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What's the use of a CCL?


vk60187
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I have a CCL license, but I rarely carry, because, as I see it, we we are not allowed to carry to most places anyways, especially if you are living in an urban area.

 

You want to pick up your kid from school?  Carrying on school property is criminal.  You must wait, like an idiot, on a public road.

You want to go to the store?  WEll, better leave your gun in your car, because most stores have a no gun signs, so you are a criminal if you enter with your conceal carry weapon.

Want to go to a playground with your child?  Leave your gun in your car or at home, if you are walking to the car.

Want to take a ride on a CTA or Metro?  Leave your gun at home.

 

Why don't they call "conceal carry license" as a "gun in the car" license?   Seems that is the only place you can legally carry.  

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On 12/17/2021 at 12:32 PM, spanishjames said:

No public sidewalk at your kid's school?

(c) Violations in specific places. 
        (1) A person who violates subsection 24-1(a)(6) or 
    
24-1(a)(7) in any school, regardless of the time of day or the time of year, in residential property owned, operated or managed by a public housing agency or leased by a public housing agency as part of a scattered site or mixed-income development, in a public park, in a courthouse, on the real property comprising any school, regardless of the time of day or the time of year, on residential property owned, operated or managed by a public housing agency or leased by a public housing agency as part of a scattered site or mixed-income development, on the real property comprising any public park, on the real property comprising any courthouse, in any conveyance owned, leased or contracted by a school to transport students to or from school or a school related activity, in any conveyance owned, leased, or contracted by a public transportation agency, or on ******any public way within 1,000 feet of the real property comprising any school,***** public park, courthouse, public transportation facility, or residential property owned, operated, or managed by a public housing agency or leased by a public housing agency as part of a scattered site or mixed-income development commits a Class 2 felony and shall be sentenced to a term of imprisonment of not less than 3 years and not more than 7 years.
 
Edited by vk60187
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On 12/17/2021 at 11:01 AM, Jeffrey said:

I haven't noticed a sign for a solid few years.  You should either consider changing the places you visit or pay a little less attention at said places you visit.

Well, that's what I suspect most CCL's are doing but this, technically, is a violation of the law.  It's like speeding 30mph over the limit..  Lots of people are going 30mph faster vs the posted limit, but I would never do that unless I was in a pack and I was someone in the middle of the pack.  Risk is too great.

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On 12/17/2021 at 12:37 PM, vk60187 said:
(c) Violations in specific places. 
        (1) A person who violates subsection 24-1(a)(6) or 
    
24-1(a)(7) in any school, regardless of the time of day or the time of year, in residential property owned, operated or managed by a public housing agency or leased by a public housing agency as part of a scattered site or mixed-income development, in a public park, in a courthouse, on the real property comprising any school, regardless of the time of day or the time of year, on residential property owned, operated or managed by a public housing agency or leased by a public housing agency as part of a scattered site or mixed-income development, on the real property comprising any public park, on the real property comprising any courthouse, in any conveyance owned, leased or contracted by a school to transport students to or from school or a school related activity, in any conveyance owned, leased, or contracted by a public transportation agency, or on ******any public way within 1,000 feet of the real property comprising any school,***** public park, courthouse, public transportation facility, or residential property owned, operated, or managed by a public housing agency or leased by a public housing agency as part of a scattered site or mixed-income development commits a Class 2 felony and shall be sentenced to a term of imprisonment of not less than 3 years and not more than 7 years.
 

Actually, I'm wrong there.  For CCL, a different section applies
https://www.ilga.gov/legislation/ilcs/fulltext.asp?DocName=043000660K65

(430 ILCS 66/65)
    Sec. 65. Prohibited areas.

 

(c) A licensee shall not be in violation of this Section while he or she is traveling along a public right of way that touches or crosses any of the premises under subsection (a), (a-5), or (a-10) of this Section if the concealed firearm is carried on his or her person in accordance with the provisions of this Act or is being transported in a vehicle by the licensee in accordance with all other applicable provisions of law.

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On 12/17/2021 at 1:08 PM, vk60187 said:

Actually, I'm wrong there.  For CCL, a different section applies
https://www.ilga.gov/legislation/ilcs/fulltext.asp?DocName=043000660K65

(430 ILCS 66/65)
    Sec. 65. Prohibited areas.

 

(c) A licensee shall not be in violation of this Section while he or she is traveling along a public right of way that touches or crosses any of the premises under subsection (a), (a-5), or (a-10) of this Section if the concealed firearm is carried on his or her person in accordance with the provisions of this Act or is being transported in a vehicle by the licensee in accordance with all other applicable provisions of law.

 

Possibly more to your first point, about picking up your child,  is the exemption immediately above your citation:

 

(b) Notwithstanding subsections (a), (a-5), and (a-10) of this Section except under paragraph (22) or (23) of subsection (a), any licensee prohibited from carrying a concealed firearm into the parking area of a prohibited location specified in subsection (a), (a-5), or (a-10) of this Section shall be permitted to carry a concealed firearm on or about his or her person within a vehicle into the parking area and may store a firearm or ammunition concealed in a case within a locked vehicle or locked container out of plain view within the vehicle in the parking area. A licensee may carry a concealed firearm in the immediate area surrounding his or her vehicle within a prohibited parking lot area only for the limited purpose of storing or retrieving a firearm within the vehicle's trunk. For purposes of this subsection, "case" includes a glove compartment or console that completely encloses the concealed firearm or ammunition, the trunk of the vehicle, or a firearm carrying box, shipping box, or other container.

 

 

 

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I must concede that I live a boring life because outside of the places that are prohibited by statute, I very rarely encounter places I need to go that don't allow me to carry. This is in Chicago no less and primarily the South and West sides, though I do on occasion find myself in parts of the loop, RN, and the Lakeview/Wrigleyville/Ravenswood area. People seem to see these signs everywhere they go.

Edited by solareclipse2
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I seem to recall an internet posting - I could be mistaken - of someone who despite the immense odds against it was actually noticed and challenged whilst carrying in a shoppe. It is rumored they said - "Oh.... there was a small sign on that door?????  I'm terribly sorry, but I honestly didn't see it, I was stupidly occupied on my cell phone - I will gladly leave the premises immediately." And they then did peacefully leave without causing a commotion.

 

Again, perhaps my memory is faulty, and I am NOT a lawyer (I'm poor folk - lol) so live your life accordingly.

 

 

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On 12/18/2021 at 6:45 AM, solareclipse2 said:

I must concede that I live a boring life because outside of the places that are prohibited by statute, I very rarely encounter places I need to go that don't allow me to carry. This is in Chicago no less and primarily the South and West sides, though I do on occasion find myself in parts of the loop, RN, and the Lakeview/Wrigleyville/Ravenswood area. People seem to see these signs everywhere they go.

I’m in Chicago suburbs, but I was under the impression that Chicago is even more difficult to conceal carry in.  Biggest issue, I’d think, is parks and playgrounds.  Also, can’t carry in forest preserves.

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On 12/18/2021 at 6:01 PM, vk60187 said:

I’m in Chicago suburbs, but I was under the impression that Chicago is even more difficult to conceal carry in.  Biggest issue, I’d think, is parks and playgrounds.  Also, can’t carry in forest preserves.

You can't carry in Cook County Forest Preserves.  All other county forest preserves are legal.   You should get a refund from whomever gave you the class. 

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And of course, that's the strategy they adopted -- by design. Make it so hard to weave in and out of legal carry locations as to make people say, "If it's going to be that hard, why bother?"

 

The ban on carrying on public transportation is particularly egregious -- and prejudicial I would say -- because of the way it hits many minorities. Add to that the extortionate cost structure, and you almost have a prima facie case of discrimination.

 

Rich Phillips

Edited by richp
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On 12/18/2021 at 8:42 PM, spanishjames said:

You can't carry in Cook County Forest Preserves.  All other county forest preserves are legal.   You should get a refund from whomever gave you the class. 

https://www2.illinois.gov/dnr/LawEnforcement/Documents/ConcealedCarryQnA.pdf
 

natural preserves are off limits too

 

“All firearms, including concealed firearms, are also prohibited on all IDNR State Refuge areas, *****IDNR Dedicated Nature Preserves, *****and IDNR children playground areas. When visiting any of these locations, Concealed Carry Permit holders are required to secure their concealed firearms in their vehicle in accordance with the Illinois Concealed Carry Act.”
 

now, I have no clue on the difference between nature preserves and forest preserves 

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I live downtown Chicago- Every store has a sign plastered on the entryway door...Literally every door to nearly everything has one.

 

As I move towards gun ownership, having my expungement completed, and living close-by hundreds of weekly shootings, carjackings and smash 'n grab looting events (my block was burned and looted last year)- I see this as the most ignorant of liberal initiatives. Wouldn't it be better to instill a bit of fear in the minds of violent criminals? The intended consequences of liberal Illinois anti-gun initiatives provides for a great environment for criminals (all democrats) to act out their intentions.

 

I'd like to see more of the other type of sign below- I know that won't happen in Chicago as criminals are the primary constituency of the Democrats.

 

 

 

 

file.png

guns-welcome-on-premises-sign-s-6119.png

Edited by Jeff_Chicago
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On 12/19/2021 at 11:40 AM, vk60187 said:

https://www2.illinois.gov/dnr/LawEnforcement/Documents/ConcealedCarryQnA.pdf
 

natural preserves are off limits too

 

“All firearms, including concealed firearms, are also prohibited on all IDNR State Refuge areas, *****IDNR Dedicated Nature Preserves, *****and IDNR children playground areas. When visiting any of these locations, Concealed Carry Permit holders are required to secure their concealed firearms in their vehicle in accordance with the Illinois Concealed Carry Act.”
 

now, I have no clue on the difference between nature preserves and forest preserves 

 

IDNR facilities are run by the Illinois Department of Natural Resources, so by the state.  Other preserves are run by other municipal agencies, or are privately operated.

 

Keep in mind that licensees may not knowingly carry in a prohibited area.  Signs notifying licensees of the prohibition are required in law in order to give licensees the information they need.  If that information is not provided by the facility in the form of a posted prohibition, then the licensee has not knowingly carried in a prohibited area.  It is not incumbent upon the licensee to somehow acquire this information on their own, other than through the required signage. 

 

 

 

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https://chicago.suntimes.com/crime/2021/12/23/22852472/4-hurt-oakbrook-center-mall-mall-shooting-lockdown

 

Note, there was a shooting last night at the Oak Brook, IL mall.  After the shooting, police were searching people as they were looking for  suspect that could have remained in the mall.  There is a danger of conceal carrying in the prohibited areas as otherwise law abiding citizens can be found to be carrying in the situations like these.

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On 12/24/2021 at 11:13 AM, vk60187 said:

https://chicago.suntimes.com/crime/2021/12/23/22852472/4-hurt-oakbrook-center-mall-mall-shooting-lockdown

 

Note, there was a shooting last night at the Oak Brook, IL mall.  After the shooting, police were searching people as they were looking for  suspect that could have remained in the mall.  There is a danger of conceal carrying in the prohibited areas as otherwise law abiding citizens can be found to be carrying in the situations like these.

 

Is that the only danger you're able to perceive? 

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On 12/24/2021 at 11:13 AM, vk60187 said:

https://chicago.suntimes.com/crime/2021/12/23/22852472/4-hurt-oakbrook-center-mall-mall-shooting-lockdown

 

Note, there was a shooting last night at the Oak Brook, IL mall.  After the shooting, police were searching people as they were looking for  suspect that could have remained in the mall.  There is a danger of conceal carrying in the prohibited areas as otherwise law abiding citizens can be found to be carrying in the situations like these.

In a real life shooting at a local mall I would rather the police found me with a gun then my attacker finding me without.

A personal chose.

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On 12/25/2021 at 6:54 AM, Yas said:

Checked the "Posted"  app when I heard this was going down.   The app mentions theres a lot of non compliant signs posted around the mall property.

Well then there you go. The perps will have an out if they want. Non Compliant signage! Therefore the property wasn't a no carry area, cool.

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 12/17/2021 at 11:52 AM, vk60187 said:

I have a CCL license, but I rarely carry, because, as I see it, we we are not allowed to carry to most places anyways, especially if you are living in an urban area.

 

You want to pick up your kid from school?  Carrying on school property is criminal.  You must wait, like an idiot, on a public road.

You want to go to the store?  WEll, better leave your gun in your car, because most stores have a no gun signs, so you are a criminal if you enter with your conceal carry weapon.

Want to go to a playground with your child?  Leave your gun in your car or at home, if you are walking to the car.

Want to take a ride on a CTA or Metro?  Leave your gun at home.

 

Why don't they call "conceal carry license" as a "gun in the car" license?   Seems that is the only place you can legally carry.  

OR ... you could move to a free state, like many of us have, (as soon as you have the opportunity) that doesn't subject its residents to "if this, then that" rules that are all "gotchas"

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