blck10th Posted February 17, 2018 at 08:33 PM Share Posted February 17, 2018 at 08:33 PM So today I was driving around with my son and he says hey Dad look at the ambulance. It had the proper sticker on the side door and the back doors. To be honest I don’t really look at ambulances but never thought about one because well I don’t (shrug) Anyone else ever see this? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mic6010 Posted February 17, 2018 at 09:15 PM Share Posted February 17, 2018 at 09:15 PM No, can't say I have ever seen one posted. But its common knowledge that they will disarm you in the ambulance for their safety, and if they forget to do it the hospital will, and if the hospital forgets to do it they are morons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blck10th Posted February 17, 2018 at 09:16 PM Author Share Posted February 17, 2018 at 09:16 PM I know they would or the hospital would. I just hadn’t seen one posted. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmart Posted February 17, 2018 at 09:38 PM Share Posted February 17, 2018 at 09:38 PM They're often posted up on the North Shore.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lee n. field Posted February 17, 2018 at 10:29 PM Share Posted February 17, 2018 at 10:29 PM No, can't say I have ever seen one posted. But its common knowledge that they will disarm you in the ambulance for their safety, and if they forget to do it the hospital will, and if the hospital forgets to do it they are morons. Per my brother the nurse, they do have protocol for securing emergency patient weapons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Windermere Posted February 18, 2018 at 02:12 AM Share Posted February 18, 2018 at 02:12 AM They’re posted up by me. North shore area Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spec5 Posted February 18, 2018 at 05:12 AM Share Posted February 18, 2018 at 05:12 AM Sort of funny if you think about it. If you’re on a stretcher you enter the ambulance backwards and you’re not able to read anything except something posted on the ceiling. For a patient it’s not conspicuously posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lead thrower Posted February 18, 2018 at 05:25 PM Share Posted February 18, 2018 at 05:25 PM Yes ambulances are posted. Yes we do disarm All pts in our ambulances. Even LEO's are disarmed prior to them being transported to the hospital. There are protocols for transporting firearms to the hospital if we have no way of seacuring the firearm prior to taking the pt to the hospital. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borgranta Posted February 22, 2018 at 03:48 PM Share Posted February 22, 2018 at 03:48 PM Paramedics and EMTs are government employees like LEOs are so it would constitute entrapment if charged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmyers Posted February 22, 2018 at 03:52 PM Share Posted February 22, 2018 at 03:52 PM Paramedics and EMTs are government employees like LEOs are so it would constitute entrapment if charged. You are incorrect about being government employees. The are licensed by the state, but doesn't mean you are employed by the state/government body. Trust me, if I was, I would have a much nicer pension, but we were privately owned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmyers Posted February 22, 2018 at 03:53 PM Share Posted February 22, 2018 at 03:53 PM None of the ambulances are posted around here. Yes, we have had a protocol for dealing with firearms long before we had conceal carry in the state. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmart Posted February 23, 2018 at 01:09 AM Share Posted February 23, 2018 at 01:09 AM Paramedics and EMTs are government employees like LEOs are so it would constitute entrapment if charged. Wut!?Entrapment if charged for what? Paramedics, regardless of their employer do not have any law enforcement powers. Therefore they cannot 'entrap'. At my department the policy is that we will not let any firearms onto our ambulances. We request the carrier to leave the firearm at home if at home, to lock it in their vehicle if they're at work, or to allow one of our PD to take custody of it until they are released from the hospital. They just have to go to the PD to claim it. IF they're in legal possession. The fourth choice is to not avail themselves of our services. Once they get to the hospital, if they're carrying then they're in violation of the Criminal Protection Zone statute. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chislinger Posted February 23, 2018 at 02:48 AM Share Posted February 23, 2018 at 02:48 AM An ambulance isn't real property, how can it be legally posted? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borgranta Posted February 23, 2018 at 04:10 AM Share Posted February 23, 2018 at 04:10 AM Paramedics and EMTs are government employees like LEOs are so it would constitute entrapment if charged. Wut!?Entrapment if charged for what? Paramedics, regardless of their employer do not have any law enforcement powers. Therefore they cannot 'entrap'. At my department the policy is that we will not let any firearms onto our ambulances. We request the carrier to leave the firearm at home if at home, to lock it in their vehicle if they're at work, or to allow one of our PD to take custody of it until they are released from the hospital. They just have to go to the PD to claim it. IF they're in legal possession. The fourth choice is to not avail themselves of our services. Once they get to the hospital, if they're carrying then they're in violation of the Criminal Protection Zone statute.What happens if the cops are an hour away and the patient bleeding and is unable to secure it in a vehicle or house? Are you required to let the patient bleed to death waiting for the police to show up. It would be ironic if an off-duty cop with no other cops nearby ended up being a victim of your policy as described by you. Such a policy has the potential of developing animosity if your company lets the wrong person die for being armed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borgranta Posted February 23, 2018 at 04:23 AM Share Posted February 23, 2018 at 04:23 AM Paramedics and EMTs are government employees like LEOs are so it would constitute entrapment if charged. Wut!?Entrapment if charged for what? Paramedics, regardless of their employer do not have any law enforcement powers. Therefore they cannot 'entrap'. At my department the policy is that we will not let any firearms onto our ambulances. We request the carrier to leave the firearm at home if at home, to lock it in their vehicle if they're at work, or to allow one of our PD to take custody of it until they are released from the hospital. They just have to go to the PD to claim it. IF they're in legal possession. The fourth choice is to not avail themselves of our services. Once they get to the hospital, if they're carrying then they're in violation of the Criminal Protection Zone statute.How is an unconscious person capable of refusing your service? Are you required to delay treatment of an unconscious person until the police show up? Would you be forced to resort to abandoning the firearm in the street or on the sidewalk if the wait for a cop would be too long? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmart Posted February 23, 2018 at 04:24 AM Share Posted February 23, 2018 at 04:24 AM Paramedics and EMTs are government employees like LEOs are so it would constitute entrapment if charged. Wut!?Entrapment if charged for what? Paramedics, regardless of their employer do not have any law enforcement powers. Therefore they cannot 'entrap'. At my department the policy is that we will not let any firearms onto our ambulances. We request the carrier to leave the firearm at home if at home, to lock it in their vehicle if they're at work, or to allow one of our PD to take custody of it until they are released from the hospital. They just have to go to the PD to claim it. IF they're in legal possession. The fourth choice is to not avail themselves of our services. Once they get to the hospital, if they're carrying then they're in violation of the Criminal Protection Zone statute.What happens if the cops are an hour away and the patient bleeding and is unable to secure it in a vehicle or house? Are you required to let the patient bleed to death waiting for the police to show up. It would be ironic if an off-duty cop with no other cops nearby ended up being a victim of your policy as described by you. Such a policy has the potential of developing animosity if your company lets the wrong person die for being armed. Well, you're talking Policy vs practice. In the scenario you mention I know I would offer to take custody of that firearm for the patient and wait until the police arrive. If they refuse to allow that option I guess I'd have to treat them until the police arrive or the patient passes out. Once they pass out it becomes implied consent and now I can do whatever the patient needs me to do. I don't like it but we have restrictions as well. Let's say we transported the person with the gun to the hospital. They still couldn't enter the hospital with the gun so they'd have to relinquish it anyway. We are not permitted by policy to take or accept someone's firearm but we are also not permitted to allow firearms in the ambulances. I think as the officer in charge I'd be willing to defend that decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borgranta Posted February 23, 2018 at 04:35 AM Share Posted February 23, 2018 at 04:35 AM Would an ambulance company be liable for harm if their poorly written firearm policy forced an EMT into abandoning a CCW firearm that belongs to an unconscious patient if the gun were to later discovered at a crime scene? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borgranta Posted February 23, 2018 at 04:44 AM Share Posted February 23, 2018 at 04:44 AM Paramedics and EMTs are government employees like LEOs are so it would constitute entrapment if charged. Wut!?Entrapment if charged for what? Paramedics, regardless of their employer do not have any law enforcement powers. Therefore they cannot 'entrap'. At my department the policy is that we will not let any firearms onto our ambulances. We request the carrier to leave the firearm at home if at home, to lock it in their vehicle if they're at work, or to allow one of our PD to take custody of it until they are released from the hospital. They just have to go to the PD to claim it. IF they're in legal possession. The fourth choice is to not avail themselves of our services. Once they get to the hospital, if they're carrying then they're in violation of the Criminal Protection Zone statute.What happens if the cops are an hour away and the patient bleeding and is unable to secure it in a vehicle or house? Are you required to let the patient bleed to death waiting for the police to show up. It would be ironic if an off-duty cop with no other cops nearby ended up being a victim of your policy as described by you. Such a policy has the potential of developing animosity if your company lets the wrong person die for being armed. Well, you're talking Policy vs practice. In the scenario you mention I know I would offer to take custody of that firearm for the patient and wait until the police arrive.Would the patient get to the hospital faster if they let you take possession of a firearm or would they have to wait until the police arrive since every second counts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmart Posted February 23, 2018 at 04:47 AM Share Posted February 23, 2018 at 04:47 AM Paramedics and EMTs are government employees like LEOs are so it would constitute entrapment if charged. Wut!?Entrapment if charged for what? Paramedics, regardless of their employer do not have any law enforcement powers. Therefore they cannot 'entrap'. At my department the policy is that we will not let any firearms onto our ambulances. We request the carrier to leave the firearm at home if at home, to lock it in their vehicle if they're at work, or to allow one of our PD to take custody of it until they are released from the hospital. They just have to go to the PD to claim it. IF they're in legal possession. The fourth choice is to not avail themselves of our services. Once they get to the hospital, if they're carrying then they're in violation of the Criminal Protection Zone statute.What happens if the cops are an hour away and the patient bleeding and is unable to secure it in a vehicle or house? Are you required to let the patient bleed to death waiting for the police to show up. It would be ironic if an off-duty cop with no other cops nearby ended up being a victim of your policy as described by you. Such a policy has the potential of developing animosity if your company lets the wrong person die for being armed. Well, you're talking Policy vs practice. In the scenario you mention I know I would offer to take custody of that firearm for the patient and wait until the police arrive.Would the patient get to the hospital faster if they let you take possession of a firearm or would they have to wait until the police arrive since every second counts I can't answer for every scenario... My town is fortunate in that PD accompanies us on all runs and for state and county response municipal PD will come out as well fora faster response. Towns in more rural areas may not have that luxury but they also may not have goofy policies either. Paramedics don't have the luxury or the training to be able to discern whether the guy with the gun is a bad guy or not. Plus, we don't want any accidental discharges in our ambulances either. The firearm should be secured, don't you think? Also, not every case is an 'every second counts' case. In most cases a ten-fifteen minute wait for an officer to arrive is not unreasonable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borgranta Posted February 23, 2018 at 05:05 AM Share Posted February 23, 2018 at 05:05 AM In most cases a ten-fifteen minute wait for an officer to arrive is not unreasonable.hopefully no one's death will be attributed to a 15 minute wait especially since some serious diseases may appear to be a minor ailment. I would hate to be the CEO of this ambulance company and having to explain why the policy controbuted to preventable deaths of people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borgranta Posted February 23, 2018 at 05:22 AM Share Posted February 23, 2018 at 05:22 AM Perhaps the state will have to pass a law that will prohibit delaying patient care for excercising a right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borgranta Posted February 23, 2018 at 05:28 AM Share Posted February 23, 2018 at 05:28 AM Excercising a right should not result in delayed patient care and any ambulance company that issues policy that forces patient care to be delayed should either lose their license or revise their policy to remove any delays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borgranta Posted February 23, 2018 at 05:39 AM Share Posted February 23, 2018 at 05:39 AM In most cases a ten-fifteen minute wait for an officer to arrive is not unreasonable.Assuming you are first on scene would an officer that was shot be made to wait 10 or 15 minutes due to the no gun policy of the ambulance company? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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