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Biden’s Gun Control Push Will Further Divide Us


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https://thyblackman.com/2021/01/17/build-back-better-joe-bidens-gun-control-push-will-further-divide-us/

 

“Build Back Better?”: Joe Biden’s Gun Control Push Will Further Divide Us.

January 17, 2021 by Staff
Filed under Opinion, Politics, Weekly Columns

(ThyBlackMan.com) America is hurting.

Tensions are high. Coming together and having meaningful dialogue seem impossible. People are tired of politics creeping into everyday life. Worst of all, self-righteous “unifiers” uninterested in unity continue to fan the flames of division.

Is it too difficult to set aside our differences, to lower the temperature, and to demand better from elected officials? It shouldn’t be.

For instance, healing will take a backseat should the incoming Joe Biden administration and Democrat-controlled Congress pursue aggressive gun control policies. Why? Democrats, Republicans, and independents don’t want to lose their Second Amendment rights.

In the spirit of healing and unity, President-elect Joe Biden and his Congressional backers should reconsider this push.

In a recent statement commemorating the tenth anniversary of the Tucson mass shooting, the president-elect vowed this, “As President, I pledge to continue to work together with Congresswoman Giffords, and with survivors, families, and advocates across the country, to defeat the NRA and end the epidemic of gun violence in America.”

During the 2020 campaign, Joe Biden pledged executive action to further regulate firearms and ammunition.

His campaign openly touted the repeal of Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act, reviving a federal assault weapons ban, universal background checks, federal gun buy-back programs, extreme risk protection orders (red flag laws), banning online sales of firearms and ammunition and to “give states incentives to set up gun licensing programs,” among publicly listed policy proposals.

Are Democrats in agreement with his plan? Surprisingly, many aren’t warming up to Biden’s gun control policies either.

One labor organizer wrote in the Washington Post, “Biden’s plan falls into a long line of government efforts to disarm the working class while keeping the lanes clear for the privileged who can afford whatever legal curveballs are thrown their way.”

She concluded, “This divisive plan will do little to curb gun violence, and will instead hammer home the vast inequalities still dividing this nation.”

Hear, hear!

None of the aforementioned policies would eliminate crime. They would make it increasingly difficult for law-abiding Americans to purchase firearms and related components. Worse, his plan would criminalize law-abiding Americans. Scary.

In a time of uncertainty, people need leaders to look up to. Treading down this path won’t boost morale nor restore trust. It’ll deliver the opposite.
...
In December, the Associated Press cautioned against gun control wishcasting, writing, “And regardless the outcome in two Senate races in Georgia that will determine which party holds the majority in that chamber, it will be a tall order to get a majority of lawmakers on board.”

Indeed. With a 50-50 split in the U.S. Senate and narrow Democrat majority in the House of Representatives, gun control would further divide - not unite - our country.

If President-elect Biden wants to “build back better,” he should ditch his gun control plans.

Written by Gabriella Hoffman

 

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A lot of their supporters are getting tired of having their rights taken from them by the folks they put in office.

I'm confused by their thinking. Do they actually think that the millions of legal gun owners are going simply walk down to the city square and throw their firearms into burning pile simply because some bureaucrats in Washington say so.

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A lot of their supporters are getting tired of having their rights taken from them by the folks they put in office.

I'm confused by their thinking. Do they actually think that the millions of legal gun owners are going simply walk down to the city square and throw their firearms into burning pile simply because some bureaucrats in Washington say so.

 

I just wish I hadn't lost all my guns in the boating accident. :rolleyes:

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They dont care about the voters. Once in power, they do what they want. Dems always have a mandate when they win. Republicans cant spell mandate when they are in power. Once our right is gone, we will never get it back. These 2 yrs will be very challenging for the Constitution. Lets see how the 6 Republicans' on SCOTUS handle it. Its in there hands.

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A lot of their supporters are getting tired of having their rights taken from them by the folks they put in office.

 

Well, in this case, the politicians put themselves in office.

 

 

To quote the President "Elect" . . . . "BINGO!!"

 

I believe that our new, all Dem government will immediately go into full blown over-reach mode. Then, in 2022, those swing voters and soft core Dems that voted Democrat will be stunned when they reverse position and Dems win again, despite an overwhelming turnout. The machines and software that voted Dem on the other hand, will care less.

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I'm confused by their thinking. Do they actually think that the millions of legal gun owners are going simply walk down to the city square and throw their firearms into burning pile simply because some bureaucrats in Washington say so.

 

 

Short answer yes, they believe that, just like they believe if they make it harder for law abiding gun owners to get guns lawfully the criminals will just give up on getings guns illegally.

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I'm confused by their thinking. Do they actually think that the millions of legal gun owners are going simply walk down to the city square and throw their firearms into burning pile simply because some bureaucrats in Washington say so.

 

 

Short answer yes, they believe that, just like they believe if they make it harder for law abiding gun owners to get guns lawfully the criminals will just give up on getings guns illegally.

 

 

I've tried to speak rationally to people who are really against firearm rights and all I've taken from it is that they go almost 100% off of feelings, not facts.

 

Try to present any facts to them and they walk over it like poo on the sidewalk. They feel guns are evil, they feel there is an "epidemic of gun violence", the feel that banning them would clear up the problem they feel exists.

 

They will not listen to any data you attempt to provide them with. I often get ridiculed and called something on the lines of a "gun-nut"...

 

This is no different than when I was debating the police-civilian death rate. With around 1000 civilians killed by police yearly, when you take in account the estimated 50,000,000+ police-civilian encounters and add in the data that of those 1000, a vast majority of them were violent criminals...it doesn't paint much of a picture in favor of out of control police brutality. I got called a bootlicker and a racist for pointing that information out.

 

But they feel there is an issue, therefore there is.

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We are succeeding in the sense that those who normally opposed gun ownership are, in measurable numbers, seeing the value of the Second Amendment.

 

Their reasons for gun ownership will sometimes differ from ours in the same way a hunter's reasons might differ from a competitive shooter's reasons. It's up to us to continue our outreach in an effort to demonstrate that we needn't be at odds with each other.

 

Words of Wisdom, Mauserme, I couldn't agree more. If I'm not mistaken this is a Gun Rights forum. I have had hundreds of people take my CC Classes. They all had ONE THING in common, they wanted to be able to protect themselves and family with a firearm. Most, I have no idea of their political affiliation (nor care) I know some to be die hard long time Democrats and some to be Republicans. It's been awhile but wasn't some Democrat named Brandon trying to pass concealed carry before (and after) the court said we had too? Just this last session a Republican named Brad introduced a bill to tighten cc reporting requirements with police interaction. I welcome anyone that supports the right of self defense.

Edited by NRApistol
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We are succeeding in the sense that those who normally opposed gun ownership are, in measurable numbers, seeing the value of the Second Amendment.

 

Their reasons for gun ownership will sometimes differ from ours in the same way a hunter's reasons might differ from a competitive shooter's reasons. It's up to us to continue our outreach in an effort to demonstrate that we needn't be at odds with each other.

 

Words of Wisdom, Mauserme, I couldn't agree more. If I'm not mistaken this is a Gun Rights forum. I have had hundreds of people take my CC Classes. They all had ONE THING in common, they wanted to be able to protect themselves and family with a firearm. Most, I have no idea of their political affiliation (nor care) I know some to be die hard long time Democrats and some to be Republicans. It's been awhile but wasn't some Democrat named Brandon trying to pass concealed carry before (and after) the court said we had too? Just this last session a Republican named Brad introduced a bill to tighten cc reporting requirements with police interaction. I welcome anyone that supports the right of self defense.

 

 

Nope. We've picked up a few, but just a few and I don't know how long we'll keep those. I cite the "2A-Barbara Streisand effect": Anti-gun, but surrounds self with armed guards and has CC in hard impossible to get "may issue" state.

 

I also cite the FUDs that hunt or shoot clays but are adamant that "no one needs a weapon of war" that think a "sporting purposes" clause emanates from a penumbra of the Second Amendment.

 

We have no common ground with them. We are an abomination they neither associate with nor seek common cause. We are the illogical ones that won't listen to their reasoning. They reason with their emotions, our facts are of little use to them, and frankly, they are offended that we persist in attacking them with facts when they have such powerful emotions.

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We are succeeding in the sense that those who normally opposed gun ownership are, in measurable numbers, seeing the value of the Second Amendment.

 

Their reasons for gun ownership will sometimes differ from ours in the same way a hunter's reasons might differ from a competitive shooter's reasons. It's up to us to continue our outreach in an effort to demonstrate that we needn't be at odds with each other.

 

Words of Wisdom, Mauserme, I couldn't agree more. If I'm not mistaken this is a Gun Rights forum. I have had hundreds of people take my CC Classes. They all had ONE THING in common, they wanted to be able to protect themselves and family with a firearm. Most, I have no idea of their political affiliation (nor care) I know some to be die hard long time Democrats and some to be Republicans. It's been awhile but wasn't some Democrat named Brandon trying to pass concealed carry before (and after) the court said we had too? Just this last session a Republican named Brad introduced a bill to tighten cc reporting requirements with police interaction. I welcome anyone that supports the right of self defense.

 

 

Nope. We've picked up a few, but just a few and I don't know how long we'll keep those. I cite the "2A-Barbara Streisand effect": Anti-gun, but surrounds self with armed guards and has CC in hard impossible to get "may issue" state.

 

I also cite the FUDs that hunt or shoot clays but are adamant that "no one needs a weapon of war" that think a "sporting purposes" clause emanates from a penumbra of the Second Amendment.

 

We have no common ground with them. We are an abomination they neither associate with nor seek common cause. We are the illogical ones that won't listen to their reasoning. They reason with their emotions, our facts are of little use to them, and frankly, they are offended that we persist in attacking them with facts when they have such powerful emotions.

 

 

I'll openly admit that I'm pessimistic, but I agree with you.

 

We need people on our side who take firearm ownership seriously. Not new owners because they bought one in a panic, not buy a gun then shove it in a sock drawer somewhere, and definitely not a "Well I'm a gun owner but I agree, common sense laws taking weapons of war off the streets is exactly what we need" fudd.

 

Most of those people will continue to vote in politicians who will openly threaten firearm owners rights.

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Nope. We've picked up a few, but just a few and I don't know how long we'll keep those. I cite the "2A-Barbara Streisand effect": Anti-gun, but surrounds self with armed guards and has CC in hard impossible to get "may issue" state.

 

I also cite the FUDs that hunt or shoot clays but are adamant that "no one needs a weapon of war" that think a "sporting purposes" clause emanates from a penumbra of the Second Amendment.

 

We have no common ground with them. We are an abomination they neither associate with nor seek common cause. We are the illogical ones that won't listen to their reasoning. They reason with their emotions, our facts are of little use to them, and frankly, they are offended that we persist in attacking them with facts when they have such powerful emotions.

While I'm sure you look at those feelings as realism they are, in actuality, defeatism. Your post, your expression of anger toward folks who could be your ally, illustrates another part of the problem we need to address.

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Mauserme, you may have had more successful conversations with gun-owning anti-gunners than I have. I'm reporting actual experience I've had with people that live in gated communities and own their own firearms but are distrustful of "deplorables". The McCloskey's aren't an aberration. And it's not just Democrats, there's plenty of country club Republicans that feel the same way. Also, from my own family and acquaintances, there are several bird hunters that have THOUSANDS of dollars in high end shotguns who say they are adamant Second Amendment supporters that are anti-weapons of war, which is any kind of semi-auto firearm: pistol, rifle, shotgun. These people absolutely hate the NRA, but not for the same reason I do, for the opposite reason, they think the NRA has gone too far. That's reality. That's who the "new" firearm purchasers are, people that already had a FOID since the state still isn't issuing new FOID cards for June '20 applications. They're motivated and controlled by fear. Until we find a way to appeal to them on an emotional level, we're not going to convert many. We are up against the fear machine in the mainstream media and Dem leadership. When they aren't overhyping the dangers of mass shootings, they're pressing the WuFlu shutdown theater (looks like shutdown theater will ease up now that we're past Jan. 20th). Since they're starting to re-open, they now have the vast right wing conspiracy QAnon coup and impeachment trial to distract the masses with. Focus on how to overcome their emotion-based decision making process, not on those already supporting the 2nd Amendment that aren't as nice and articulate as you are.

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Mauserme, you may have had more successful conversations with gun-owning anti-gunners than I have. I'm reporting actual experience I've had with people that live in gated communities and own their own firearms but are distrustful of "deplorables". The McCloskey's aren't an aberration. And it's not just Democrats, there's plenty of country club Republicans that feel the same way. Also, from my own family and acquaintances, there are several bird hunters that have THOUSANDS of dollars in high end shotguns who say they are adamant Second Amendment supporters that are anti-weapons of war, which is any kind of semi-auto firearm: pistol, rifle, shotgun. These people absolutely hate the NRA, but not for the same reason I do, for the opposite reason, they think the NRA has gone too far. That's reality. That's who the "new" firearm purchasers are, people that already had a FOID since the state still isn't issuing new FOID cards for June '20 applications. They're motivated and controlled by fear. Until we find a way to appeal to them on an emotional level, we're not going to convert many. We are up against the fear machine in the mainstream media and Dem leadership. When they aren't overhyping the dangers of mass shootings, they're pressing the WuFlu shutdown theater (looks like shutdown theater will ease up now that we're past Jan. 20th). Since they're starting to re-open, they now have the vast right wing conspiracy QAnon coup and impeachment trial to distract the masses with. Focus on how to overcome their emotion-based decision making process, not on those already supporting the 2nd Amendment that aren't as nice and articulate as you are.

That's a pretty EMOTIONAL statement.

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Mauserme, you may have had more successful conversations with gun-owning anti-gunners than I have. I'm reporting actual experience I've had with people that live in gated communities and own their own firearms but are distrustful of "deplorables". The McCloskey's aren't an aberration. And it's not just Democrats, there's plenty of country club Republicans that feel the same way. Also, from my own family and acquaintances, there are several bird hunters that have THOUSANDS of dollars in high end shotguns who say they are adamant Second Amendment supporters that are anti-weapons of war, which is any kind of semi-auto firearm: pistol, rifle, shotgun. These people absolutely hate the NRA, but not for the same reason I do, for the opposite reason, they think the NRA has gone too far. That's reality. That's who the "new" firearm purchasers are, people that already had a FOID since the state still isn't issuing new FOID cards for June '20 applications. They're motivated and controlled by fear. Until we find a way to appeal to them on an emotional level, we're not going to convert many. We are up against the fear machine in the mainstream media and Dem leadership. When they aren't overhyping the dangers of mass shootings, they're pressing the WuFlu shutdown theater (looks like shutdown theater will ease up now that we're past Jan. 20th). Since they're starting to re-open, they now have the vast right wing conspiracy QAnon coup and impeachment trial to distract the masses with. Focus on how to overcome their emotion-based decision making process, not on those already supporting the 2nd Amendment that aren't as nice and articulate as you are.

It could be that if you stop letting other issues influence your approach on gun rights, those people might be more receptive to the 2A message.

 

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It could be that if you stop letting other issues influence your approach on gun rights, those people might be more receptive to the 2A message.

 

 

I'm not shutting down any conversation nor limiting my or anyone elses messages.

 

And yet, we're not the ones that have made this a Dem vs Republican issue. I've heard from many conservatives and countless middle-of-the-road voters that respect the Bill of Rights that don't understand the hard line that's been drawn. Hard-core union guys that are avid hunters but anti-NRA who are sure they'll never loose their shotguns but would like to see semi-autos and handguns banned and taken away from us. They're stuck on "sporting purposes", not the Right to keep and bear arms.

 

Like it or not, these are the litmus test issues of our day:

* Abortion

* Second Amendment

* Free Speech (lord help us, I never thought this would divide us!)

 

We could expand a little to include religious belief and the environment, but I don't think those 2 issues are quite as defining, although many want to make it so. I'm sure others could add to the secondary list of issues that divide us, but none are as divisive as abortion and the 2nd Amendment. And both are emotional, life threatening issues.

 

There are members here (not naming names) that I assume are Democrats that have made many observations (especially lately) I actually agree with regarding the election outcome but from a slightly different angle. The 1 issue we definitely agree on is the 2nd Amendment and I have no reason to disbelieve their sincerity on that subject (IC covers a lot of ground --> Thank you, moderators!). The difference is, they sincerely believe in free speech and aren't afraid to engage in the logical arguments they face every day here. That's a HUGE difference vs. soo many on the left that have lumped us all into the deplorables category and have shut down conversation. And that's what I'm afraid of, once conversation is shut down, people are going to act out like we saw on Jan. 6th. Though I don't believe it was a coup attempt, it was a desperate, ill advised act.

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I would have to agree with Seanc. I have a friend that is a hunter and could care less if they restrict handguns. As long as the Left controls the media, 2A will be attacked. More will try to get handguns for there own protection while not advancing the 2A movement. I will add , I hope that new gun owners will see how the 2nd is getting slapped around and step up to help the cause. But...Will it be to late?

Edited by Sweeper13
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I'm not even going to try. Just because a liberal happens to own a gun, doesn't mean they will unite and fight, and abandon their more important issues that they align with.

To tell you the truth, it's probably better that you don't try.

 

IllinoisCarry, however, will continue its mission to bring people together into our common cause. That mission is, unfortunately, neither represented nor felt by a few of our members.

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Ok so let's start now! Outreach to non-traditional firearm owners (blacks and browns) is low hanging fruit. Most people in the black community (yes, most are not criminals but are law abiding citizens) own firearms or are open to it. However, they don't have the guidance or the infrastructure to help them in their pursuit of 2A rights. Because the democrats don't highlight gun ownership like many on the right, there is really no outlet to go to. Other issues outside of 2A prevent many of these folks from coming over to "our" side. Many don't live near other races of people just like many of you guys don't live near large portions of blacks. So there is this invisible wall that exists. We focus too much on other issues instead of just 2A. We are not all going to agree on fiscal policies, or social issues but we need to find common ground where we can. The black community historically is very conservative, socially and fiscally. Many find their issues mixed in with the issues of the "Lake Shore" liberals who really could care less about issues minorities are facing nor could they care less about the second amendment. Police misconduct or unjust shootings by law LEOs shouldn't be a partisan issue as we all face this in some form. And it's only a small percentage of LEOs in this category. WE should all want accountability. For those who just want to give cops a hard time...well, that's their problem and I have no sympathy for them. We should want accountability from anyone that is a public servant. This seems to be the biggest issue that separates minorities from most gun loving white conservative Americans. Anyway, it's a start. If you want more voting conservatives, it's time to reach across the isle and prove it. Show them that there is nothing to fear from the "gun loving right" and you will see there is nothing to fear when dealing with those that don't look like you. It is a fact that most crime these days are being committed by young punks who are black. That's a darn shame. It is up to those in the communities to demand accountability just like they did prior to the 1994 crime bill. For all the BS talk about this bill and how it criminalized black men, the bill was needed. You had black tax paying citizens who couldn't walk outside their home for fear of being killed and they wanted something done about it. Was it fair? Nope! The crack rock vs powder cocaine disparity was totally wrong and resulted in more blacks getting locked up for longer periods but overall, it was needed. It is my opinion we need something similar today but just a fairer application of the law.

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I'm not even going to try. Just because a liberal happens to own a gun, doesn't mean they will unite and fight, and abandon their more important issues that they align with.

To tell you the truth, it's probably better that you don't try.

 

IllinoisCarry, however, will continue its mission to bring people together into our common cause. That mission is, unfortunately, neither represented nor felt by a few of our members.

 

 

Sorry I could have been clearer. I said I'm not going to try to engage a long debate about it, as when I do, it usually lasts less than 5 minutes before it's deleted. I do appreciate Brooks post above, but the reality is, after all of the discussion here, not a single one of the resident democratic gun owners changed their vote, and have been pretty open about it - even gleeful.

 

They will continue to vote for politicians and platforms that make it their priority to take away our 2A rights. As I've stated a million times, if you cannot change the heart and soul, and the voting of those in your own captive audience, what's the plan out in the real world? I clearly don't have any answers, but I do know I don't see much in the way of strategy to overcome this problem. I don't think sometimes people realize there are many other issues at play here, and it goes well beyond the 2A. Until pressure from within forces those in the DNC to refocus their thinking on the 2A, they sure aren't going to bow to conservative wishes.

 

I'm not going to get into this any deeper.

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T Brooks...There is a lot there, I dont mean any disrespect. There was a person that stood up for all people in the USA. Trump. Regardless of his style that people didn't like, he did speak out to minorities and what was going on in the major cities. If he couldn't get the message out, nobody can.

Edited by Sweeper13
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