TyGuy Posted May 17, 2014 at 01:47 AM Share Posted May 17, 2014 at 01:47 AM http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/05/17/a6yvyza4.jpg The funny thing is that they had official signs previously. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjurczak Posted May 17, 2014 at 01:48 AM Share Posted May 17, 2014 at 01:48 AM Fabric store huh...might get high on the glue fumes and shoot the place up I'm afraid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spanishjames Posted May 17, 2014 at 02:00 AM Share Posted May 17, 2014 at 02:00 AM Looks legit to me. I'm getting really tired of those signs. Not because I can't carry there, but because most of those who post think it'll protect them from criminals. They have no clue about the law, nor who the sign really restricts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TyGuy Posted May 17, 2014 at 02:08 AM Author Share Posted May 17, 2014 at 02:08 AM I would advise against carrying there. But it is unquestioningly NOT an official sign. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G214me Posted May 17, 2014 at 02:15 AM Share Posted May 17, 2014 at 02:15 AM Maybe some vandal removed the official sign and they ended up with that thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjurczak Posted May 17, 2014 at 02:20 AM Share Posted May 17, 2014 at 02:20 AM I kind of wish there wasn't all this talk of an official sign, but I get it I guess. I say we get change the law to read a 1 foot diameter red circle with red slash through a black silhouette of a handgun. No words, and so big nobody could possibly miss it! And business owners would think twice about putting up a 1 foot diameter sign on their doors. They'd have to be VERY serious about protecting their customers lives! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeavyDuty Posted May 17, 2014 at 02:32 AM Share Posted May 17, 2014 at 02:32 AM http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/05/17/a6yvyza4.jpg The funny thing is that they had official signs previously. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HDClose enough for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharz96 Posted May 17, 2014 at 03:01 AM Share Posted May 17, 2014 at 03:01 AM I'm getting to where I hate all of the red slash "no" signs. It always takes that split second of anxiety to identify what the black thing inside is. And more than that if it's a whole string of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRJ Posted May 17, 2014 at 03:16 AM Share Posted May 17, 2014 at 03:16 AM I'm getting to where I hate all of the red slash "no" signs. It always takes that split second of anxiety to identify what the black thing inside is. And more than that if it's a whole string of them. This.I saw a "this vehicle does not turn right on red" with red circle slash over a right turn arrow type sticker on a truck and got pissy while driving. Then I saw it was a benign sign. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockerXX Posted May 17, 2014 at 03:17 AM Share Posted May 17, 2014 at 03:17 AM But it is unquestioningly NOT an official sign. Personally I beg to differ or at least would error VERY heavily on the side of caution at this point based on the ISP's proposed rules and the already adapted jcar rules... Remember the sign design is NOT mandated in the law itself, it's up to the ISP rules to define the sign design... The adapted jcar rules allow for signage to be bigger then the 4x6 size if the venue wants, even though this is contrary to the law...http://www.ilga.gov/commission/jcar/admincode/020/020012310C01500R.html And the 'new' ISP proposed rules define the sign more generically, notice the proposed rules do not mandate their template be used, instead they have made a more generic definition of simply a black handgun in a red slashed circle.. Note even the mandated inclusion of the 'Pursuant to' text in the new rules is kind of wishy washing, there is also no mention of the black border...https://ccl4illinois.com/ccw/Public/Signage.aspx The Illinois State Police has proposed rules which require a white background; no text (except the reference to the Illinois Code 430 ILCS 66/1) or marking within the one-inch area surrounding the graphic design; a depiction of a handgun in black ink with a circle around and diagonal slash across the firearm in red ink; and that the circle be 4 inches in diameter. The sign in its entirety will measure 4 inches x 6 inches. Based on the above the 'graphic area' would be the slashed circle/gun only, thus any text 1" away from the circle is acceptable or at least it might be, take away the 4x6 size mandate that is already in the jcar rules and consider even the ISPs own template is not compliant with the new proposed rules I would error highly on the side of caution at this time... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TyGuy Posted May 17, 2014 at 04:09 AM Author Share Posted May 17, 2014 at 04:09 AM The one link you provided states: Pursuant to Section 65(d) of the Firearm Concealed Carry Act, signs must be of a uniform design and the Illinois State Police is responsible for adopting rules for standardized signs. Uniform design Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TyGuy Posted May 17, 2014 at 04:09 AM Author Share Posted May 17, 2014 at 04:09 AM Doesn't matter - I wouldn't carry there anyway, but we need to get nailed down. Will there be ONE official template or is anything gonna go? Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockerXX Posted May 17, 2014 at 04:24 AM Share Posted May 17, 2014 at 04:24 AM The one link you provided states: Pursuant to Section 65(d) of the Firearm Concealed Carry Act, signs must be of a uniform design and the Illinois State Police is responsible for adopting rules for standardized signs. Yes, a uniform design specified and adapted by the ISP and that right now based on their new proposed rules would appear to simply be a generic "depiction of a handgun in black ink with a circle around and diagonal slash across the firearm in red ink" Doesn't matter - I wouldn't carry there anyway, but we need to get nailed down. Will there be ONE official template or is anything gonna go? Right now I would not gamble on the ISP sample template as being the one and only design they adopt, it appears to me the new rules the ISP is proposing is an attempt to broaden that scope of the sign to any red slashed circle and black gun depiction... As I said I would error heavily on the side of caution, the argument that that law says the sign must be this or that to be compliant is IMO flawed, the law allows for the design to change at will, the law does specify the size but it appears jcar doesn't care what the law says and permits larger signs... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Molly B. Posted May 17, 2014 at 05:14 AM Share Posted May 17, 2014 at 05:14 AM I'm getting to where I hate all of the red slash "no" signs. It always takes that split second of anxiety to identify what the black thing inside is. And more than that if it's a whole string of them. This.I saw a "this vehicle does not turn right on red" with red circle slash over a right turn arrow type sticker on a truck and got pissy while driving. Then I saw it was a benign sign. LOL in Springfield this week, all the "no left turn" and "no right turn" signs caught my attention for the same reason!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GAS3987 Posted May 17, 2014 at 11:53 AM Share Posted May 17, 2014 at 11:53 AM What type of gun is in that sign? I don't have one of them so I must be good to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TyGuy Posted May 17, 2014 at 12:39 PM Author Share Posted May 17, 2014 at 12:39 PM It's terribly ugly. Probably a Hi-Point. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnderCover Posted May 17, 2014 at 01:06 PM Share Posted May 17, 2014 at 01:06 PM I'm getting to where I hate all of the red slash "no" signs. It always takes that split second of anxiety to identify what the black thing inside is. And more than that if it's a whole string of them. This.I saw a "this vehicle does not turn right on red" with red circle slash over a right turn arrow type sticker on a truck and got pissy while driving. Then I saw it was a benign sign. "Funny you mentioned this...That sign is from a bus company "First Student" it's their company policy that all of their drivers cannot turn right on red/ a red light with their big buses, mini buses, suburbans and mini white and gray vans. This is for safety reasons to prevent accidents for the bus driver and the students on board. Statistics shows that lots of accidents happen turning right on red/ red lights. This is why the company chose not to turn on red to prevent accidents for the company. Not all bus companies do this. This is only "First Students" company policy. Think Safe and Be Safe! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tango7 Posted May 17, 2014 at 04:02 PM Share Posted May 17, 2014 at 04:02 PM As long as it meets the dimensional and content requirements it doesn't matter if it's a Beretta 92, a Chief's Special or a Hi-Point as pictured. I got upset with Joann when I asked why they don't sell wool and was told (by the never-left-the-city clerk) it was because wool harvesting wasn't animal friendly. Their logic concerning the source of raw materials must be right up there with their awareness of who that sign actually keeps out of their stores. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackbeard Posted May 17, 2014 at 04:24 PM Share Posted May 17, 2014 at 04:24 PM It could be argued that that is an official sign, since it meets the verbal definition given by ISP, even if it doesn't match the PDF that ISP has produced. I wouldn't carry there. Nor would I ever enter a fabric store, but that's another matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockerXX Posted May 17, 2014 at 07:33 PM Share Posted May 17, 2014 at 07:33 PM Nor would I ever enter a fabric store, but that's another matter. Jo-Ann used to be a dedicated fabric store, but many of them now are full fledged craft/hobby stores like Hobby Lobby or Michaels... In my younger days (and even now), I can say if you are a guy that can sew (I can and I'm not ashamed I can) the ladies at these stores both employee and customer most of the time will all the sudden start flirting like wolves on a hunt... At least that has been my experience back in the day when they were dedicated fabric stores and hired people interested in sewing, not as much now that many are crafty stores with more generic employees... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Telecomtodd Posted May 17, 2014 at 11:57 PM Share Posted May 17, 2014 at 11:57 PM Joann's? That's a Mommies hangout. No guns are good guns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TyGuy Posted May 18, 2014 at 12:48 AM Author Share Posted May 18, 2014 at 12:48 AM I went with my wife. She is making a Transformers house for our son for his birthday. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neumann Posted May 18, 2014 at 03:12 AM Share Posted May 18, 2014 at 03:12 AM As long as it meets the dimensional and content requirements it doesn't matter if it's a Beretta 92, a Chief's Special or a Hi-Point as pictured. I got upset with Joann when I asked why they don't sell wool and was told (by the never-left-the-city clerk) it was because wool harvesting wasn't animal friendly. Their logic concerning the source of raw materials must be right up there with their awareness of who that sign actually keeps out of their stores.Mutton is not animal-friendly, but shearing harms nothing. I suppose their employees don't get haircuts. Same thing. Do you think Berettas are too dangerous looking for children and their nannies to see? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Fife Posted May 18, 2014 at 03:56 AM Share Posted May 18, 2014 at 03:56 AM Which fabric is that sign made out of anyway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobapunk Posted May 19, 2014 at 03:11 AM Share Posted May 19, 2014 at 03:11 AM I would advise against carrying there. But it is unquestioningly NOT an official sign. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD What is wrong with it? I can't tell the size, but all the visual elements are there... Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TyGuy Posted May 19, 2014 at 04:29 AM Author Share Posted May 19, 2014 at 04:29 AM It's not the template the ILSP gave. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GT1 Posted May 19, 2014 at 08:46 AM Share Posted May 19, 2014 at 08:46 AM Close enough for me to call that one official. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xwing Posted May 19, 2014 at 01:39 PM Share Posted May 19, 2014 at 01:39 PM Jo-Ann Fabrics is extremely anti-gun. It looks like they were tired of picking on Berettas, and decided to pick on Hi-Points instead. But they truly hate our 2nd amendment. A while ago, I built a soft-sided rifle case with fabric & supplies from there. Not sure what I'll do if I need to make another one, since I'm not aware of any local competitors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagt48 Posted May 19, 2014 at 02:16 PM Share Posted May 19, 2014 at 02:16 PM I'm not sure why, but I have seen different ones as well. Not the "no flare guns/space blasters/Walther P-5-ish" sign that you saw Ty, but my work's signs have a 1911 silhouette. All of the ones in Chicago I have seen have the Beretta like the original sign's design. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Harley Posted May 19, 2014 at 05:13 PM Share Posted May 19, 2014 at 05:13 PM Nor would I ever enter a fabric store, but that's another matter. Jo-Ann used to be a dedicated fabric store, but many of them now are full fledged craft/hobby stores like Hobby Lobby or Michaels... In my younger days (and even now), I can say if you are a guy that can sew (I can and I'm not ashamed I can) Ha Ha we were late to church yesterday because my oldest daughter had a wardrobe malfunction on her sun dress. She got a dress that matched her twin sisters and got her size but didn't try it on, well my wife dressed the twins so Nat decided to wear hers at the last min and it hung way too low so I had to dig out the old singer and take in the straps, luckily it already had pink thread in it LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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