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FOID and CCL - do you carry both?


DarkLord
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I now feel like a knucklehead. At my CCL renewal class, I was told I still had to carry both if I was carrying a firearm.

 

I now feel like a knucklehead. At my CCL renewal class, I was told I still had to carry both if I was carrying a firearm.

 

Why should you have to have the FOID on you to carry? Sounds like the instructor didn't know what he was talking about. Any instructor here agree with that instructor?

 

I just carry my CCL. If my wallet was lost or stolen I could use my FOID when transporting to the range or to buy a gun or ammo while I waited for a replacement CCL, not sure how long that takes right now.

 

I could also keep an unloaded handgun in my car in the console of the car with a loaded magazine and have it available.

It was to be carried in the beginning and both were required in possession.

It was then changed, maybe at the same time the new style cards would be sent out with the CCL and have the matching numbers.

I got my CCL without the new style FOID and the numbers didn’t match. Those who happened to have a FOID expire early in the program were still getting the old style cards. Many posts here about guys today shocked to find a new style and new FOID along with their new or old/renewed CCL.

 

So I would agree with the statement to carry both pre 2015/16.

I would not agree with that statement at this timeline forward.

Remembering that these things were fluid in the beginning and some instructors were slow in getting the new information, it’s not like the FSB of ISP was or is a great communicator to instructors.

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CCL in wallet...FOID in safe..

Why you ask?

Because since the change in the law that only requires you possess the CCL, this is what I do.

If I were to lose both cards because my wallet was lost/stolen...legally...its game-set-match. I wouldnt be able possess guns or ammo. I would have move everything to somebody elses house.

With the FOID safe..in the safe...If I lost my CCL, at least I can still legally have everything until it is replaced.

 

Ranges?

I go to two ranges. One only asks to see a FOID/CCL and doesnt hold on to it.

Another range will hold an ID.. But I always ask, and have always been granted, they they hold my DL rather than my CCL. I simply say if you guys lose it..I'd rather it be my DL because they are alot easier to replace. They ALWAYS agree.

 

Buying guns/ammo?

I have never found myself thinking...

Gee..I may stumble across one of the hundreds and hundreds of business that sell ammo..I should bring my FOID... /sarc

No..I know when I'm out to buy ammo or a firearm, and bring my FOID if needed.

 

Do I care about 'whipping out a CCL rather than FOID'?

No. Lets be real....

When I buy ammo...its tends to be at a gun shop. They guy I'm buying it from sometimes has an open sidearm on his hip. Do you think he is gonna care that I showed a CCL or FOID... I dont 'panic' because the 'gun shop' knows I have a CCL.

 

Walmart? I used to use my FOID(when they sold pistol/rifle rounds)...a few times I used my CCL. No issues. They required the seller have a FOID. (Not any employee can open the ammo case and sell it. That person has to have a FOID). So even then, at walmart, you are dealing with somebody that understands. I've also had friendly gun-centric covos with walmart staff that sell the ammo.

 

Cabela's? (before the cook tax). I used my CCL. They guys at the counter were also gun nuts. I would have interesting conversations with them all the time. (Once, a salesman I always chatted with asked me "Wanna see something cool"? Me: Of course! He brings out ..HIS...skeletonized AR. It had to weigh bout 4lbs. )

I always looked forward to seeing alot of the staff at cabela's. Again this was before the ammo tax. I rarely go there anymore.

 

Any other gun shop? Again..its a freakin' GUN SHOP... Not worried about showing a CCL.

 

So...The bottom line is if you have to show any kind of firearm ID, it tends to be to people that are firearms type people as well.

I've never had anybody bat an eye, or make a comment when I use my CCL rather than a FOID.

 

This is my position..and I'm sticking to it... :)

 

 

 

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^^^^^^ Final Answer for $50,000.00

 

 

My final answer is NO I don't carry both. The FOID stays at home. I have normally carried the Utah LTC but have decided to leave that at home now too. A replacement card is only $10 though not $75 like Illinois. How come it costs so much more to replace an Illinois LTC than a FOID? I used to carry a Pa LTC as well and kept a copy at home which I was told was OK to use. Of course that was when they issued a paper LTC.

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I carry both. If I am pulled over and asked for my CCL I will have it. If I go to a range or gun store I show my FOID card. They dont need to know I carry.

 

 

this was the attitude in the beginning and all peeps here carried both.

then the change came over them with the new rules and wallets got fatter, peeps got scared of losing stuff, and now it's nouvo to show a CCL , kinda like having a new man card but costlier

Edited by Bubbacs
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CCL only. I don't see a need for also carrying my now expired FOID. I guess I could carry it and if a gun shop clerk tells me it is invalid because it is expired, I'll just cough a few times and say because I have COVID19 I don't need to renew it, and he could check me out on the ISP website and see that this is true.

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I carry both. If I am pulled over and asked for my CCL I will have it. If I go to a range or gun store I show my FOID card. They dont need to know I carry.

 

 

this was the attitude in the beginning and all peeps here carried both.

then the change came over them with the new rules and wallets got fatter, peeps got scared of losing stuff, and now it's nouvo to show a CCL , kinda like having a new man card but costlier

 

I guess im old school then ;) 2 credit cards, FOID, CCL, and DL and thats it. A second wallet in my car with all the excess crap in it. No rubber bands needed for my wallet.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I carry both. For reasons mentioned above ... why show some ignorant clerk your CCL if you're just buying ammo? I also carry an automatic knife, which requires a FOID card. (I know, most police would understand that a CCL is golden, hopefully, but Barney Fife might not). But now the biggest reason I carry both ... my CCL is about to expire. (Again, I know, I know, most police should know a "COVID" expiration date, but will the ignorant clerk selling me ammo?). I've taken the CCL Renewal course, applied with diploma, back in July. But I expect my renewal CCL will show up long after my current one expires.

 

Speaking of long time waits for FOID, CCL and renewals ... I just learned the great state of Illinois has redirected millions of dollars of application and renewal fees away from state police gun licensing improvements and moved the funds to other state needs. God, I love this state!

Edited by Tod
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I carry both. If I am pulled over and asked for my CCL I will have it. If I go to a range or gun store I show my FOID card. They dont need to know I carry.

 

 

this was the attitude in the beginning and all peeps here carried both.

then the change came over them with the new rules and wallets got fatter, peeps got scared of losing stuff, and now it's nouvo to show a CCL , kinda like having a new man card but costlier

 

I guess im old school then ;) 2 credit cards, FOID, CCL, and DL and thats it. A second wallet in my car with all the excess crap in it. No rubber bands needed for my wallet.

 

I do the same as well. No reason to lose "everything".

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I carry both, simply because when ISP audited our CCW business last year they were adamant that an individual had to carry both cards with them, and didn't seem to know or care about the statute change only requiring physical possession of CCW permit. If ISP FSB didn't know about the change, how many local/county LEOs are aware? Not worth the potential hassle, so I tell all my students to carry both their FOID and CCL.

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CCL in wallet...FOID in safe..

Why you ask?

Because since the change in the law that only requires you possess the CCL, this is what I do.

If I were to lose both cards because my wallet was lost/stolen...legally...its game-set-match. I wouldnt be able possess guns or ammo. I would have move everything to somebody elses house.

With the FOID safe..in the safe...If I lost my CCL, at least I can still legally have everything until it is replaced.

 

Ranges?

I go to two ranges. One only asks to see a FOID/CCL and doesnt hold on to it.

Another range will hold an ID.. But I always ask, and have always been granted, they they hold my DL rather than my CCL. I simply say if you guys lose it..I'd rather it be my DL because they are alot easier to replace. They ALWAYS agree.

 

Buying guns/ammo?

I have never found myself thinking...

Gee..I may stumble across one of the hundreds and hundreds of business that sell ammo..I should bring my FOID... /sarc

No..I know when I'm out to buy ammo or a firearm, and bring my FOID if needed.

 

Do I care about 'whipping out a CCL rather than FOID'?

No. Lets be real....

When I buy ammo...its tends to be at a gun shop. They guy I'm buying it from sometimes has an open sidearm on his hip. Do you think he is gonna care that I showed a CCL or FOID... I dont 'panic' because the 'gun shop' knows I have a CCL.

 

Walmart? I used to use my FOID(when they sold pistol/rifle rounds)...a few times I used my CCL. No issues. They required the seller have a FOID. (Not any employee can open the ammo case and sell it. That person has to have a FOID). So even then, at walmart, you are dealing with somebody that understands. I've also had friendly gun-centric covos with walmart staff that sell the ammo.

 

Cabela's? (before the cook tax). I used my CCL. They guys at the counter were also gun nuts. I would have interesting conversations with them all the time. (Once, a salesman I always chatted with asked me "Wanna see something cool"? Me: Of course! He brings out ..HIS...skeletonized AR. It had to weigh bout 4lbs. )

I always looked forward to seeing alot of the staff at cabela's. Again this was before the ammo tax. I rarely go there anymore.

 

Any other gun shop? Again..its a freakin' GUN SHOP... Not worried about showing a CCL.

 

So...The bottom line is if you have to show any kind of firearm ID, it tends to be to people that are firearms type people as well.

I've never had anybody bat an eye, or make a comment when I use my CCL rather than a FOID.

 

This is my position..and I'm sticking to it... :)

 

 

 

 

To the bolded... what are you talking about? You're still valid... you're still a CCL and FOID holder... you just lost the cards, and are waiting on replacements. Both the FOID and CCL are still "active". They don't get revoked because your wallet got stolen or lost. At least as far as I know.

 

I had an ISP officer tell me a month or two back that I can even carry as long as the computer shows "Active" when they run you and see that you have a carry license. Say for example, if you forgot your wallet in the car, or at the house, or whatever, the cop just needs to see an "active" license. Obviously that's just anecdotal, and I guarantee not every LEO will say the same thing, but the point being, you don't have to move your guns, and you wouldn't "legally" have to remove everything from your possession. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I think what you stated in the bolded is absolutely false.

Edited by PezMar66
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CCL in wallet...FOID in safe..

Why you ask?

Because since the change in the law that only requires you possess the CCL, this is what I do.

If I were to lose both cards because my wallet was lost/stolen...legally...its game-set-match. I wouldnt be able possess guns or ammo. I would have move everything to somebody elses house.

With the FOID safe..in the safe...If I lost my CCL, at least I can still legally have everything until it is replaced.

 

To the bolded... what are you talking about? You're still valid... you're still a CCL and FOID holder... you just lost the cards, and are waiting on replacements. Both the FOID and CCL are still "active". They don't get revoked because your wallet got stolen or lost. At least as far as I know.

 

I had an ISP officer tell me a month or two back that I can even carry as long as the computer shows "Active" when they run you and see that you have a carry license. Say for example, if you forgot your wallet in the car, or at the house, or whatever, the cop just needs to see an "active" license. Obviously that's just anecdotal, and I guarantee not every LEO will say the same thing, but the point being, you don't have to move your guns, and you wouldn't "legally" have to remove everything from your possession. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I think what you stated in the bolded is absolutely false.

 

Look at the back of your CCL.

As far as I know, there is no exemption for lost/stolen or "I left it at home in my other wallet".

 

When mine were both stolen in January 2016, I was advised by ISP (a phone call to Springfield) that I should NOT carry until a new card was in my possession. I was also unable to purchase ammo or guns and I was unable to go to my local range for practice or even look at/handle a firearm at an Illinois FFL. It was OK to keep them at my home, even though no one else here had a FOID.

 

It took ages to get replacement cards, even with assistance from Molly.

I survived...

I still carry both at all times.

 

Link to IL Criminal Code 2012

 

While I respect nearly all LEOs, it is not to be expected they all know the intricacies of the laws they enforce. I suppose there are some that would cut you a break and others who would hold you to the letter of the law.

 

If there have been changes... please post!

Edited by soundguy
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CCL in wallet...FOID in safe..

Why you ask?

Because since the change in the law that only requires you possess the CCL, this is what I do.

If I were to lose both cards because my wallet was lost/stolen...legally...its game-set-match. I wouldnt be able possess guns or ammo. I would have move everything to somebody elses house.

With the FOID safe..in the safe...If I lost my CCL, at least I can still legally have everything until it is replaced.

 

To the bolded... what are you talking about? You're still valid... you're still a CCL and FOID holder... you just lost the cards, and are waiting on replacements. Both the FOID and CCL are still "active". They don't get revoked because your wallet got stolen or lost. At least as far as I know.

 

I had an ISP officer tell me a month or two back that I can even carry as long as the computer shows "Active" when they run you and see that you have a carry license. Say for example, if you forgot your wallet in the car, or at the house, or whatever, the cop just needs to see an "active" license. Obviously that's just anecdotal, and I guarantee not every LEO will say the same thing, but the point being, you don't have to move your guns, and you wouldn't "legally" have to remove everything from your possession. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I think what you stated in the bolded is absolutely false.

 

Look at the back of your CCL.

 

As far as I know, there is no exemption for lost/stolen or "I left it at home in my other wallet".

 

When mine were both stolen in January 2016, I was advised by ISP (a phone call to Springfield) that I should NOT carry until a new card was in my possession. I was also unable to purchase ammo or guns and I was unable to go to my local range for practice or even look at/handle a firearm in Illinois. It was OK to keep them at my home, even though no one else here had a FOID.

 

It took ages to get replacement cards, even with assistance from Molly.

I survived...

 

I still carry both at all times.

 

Link to IL Criminal Code 2012

 

I was more commenting to the idea that he has to remove his firearms from his possession. The CCL stuff was just anecdotal based on my experience with one single ISP LEO, which is why I stated as much in my original post, and I wouldn't trust it based only upon that one interaction.

 

He doesn't have to take all his firearms and move them to someone who has a FOID. That's the only point I was making. He's still a valid licensee. They're not revoked because he lost them, or they were stolen.

 

Obviously anything that requires a FOID you won't be able to do. I'd never argue against that. It would impact your ability to go to a store and handle/purchase firearms, and possibly the range, depending on if they require a FOID, but it would not impact your ability to keep your firearms in your possession at your home.

And I'll look at the back of my CCL once I finally get the damn thing. I just went QC_Verified, so should be soon! Hopefully... :laugh: :clap:

 

My plan is to carry the CCL at all times, and the FOID when I'm going to the range or to make a purchase.

Edited by PezMar66
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Because since the change in the law that only requires you possess the CCL, this is what I do.

If I were to lose both cards because my wallet was lost/stolen...legally...its game-set-match. I wouldn't be able possess guns or ammo. I would have move everything to somebody else's house.

 

I was more commenting to the idea that he has to remove his firearms from his possession. The CCL stuff was just anecdotal based on my experience with one single ISP LEO, which is why I stated as much in my original post.

 

He doesn't have to take all his firearms and move them to someone who has a FOID. That's the only point I was making. He's still a valid licensee. They're not revoked because he lost them, or they were stolen.

 

Obviously anything that requires a FOID you won't be able to do. I'd never argue against that. It would impact your ability to go to a store and handle/purchase firearms, and possibly the range, depending on if they require a FOID, but it would not impact your ability to keep your firearms in your possession at your home.

 

Gotcha!

 

I think it's important to be really clear on FOID/CCL restrictions...

I obviously misread your post. It's possible others could could do the same!

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Because since the change in the law that only requires you possess the CCL, this is what I do.

If I were to lose both cards because my wallet was lost/stolen...legally...its game-set-match. I wouldn't be able possess guns or ammo. I would have move everything to somebody else's house.

 

I was more commenting to the idea that he has to remove his firearms from his possession. The CCL stuff was just anecdotal based on my experience with one single ISP LEO, which is why I stated as much in my original post.

 

He doesn't have to take all his firearms and move them to someone who has a FOID. That's the only point I was making. He's still a valid licensee. They're not revoked because he lost them, or they were stolen.

 

Obviously anything that requires a FOID you won't be able to do. I'd never argue against that. It would impact your ability to go to a store and handle/purchase firearms, and possibly the range, depending on if they require a FOID, but it would not impact your ability to keep your firearms in your possession at your home.

 

Gotcha!

 

I think it's important to be really clear on FOID/CCL restrictions...

I obviously misread your post. It's possible others could could do the same!

 

 

That's fair. Yeah, and for that reason, I'll clarify again. My only intention was to point out that he doesn't have to remove his weapons from his possession based upon a lost FOID. He's still a valid licensee.

 

The CCL thing was simply an anecdotal experience with one single State cop, who I was talking to at a gas station a month or so back, and I wouldn't trust that myself, based simply on one interaction. As you said, I'm sure one officer may cut you a break, and others may not. Similar to a fishing license. One DNR officer may let you go once they've run you and found that you have an active license, where others may write you a ticket for not having it on your person like you should. Obviously the best course of action is to always carry it. I actually keep a digital copy of all that kind of stuff on my phone in an encrypted/secured folder, just as a precaution.

Edited by PezMar66
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(g) A licensee shall possess a license at all times the licensee carries a concealed firearm except:

 

 

(h) If an officer of a law enforcement agency initiates an investigative stop, including but not limited to a traffic stop, of a licensee or a non-resident carrying a concealed firearm under subsection (e) of Section 40 of this Act, upon the request of the officer the licensee or non-resident shall disclose to the officer that he or she is in possession of a concealed firearm under this Act, or present the license upon the request of the officer if he or she is a licensee or present upon the request of the officer evidence under paragraph

 

Left in the car, left at home, forgot or lost will not fly as the statute is written.

Will your buddy who works for the ISP for 50 years give you a break, who knows!

If only having to look at a computer and reading the words “Active” we what the statute stated, then the ISP FSB could save millinoins on NOT printing a card!

If the instructor did not tell you to have the license on you at all times while carrying, you should report him/her.

 

IANAL but IAAI

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(g) A licensee shall possess a license at all times the licensee carries a concealed firearm except:

 

 

(h) If an officer of a law enforcement agency initiates an investigative stop, including but not limited to a traffic stop, of a licensee or a non-resident carrying a concealed firearm under subsection (e) of Section 40 of this Act, upon the request of the officer the licensee or non-resident shall disclose to the officer that he or she is in possession of a concealed firearm under this Act, or present the license upon the request of the officer if he or she is a licensee or present upon the request of the officer evidence under paragraph

 

Left in the car, left at home, forgot or lost will not fly as the statute is written.

Will your buddy who works for the ISP for 50 years give you a break, who knows!

If only having to look at a computer and reading the words “Active” we what the statute stated, then the ISP FSB could save millinoins on NOT printing a card!

If the instructor did not tell you to have the license on you at all times while carrying, you should report him/her.

 

IANAL but IAAI

 

 

Again, the CCL thing was simply an anecdotal experience I had with a LEO with the ISP at a gas station when I was talking to him. It was just me stating an experience I had.

 

My comment to that post was to point out that he doesn't have to remove all his firearms from his possession at his home because he lost his FOID, or it was stolen. He's still an active licensee. His FOID is not revoked on account of him losing it or it being stolen.

Edited by PezMar66
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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi all,

 

Did not know we can lawfully carry a switchblade (automatic knife now). When did this happen and what are restrictions or limits. I was studying heavily for sown IT certifications and night classes with full time job. So I am now reading a lot of the IC posts and this caught my attention.

 

Thanks in advance for the replies I get.

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Hi all,

Did not know we can lawfully carry a switchblade (automatic knife now). When did this happen and what are restrictions or limits. I was studying heavily for sown IT certifications and night classes with full time job. So I am now reading a lot of the IC posts and this caught my attention.

Thanks in advance for the replies I get.

Switchblade law is not preempted like CCW is, so it's still a hodgepodge of local laws you have to deal with.

It was maybe a couple of years ago. FOID required but as Fife said, no preemption and different laws different places. Dont know if stickied but we had a pretty long thread regarding the different laws in different muni codes. Edited by InterestedBystander
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Thanks I'll look for it but with no preemption enough said. I live in Chicago.... I'll look for that thread just for curiousity.

Thanks

Edit: It became public act 8/11/2017 SB0607. Was almost passed earlier but a person in Chicago got stabbed with an auto knife which in turn got some of the ILGA in a tizzy.

 

https://www.ilga.gov/legislation/BillStatus.asp?DocNum=607&GAID=14&DocTypeID=SB&LegId=100589&SessionID=91&GA=100

 

Thread may be archived which can be a bit more challenging when searching.

 

edit: Pinned thread in Back Room

http://illinoiscarry.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=66462

Edited by InterestedBystander
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  • 9 months later...

Had to look this up as I recall reading this topic before.

So I went to look at a project I'm working on in Kentucky and Tennessee, Walked around the city and with all the crowds around the streets I was paying for something and I thought I put my two cardholders and $$ in my cargo shorts pocket. Went to my car drove to the Hotel and quickly realized I lost my card pack that had both my FOID and CCL. Panic set in and after several hours of back tracking and calling one store I shopped, I looked on the side of my car seat and WOW!. I found it had somehow fell out. I attributed it to me pulling my handkerchief out and it pulled it out too.

 

So now I ponder.... Do I carry pix of cards on my phone, carry FOID or carry CC while still possessing a handgun out of state?

I guess I lean towards having pix, carry CCL and keep FOID at home.

State trooper asking for CCL may accept my dilemma with pix.

I can at least have FOID back home.

Maybe keep CCL in secured car safe when traveling and if stopped for protecting my family in streets I claim it's in my car??

post-1621-0-79199800-1624932790_thumb.jpg

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Had to look this up as I recall reading this topic before.

So I went to look at a project I'm working on in Kentucky and Tennessee, Walked around the city and with all the crowds around the streets I was paying for something and I thought I put my two cardholders and $$ in my cargo shorts pocket. Went to my car drove to the Hotel and quickly realized I lost my card pack that had both my FOID and CCL. Panic set in and after several hours of back tracking and calling one store I shopped, I looked on the side of my car seat and WOW!. I found it had somehow fell out. I attributed it to me pulling my handkerchief out and it pulled it out too.

 

So now I ponder.... Do I carry pix of cards on my phone, carry FOID or carry CC while still possessing a handgun out of state?

I guess I lean towards having pix, carry CCL and keep FOID at home.

State trooper asking for CCL may accept my dilemma with pix.

I can at least have FOID back home.

Maybe keep CCL in secured car safe when traveling and if stopped for protecting my family in streets I claim it's in my car??

attachicon.gifcards.jpg

Trifold wallet, fully loaded, goes in my left front jeans pocket and nothing else EVER goes in there. It's hard for even me to pull it out. EDC knife, flashlight and multi-tool (Leatherman Flair) go in the right front pocket. Keys on a sturdy belt loop. Anything else goes in a zipped jacket/vest pocket.

 

I've had the same routine for well over 50 years. Always know where each item is. Never lost a wallet.

 

I have pix and carry both FOID and CCL.

 

As MRE wrote: Pictures of your card on your phone are not sufficient. By law you have to be in possession of the actual card.

Edited by soundguy
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Pictures of your card on your phone are not sufficient. By law you have to be in possession of the actual card. The electronic FOID card would fix this (through an app, still not just a picture). Its been proposed and stalled for a handful of years now, never passed, and unfortunately was attached to HB562 this year.so if it passes this year so does a lot of other bad stuff.

 

Whether an out of State officer would know this is unknown. The question you have to ask yourself is do you want to take that risk

Edited by MRE
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  • 3 weeks later...

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