10 - $25 or so.

 

Of course, any FFL's at the show will run their own BG checks on sales to customers, just like they would anyway, whether they were in their store, on the gun show grounds or standing in their own driveway!!

 

I'm sure I'll be corrected if I'm mistaken.

 

AB

[THE KING]

forgive me, but I havent been to an Illinois gun show in years. Somebody made mention of closing the "gun show loophole" as if it had happened in Illinois. Is this the case? What are the current gun show rules for Illinois?

 

Probably some fine nuances that I'll miss, but basically this: Any sale of a firearm on the GROUNDS of a gun show MUST have a background check id number attached. That includes parking lot sales between individuals. There is usually a separate booth set up where individuals can go have an FFL run a BG check prior to a private sale. The charge runs from $10 - $25 or so.

 

Of course, any FFL's at the show will run their own BG checks on sales to customers, just like they would anyway, whether they were in their store, on the gun show grounds or standing in their own driveway!!

 

I'm sure I'll be corrected if I'm mistaken.

 

AB

 

You are correct my friend.

 

In addition to what Abolt has said, the person to person or PRIVATE SALE has requirements. As the seller you must verify the buyer has a current FOID, you must have a bill of sale, and you MUST comply with the 24 hour or 72 hour waiting period before the purchaser can take possession of the firearm.

 

So, in essence, THERE IS NO GUNSHOW LOOPHOLE. The anti's think there is and they try and make everyone else believe that by not telling the WHOLE truth.

also requires two

[Buzzard]

Legislators need to ask themselves two questions:

1) Will criminals obey this new law? [of course not, that's why they're called criminals]

2) How will punishing law abiding people by passing this bill make us safer? [it won't]

I would simply ask the question, Why pass laws calling for prison time, if judges impose probation, and the corrections department releases criminals after they serve a few weeks? We have to start calling upon people to look at the big picture. We pass stricter laws, and increase penalties only to release criminals early to ease prison overcrowding while trying to sell state prison facilities. This is how the democrats have been running this state.

 

The state of Illinois is broken. The democrats broke it. The fix is simple. Throw out the democrats.

[Xwing]

Right now in Illinois, anyone - including gang members, people with severe mental illness, and domestic violence offenders - can buy a gun from a private seller with no questions asked.

 

 

They just can't ever tell the truth! Felons, people with mental illness, and domestic violence offenders cannot have a legal FOID card, and are specifically prohibited from possessing firearms. It's already illegal. But these liars won't admit as much!