Tere Dunlap Posted June 13, 2008 at 02:11 AM Posted June 13, 2008 at 02:11 AM I thought it would behoove us to have one location for IllinoisCarry members to alert others about articles in the media that need our comments. I appreciated those who left their notes at my column last week. By popular demand, I guess, a colleague wrote a column in response to my column on the Winnebago County concealed carry law. The editors gave it the title of "The concealed carry myths." http://www.themonroetimes.com/main.asp?Sec...&TM=77708.2 It is not appropriate for me to make a note on his article.... but you can. Read it and if you can make a good argument against it...or for it.... go ahead. Of course, I ask everyone to use words your mother (I hope) would be proud to hear you use. Remember good manners wins good arguments.
Chris Posted June 13, 2008 at 02:17 AM Posted June 13, 2008 at 02:17 AM I would agree with most of it til the end.
Board9 Posted June 13, 2008 at 02:35 AM Posted June 13, 2008 at 02:35 AM Hope you all enjoy my comment to the editorial!!! Thanks Tere for linking us.
Gooch Posted June 13, 2008 at 02:46 AM Posted June 13, 2008 at 02:46 AM Of course, I ask everyone to use words your mother (I hope) would be proud to hear you use. Remember good manners wins good arguments. Thanks Tere, I hope Mr. Gray can better educate himself on this concealed carry issue. Tim
Board9 Posted June 13, 2008 at 03:01 AM Posted June 13, 2008 at 03:01 AM Hello to all....NEWS....Randy Olson will be on Sirrus radio tonight at 10:45 live. Go to www.nra.com and just listen. The audio streaming will be in the upper left. He will make a point that the NRA should come on board ASAP with us which I think they will. Also, anyone here with any clout with the NRA, have them get in touch with us. On another note, PLEASE have any county board chairman or board members contact us so we can send copies of our resolution to them to mirror. This is moving faster then expected and we will have 1 more public forum for input from others that have not yet spoken and we want to pack the house with supporters. We will make this a media event that has yet to be seen. FOX News would be a great asset to our cause if we could get them here. No date set as of yet but the board vote will come sometime late summer. We have time to muster up a big rally so let's get started.....Thanks for everything!!!!!
TTIN Posted June 13, 2008 at 03:19 AM Posted June 13, 2008 at 03:19 AM I left a comment,and asked Mr.Gray to educate himself with the FBI crime statistics.
TTIN Posted June 13, 2008 at 03:23 AM Posted June 13, 2008 at 03:23 AM Hope you all enjoy my comment to the editorial!!! Thanks Tere for linking us. I can't find the comments page.Anyone have a link?
Chris Posted June 13, 2008 at 03:54 AM Posted June 13, 2008 at 03:54 AM Hello to all....NEWS....Randy Olson will be on Sirrus radio tonight at 10:45 live. Go to www.nra.com and just listen. The audio streaming will be in the upper left. He will make a point that the NRA should come on board ASAP with us which I think they will. Also, anyone here with any clout with the NRA, have them get in touch with us. On another note, PLEASE have any county board chairman or board members contact us so we can send copies of our resolution to them to mirror. This is moving faster then expected and we will have 1 more public forum for input from others that have not yet spoken and we want to pack the house with supporters. We will make this a media event that has yet to be seen. FOX News would be a great asset to our cause if we could get them here. No date set as of yet but the board vote will come sometime late summer. We have time to muster up a big rally so let's get started.....Thanks for everything!!!!! Randy did a good job and they read my comment online.
Tere Dunlap Posted June 13, 2008 at 03:17 PM Author Posted June 13, 2008 at 03:17 PM Hope you all enjoy my comment to the editorial!!! Thanks Tere for linking us. I can't find the comments page.Anyone have a link? hmmm -- it should be the same as the article: http://www.themonroetimes.com/main.asp?Sec...amp;TM=40454.13 It may take a while to post comments, the editor reads them all before allowing them in... which is one reason I asked for politeness. Editor is a good guy about differing opinions (http://www.themonroetimes.com/main.asp?Sec...amp;TM=40617.23) ... but a stickler about keeping it calm and clean.
Kaeghl Posted June 13, 2008 at 04:36 PM Posted June 13, 2008 at 04:36 PM commented. I just hope they double check some of my spelling for me.
flagtag Posted June 13, 2008 at 07:23 PM Posted June 13, 2008 at 07:23 PM I, too, left a comment. Also stated my views onthe results of home invasion and auto theft. (Some, not all, of course)
TTIN Posted June 13, 2008 at 08:40 PM Posted June 13, 2008 at 08:40 PM Well,I went back to the article and there the comments were.Don't know what the problem was yesterday.My comment wasn't there,but everyone else pretty much put that dufus in his place. :lips sealed:
Kaeghl Posted June 14, 2008 at 03:04 AM Posted June 14, 2008 at 03:04 AM Well, the paper printed my comment. Longwinded sunufagun, ain't I?
Tere Dunlap Posted June 14, 2008 at 03:53 AM Author Posted June 14, 2008 at 03:53 AM Well, the paper printed my comment. Longwinded sunufagun, ain't I? Wow! Excellent comments, everyone! (I couldn't have said it better, if they had let me). I was VERY surprised no comments came in support of Mr. Gray... (not from people here, of course). My aricle got one person, "Wondering," sassing me about the NRA. Now I'm 'wondering' where that person is! BTW, I got personal "atta girl" from several leaders in the commuity, who did not leave online comments: the County Clerk, two city aldermen, (and someone else I've forgotten now)...oh yeah, and our paper's outdoor sports writer! But I think the city police chief is not happy with me! "snicker" BTW, too Mr. Gray covers "cops and courts" for the paper, so he is around the chief and the sheriff on a daily basis. I believe the types of responses both articles received now will help everyone realize the People's position on the issue! Bravo Illinios. (I'm going to have to start learning to like the way you all drive on Wisconsin 69 and 11-- but I've always let you pass me, and get the speeding tickets.... )
flagtag Posted June 14, 2008 at 04:42 AM Posted June 14, 2008 at 04:42 AM I thought it would behoove us to have one location for IllinoisCarry members to alert others about articles in the media that need our comments. I appreciated those who left their notes at my column last week. By popular demand, I guess, a colleague wrote a column in response to my column on the Winnebago County concealed carry law. The editors gave it the title of "The concealed carry myths." http://www.themonroetimes.com/main.asp?Sec...&TM=77708.2 It is not appropriate for me to make a note on his article.... but you can. Read it and if you can make a good argument against it...or for it.... go ahead. Of course, I ask everyone to use words your mother (I hope) would be proud to hear you use. Remember good manners wins good arguments. Would it be possible for you to provide a link to your letter?
flagtag Posted June 14, 2008 at 08:08 PM Posted June 14, 2008 at 08:08 PM Hello to all....NEWS....Randy Olson will be on Sirrus radio tonight at 10:45 live. Go to www.nra.com and just listen. The audio streaming will be in the upper left. He will make a point that the NRA should come on board ASAP with us which I think they will. Also, anyone here with any clout with the NRA, have them get in touch with us. On another note, PLEASE have any county board chairman or board members contact us so we can send copies of our resolution to them to mirror. This is moving faster then expected and we will have 1 more public forum for input from others that have not yet spoken and we want to pack the house with supporters. We will make this a media event that has yet to be seen. FOX News would be a great asset to our cause if we could get them here. No date set as of yet but the board vote will come sometime late summer. We have time to muster up a big rally so let's get started.....Thanks for everything!!!!! Would it be possible for you to post a link to your resolution so that I can print it out? I e-mailed a story to ABC's 20/20 and they e-mailed me back and asked that I sent them some info by snail-mail with copies of info. (I am not very computer literate, so I can't 'copy/paste') I would also like to give them your site address. It wouldn't hurt to send a list of the others on the board who support the resolution, if possible. Please?! (Anything would help)
Tere Dunlap Posted June 15, 2008 at 03:32 AM Author Posted June 15, 2008 at 03:32 AM I thought it would behoove us to have one location for IllinoisCarry members to alert others about articles in the media that need our comments. I appreciated those who left their notes at my column last week. By popular demand, I guess, a colleague wrote a column in response to my column on the Winnebago County concealed carry law. The editors gave it the title of "The concealed carry myths." http://www.themonroetimes.com/main.asp?Sec...&TM=77708.2 It is not appropriate for me to make a note on his article.... but you can. Read it and if you can make a good argument against it...or for it.... go ahead. Of course, I ask everyone to use words your mother (I hope) would be proud to hear you use. Remember good manners wins good arguments. Would it be possible for you to provide a link to your letter? My editorial was called Carrying the cause in neighboring statehttp://www.themonroetimes.com/SiteImages/Byline/M_7.jpgTere Dunlap(yeah, and that's my "reporter" picture. Doesn't look much like me... but that's ok. It keeps me from being easily recognized on the streets. :Drunk emoticon: ) http://www.themonroetimes.com/main.asp?Sec...amp;TM=84560.63
Molly B. Posted June 15, 2008 at 09:51 PM Posted June 15, 2008 at 09:51 PM This was also posted in the Winnebago Sub-forum but I thought appropriate here for responding like Tere suggested. Please remember to be calm, polite, and enlightening - not rude, disparaging, or denigrating. http://www.beloitdailynews.com/artic...als/edit01.txtEDITORIAL: Concealed carry. Still a bad ideaPosted: Friday, Jun 13, 2008 - 12:54:31 pm CDT More guns on the street can't be the answer.NORMALLY, WE FIND very few reasons to quarrel with longtime Winnebago County Sheriff Dick Meyers. He's a first-class law enforcement leader, and a smart guy with more than his share of common sense. But this week the sheriff came out in favor of citizens carrying concealed weapons, in response to a push among Winnebago County Board members to begin the permitting practice. “I do not have a problem with concealed carry,” Meyers was quoted as saying by the Rockford Register Star. “Twenty years ago, I would have told you different, but we're at a point where we don't have a choice.” WELL, YES, WE DO have a choice. Encouraging people - and that's what a carry law would do - to go around hiding guns on their person is just wrongheaded. Will more hidden guns make anybody safer? We doubt that. Many states have some variation of a carry law. We haven't heard of violent crime being abolished in any of them. Wisconsin's legislature repeatedly has declined to adopt a carry law. We're not aware this state is any more violent than others, and we're pretty sure it's safer than most. Is Winnebago County different? Is the only way to improve public safety the arming of citizens? That doesn't make sense. TO OUR WAY of thinking, there's something depressing about hearing a solid veteran police officer advocate for more hidden guns on the street. It's almost like throwing in the towel. We understand the emotional component. Some argue, for example, the slaughter at Northern Illinois University could have been prevented or minimized if individuals in the hall that day had guns. Perhaps. But such situations, thank God, are rare and unpredictable. Even with a carry provision, who's to say someone in the hall might have been armed and used the weapon effectively? Just as likely, it could have touched off a wild crossfire and hurt more people. Besides, extreme situations make bad arguments for public policy solutions, particularly concealed carry. And, on an everyday basis, locking and loading hardly seems necessary. IF A WILD WEST environment is really a proper alternative, though, how about this: Scrap the idea of concealed carry, in favor of strapping the modern version of a six-shooter on one's hip. If the idea is to send a message to bad guys that the good citizens are ready and able to shoot them down, why hide it? Seem silly? So does concealed carry. What's next? Duels? (Comments block at the bottom of the page) Letters to the Editor:bbarth@beloitdailynews.com
armueller2001 Posted June 16, 2008 at 03:46 AM Posted June 16, 2008 at 03:46 AM Gotta love hearing the same arguments, fueled by "feelings" not facts, that have been heard at every state's push for CCW.
Tere Dunlap Posted June 16, 2008 at 04:01 AM Author Posted June 16, 2008 at 04:01 AM This was also posted in the Winnebago Sub-forum but I thought appropriate here for responding like Tere suggested. Please remember to be calm, polite, and enlightening - not rude, disparaging, or denigrating. http://www.beloitdailynews.com/artic...als/edit01.txtEDITORIAL: Concealed carry. Still a bad ideaPosted: Friday, Jun 13, 2008 - 12:54:31 pm CDT Thanks, Molly. Since this was in 'Wish'consin, I felt obligated to leave a comment... (in a bit of incongnito, I'm sorry to say... "South Dakota grown") I'll post here what I wrote(the fonts are not working here well, so just read them as all the same size!): The editorial argument against concealed carry laws makes the grave mistakes of: 1) Over expectation. The result of concealed carry laws to not to "abolish violent crimes." Curing all crime (abolishing) with concealed carry laws is unrealistic; I know of nobody who is peddling that lie. 2) "Slippery slope" – too much speculation (unsubstantiated) about the future, i.e., about the deterioration of behavior of law-abiding citizens. What causes one to assume guns make good people bad? 3) Hasty conclusions – to argue against hasty conclusions. Neither side of the issue of whether students at NIU had been carrying guns can be determined. Such situations are most definitely rare and unpredictable – and give us no data to arrive at any substantial conclusions 4) Furthermore, there are no statistics on how many crimes are prevented by concealed carry laws; those are affected by so many other variables. We can only compare state crime rates before and after concealed carry laws go into effect, and make educated guesses about general reductions in crime rates. I am in favor of "strapping the modern version of a six-shooter on one's hip." However, I would then be arrested for "disturbing the peace." Besides, I prefer people not to know for sure whether I have a gun tucked inside my coat. When I carried in SD, I preferred the element of surprise…and the element of "she just might." (And yes, I am trained: grew up shooting shotguns, rifles and pistols; and served three years in the army.) Requiring a show of arms, pretty much let's the devils know when I am defenseless. I'm only 5'2" and a woman. I need the concealed carry law. Wisconsin and Illinois crime rates are much higher than I am used to. And as I get closer to Milwaukee and Chicago, it gets worse. Men just do not seem to have the same fears of being mugged while walking to their cars at night after work – and I doubt they ever think about getting raped.
flagtag Posted June 16, 2008 at 05:26 AM Posted June 16, 2008 at 05:26 AM This was also posted in the Winnebago Sub-forum but I thought appropriate here for responding like Tere suggested. Please remember to be calm, polite, and enlightening - not rude, disparaging, or denigrating. http://www.beloitdailynews.com/artic...als/edit01.txtEDITORIAL: Concealed carry. Still a bad ideaPosted: Friday, Jun 13, 2008 - 12:54:31 pm CDT Thanks, Molly. Since this was in 'Wish'consin, I felt obligated to leave a comment... (in a bit of incongnito, I'm sorry to say... "South Dakota grown") I'll post here what I wrote(the fonts are not working here well, so just read them as all the same size!): The editorial argument against concealed carry laws makes the grave mistakes of: 1) Over expectation. The result of concealed carry laws to not to "abolish violent crimes." Curing all crime (abolishing) with concealed carry laws is unrealistic; I know of nobody who is peddling that lie. 2) "Slippery slope" – too much speculation (unsubstantiated) about the future, i.e., about the deterioration of behavior of law-abiding citizens. What causes one to assume guns make good people bad? 3) Hasty conclusions – to argue against hasty conclusions. Neither side of the issue of whether students at NIU had been carrying guns can be determined. Such situations are most definitely rare and unpredictable – and give us no data to arrive at any substantial conclusions 4) Furthermore, there are no statistics on how many crimes are prevented by concealed carry laws; those are affected by so many other variables. We can only compare state crime rates before and after concealed carry laws go into effect, and make educated guesses about general reductions in crime rates. I am in favor of "strapping the modern version of a six-shooter on one's hip." However, I would then be arrested for "disturbing the peace." Besides, I prefer people not to know for sure whether I have a gun tucked inside my coat. When I carried in SD, I preferred the element of surprise…and the element of "she just might." (And yes, I am trained: grew up shooting shotguns, rifles and pistols; and served three years in the army.) Requiring a show of arms, pretty much let's the devils know when I am defenseless. I'm only 5'2" and a woman. I need the concealed carry law. Wisconsin and Illinois crime rates are much higher than I am used to. And as I get closer to Milwaukee and Chicago, it gets worse. Men just do not seem to have the same fears of being mugged while walking to their cars at night after work – and I doubt they ever think about getting raped. BOTH are great letters! Thanks for posting the link and this letter as well.
Kaeghl Posted June 18, 2008 at 03:41 PM Posted June 18, 2008 at 03:41 PM It appears that comments are still open on that editorial at BDN. And some twit actually said that Great Britan has just about zip crime...inferring that it happened after their gun ban went into effect. Is the sky blue in the world some Wisconsonites live on? I wonder if they will post my reply to 'goldilocks' or whatever that twit's name is. A side note: The BDN's new website is horrible.
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