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"They can sell you a gun or ammunition without the waiting periods..." ?


mauserme
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Ummmm...

 

Just to clarify, this is not correct:

 

https://www.thecentersquare.com/illinois/a-dip-in-gun-sales-at-start-of-year-is-seasonal-gun-rights-advocates-say/article_314a0926-a49f-11ec-aa01-df1c8cbf2feb.html

 

"The new FOID cards no longer have expiration dates, he said. Gun dealers can use the Illinois State Police website to see if a FOID card is in effect. They can sell you a gun or ammunition without the waiting periods and hassle that they used to have to go through, Pearson said."

 

 

 

 

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On 3/17/2022 at 6:29 AM, mauserme said:

Ummmm...

 

Just to clarify, this is not correct:

 

https://www.thecentersquare.com/illinois/a-dip-in-gun-sales-at-start-of-year-is-seasonal-gun-rights-advocates-say/article_314a0926-a49f-11ec-aa01-df1c8cbf2feb.html

 

"The new FOID cards no longer have expiration dates, he said. Gun dealers can use the Illinois State Police website to see if a FOID card is in effect. They can sell you a gun or ammunition without the waiting periods and hassle that they used to have to go through, Pearson said."

 

 

 

 

 

 

That will be the day. 

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On 3/17/2022 at 11:01 AM, Jeffrey said:

If the entire idea behind the waiting period is for the loons to have the day to cool off, why do those who have a closet full already still need this?  I know, Illinois...

 

Someone should have pointed that out during the oral arguments from that case for the FOID being unconstitutional. 

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On 3/17/2022 at 11:09 AM, davel501 said:

 

I just don't think they have thought about the environmental impact of all those extra drives to the FFL. ;)

By default you have to spend extra money because of the waiting. Which essentially is a de facto tax due to gas expenses insurance fees and other related to your travel if you are going to and from by a car. 

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Also ...

 

Quote

“What has changed this year is that if you buy a firearm from a firearm dealer, your FOID card is automatically renewed for 10 years, at no charge,” Pearson said.

 

That's not true until next year, and you have to have fingerprints on file, supposedly just for the FOID. CCL fingerprints don't count.

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On 3/17/2022 at 11:39 AM, Kipp Jones said:

By default you have to spend extra money because of the waiting. Which essentially is a de facto tax due to gas expenses insurance fees and other related to your travel if you are going to and from by a car. 

And the FFL dealer has to see you twice for the same transaction. So in essence, his labor cost is doubled. 

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They corrected the story:

 

 

Quote

 

The new FOID cards no longer have expiration dates, he said. Gun dealers can use the Illinois State Police website to see if a FOID card is in effect. They can also confirm immediately if they can sell you a gun or ammunition, but a waiting period still applies to transfer the gun from retailer to buyer, Pearson said.

Corrections and Clarifications

This story has been edited since initial publication to clarify that a waiting period still applies before a retailer can transfer a purchased gun to a buyer.

 

 

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On 3/17/2022 at 3:04 PM, Lou said:

They corrected the story:

 

 

 

Yeah, so what's been "improved"* when there's now an extra phone call involved for the FFL in a firearm purchase, and a NEW phone call for retailers of ammo???  

 

*Improved for the purpose of discouraging the sale of firearms and ammunition in the State of Illinois.  Komrad Bolsheviks, REJOICE!

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The thing I heard yesterday during the arguments in Brown is if there are ever universal background checks at the federal level the FOID ceases to be of any value. Even now, the current transfer system could easily be updated to do a federal check based on the same info we put into a 4473 and you could still save that approval for a decade.

 

The other thing that struck me about those arguments was they faulted her for not applying for a FOID as though they were saying ignorance of the law is no excuse...but yet here is the state of Illinois claiming ignorance of the constitution.

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I could be wrong, but when I was at the range last time, the guy there, who's an FFL as well, told me that if you order online, basically if it takes more than 3 days for the firearm to get from the site to your FFL, you've fulfilled the waiting period.  He said he used to not think that way, but he'd talked to someone and said he'd even put a call into the ATF and they said the same.  So who knows.  As far as ammunition, if they try to make me have a waiting period, I'm just across the river and will buy in Missouri.  

 

As far as the FOID, I don't see how they really are value anyway, because if you buy a gun, at least a new one, you still are going through a federal background check.  So the state background check seems redundant imo.  Now if they try at the federal level to make a background check happen for private sales, I get it, but seems at that point you are one step away from a gun registry.  

Edited by illinois_buckeye
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On 3/17/2022 at 4:26 PM, illinois_buckeye said:

I could be wrong, but when I was at the range last time, the guy there, who's an FFL as well, told me that if you order online, basically if it takes more than 3 days for the firearm to get from the site to your FFL, you've fulfilled the waiting period.  He said he used to not think that way, but he'd talked to someone and said he'd even put a call into the ATF and they said the same.  So who knows.  As far as ammunition, if they try to make me have a waiting period, I'm just across the river and will buy in Missouri.  

That is a correct statement.  It doesn't mean that any particular FFL actually understands that, however.

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On 3/17/2022 at 12:59 PM, spanishjames said:

And the FFL dealer has to see you twice for the same transaction. So in essence, his labor cost is doubled. 

BINGO !!! This is one of the reasons why I stopped doing transfers, my transfer fee when I stopped was $30. A customer comes to fill out paperwork and gets delayed, 1st appt, then comes back once Approved for pick-up, 2nd appt. Now the biggest argument, even amongst dealers is, "it only takes 15 minutes." To be honest, yes it does, but I rarely have a customer who comes in for pick-up and takes 15 minutes. We bull$h!t, part of the business... If I, or any dealer, chased every customer out after the recertification signature was signed, you might not want to come back. Now the exceptions, I like to get in and get out, only happens about 10% of the time. I can run the bcg check b4 the firearm arrives, not only frowned upon, but the ATF made it clear yesterday that 'best practice' would be to wait for the firearm to arrive. If anything is wrong in Sec. A, then we don't accurately have enough info to run the bcg check. So, 70% of the time for me, every transaction takes 2 visits...

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On 3/17/2022 at 4:26 PM, illinois_buckeye said:

I could be wrong, but when I was at the range last time, the guy there, who's an FFL as well, told me that if you order online, basically if it takes more than 3 days for the firearm to get from the site to your FFL, you've fulfilled the waiting period.  He said he used to not think that way, but he'd talked to someone and said he'd even put a call into the ATF and they said the same.  So who knows.  As far as ammunition, if they try to make me have a waiting period, I'm just across the river and will buy in Missouri.  

 

As far as the FOID, I don't see how they really are value anyway, because if you buy a gun, at least a new one, you still are going through a federal background check.  So the state background check seems redundant imo.  Now if they try at the federal level to make a background check happen for private sales, I get it, but seems at that point you are one step away from a gun registry.  

From yesterday's ATF/ISP Meeting: 

1. No need to run a FOID Check for an ammunition purchase if the customer bought a firearm and received an Approval through FTIP, as long as its within the 30 days that the bcg check is valid.

2. According to ISP, no neighboring state SHOULD sell you any ammunition for any handgun, only long guns. And vice versa for IL Dealers selling to out of state sellers. ISP was made aware of PCC firearms.

 

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On 3/18/2022 at 12:05 PM, 2A4Cook said:

They just wanna "regulate" what few FFLs are left after they pulled their state licensing stunt.  Only the big shops will remain, then they'll find a way to go after them.

I will say you are correct but other Big Box FFL's are on the same page. Rock River, Springfield, and Cabela's made a play on the 1st Gun Licensing Bill that was introduced...

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On 3/18/2022 at 10:59 AM, ealcala31 said:

From yesterday's ATF/ISP Meeting: 

1. No need to run a FOID Check for an ammunition purchase if the customer bought a firearm and received an Approval through FTIP, as long as its within the 30 days that the bcg check is valid.

2. According to ISP, no neighboring state SHOULD sell you any ammunition for any handgun, only long guns. And vice versa for IL Dealers selling to out of state sellers. ISP was made aware of PCC firearms.

 

 

Is that only neighboring states (like WI, IN, IA, etc) or any state that should not sell you handgun ammo?  I have been trying to find out if we can still order ammo online with the new foid cards without the exp date.

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IL FFL Dealers are not allowed to sell handgun ammunition to any person who does not reside in the state or have a FOID Card on a face to face transaction. IL Dealers are allowed to ship ammunition out of state as long as we follow all applicable laws. ISP is well aware of PCCs.

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On 3/19/2022 at 7:26 PM, ealcala31 said:

IL FFL Dealers are not allowed to sell handgun ammunition to any person who does not reside in the state or have a FOID Card on a face to face transaction. IL Dealers are allowed to ship ammunition out of state as long as we follow all applicable laws. ISP is well aware of PCCs.

 

   Really!  I did not know that.  Since my move to Indiana I don't get into Illinois stores or gun shops much, I would rather give my money to local businesses.  So if I would stop at somewhere in Illinois and happen to see a deal on some ammo I would not be able to buy?  Did this change recently?  I seem to remember back when I lived in Illinois if someone showed an out of state drivers license they could buy ammo.  Of course being a reloader I had not tried to buy ammo in Illinois for several years before my move two years ago.   Jim.

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Interesting, I bought ammo in person in MO to shot at my uncle's place there and went to show my FOID and they laughed. They said this is a free State and put that commie card away. 

 

 

Edited by bmyers
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On 3/19/2022 at 6:26 PM, ealcala31 said:

IL FFL Dealers are not allowed to sell handgun ammunition to any person who does not reside in the state or have a FOID Card on a face to face transaction. IL Dealers are allowed to ship ammunition out of state as long as we follow all applicable laws. ISP is well aware of PCCs.

They are just making this up as they go along.

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