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Time to Ruffle Some Feathers


JR1987

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First and foremost this is a vent post. If you don't want to get a little hot, then step out the way. I've had a rough day to begin with, and its only being made worse. I'll clarify this, I wont swear, and I wont insult anyone. I am going to lay down some heavy criticism though.

 

Down State Boys:

 

To put it nicely, you are just as bad as the Chicago Democrats up here, not in a political way, but in the way you treat people.

 

"up state" people think you're all Hill Billy's and rednecks, and not in a good way.

 

Recently, I have seen a bit of hostility to folks up north, the same kind that down state folks receive. You are doing the exact same thing that is being done to you.

 

It always seems like the oppressed become the oppressors. This childish "he started it" attitude is not helping, at all.

 

To be clear, I don't mind the "well fine, cut Chicago out, they are holding us back" attitude. I support it, heck I encourage it. But some of the recent remarks in regards to "up state" people have been hostile, and I'm beginning to feel like us Cook County and north eastern folks are not very welcome in this fight.

 

You think you down state people bang your heads against the wall? Jesus man, you don't know what its like being a pro rights person up here. People flinch at the site of live ammunition. There's a reason there are only a few indoor pistol ranges up here. We need some place private to go and enjoy our hobby and rights.

 

To try to convince these people that a .22 rifle is for children to learn on... you think you suggested slaughtering their children and sacrificing them to Satan.

 

You want to cut Chicago out and pass the legislation, fine by me. I don't mind, I understand, I even support it.

 

But the comments in regards to us in terms of "goodness" or how hard we work... that's pissing me off.

 

As a gun rights advocate up north, I feel totally alienated and isolated, BY MY OWN PEOPLE!

 

It only encourages my "let em fight among themselves and watch" attitude. I joined this site because I decided "I want to help win this fight any way I can". For a long time I was merely silent and only looked out for my own interest without thinking of others. But some of the comments by down state boys that have been made are only encouraging me to go back to that isolated hermit mentality.

 

If this isn't a team effort, then bleep it. I don't mind being thrown under the bus for the cause; I really don't. But damnit man! Don't do it and say "haha, the 'good' Chicago' people can't hold their own..."

 

You come up here and fight, then talk to me.

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i'm a down state boy and Although I don't think I have ever made any negative or deragatory comments about Chicago people on here, I do in real life because I hate the town and GENERALLY hate the people. Now with that being said, some of my closest friends from college came down from Chicago. So I get that good people get stuck in a bad situationand that is why I try not to use the broad brush on here. Because when I refer to the People's republic of Chitcago, I am refering to the corrupt and those that either dont care or are to damn lazy to help remove the corupt. If you are in this fight those comments dont apply to you, you are a good guy stuck in a bad situation and I have the upmost respect for you because you care and aren't too lazy to do something about it.

 

 

Also, on a side note, we dont mind being called rednecks even if it's not in the good way. I personally dont care what people call me as long as it's not late for dinner. ;)

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Those feathers have been ruffled before, JR. If you look back through the posts here, from the beginning

there has been the frustration between north/south of whatever boundary you want to pick.

Those who have been in the fight for years understand what you face and are darn proud to have you throw

your lot in with us.

 

Just like we need to give you room to vent, please do likewise with those who are frustrated at being

held back by Cook Co./Chicago. Like family, we pop off at each other but in the long run we're all in this

together!

 

We've been working hard to build a network of support in Cook Co./Chicago and it is growing everyday.

We will continue to build that network until the job of restoring the Right to Carry in IL is done.

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Those feathers have been ruffled before, JR. If you look back through the posts here, from the beginning

there has been the frustration between north/south of whatever boundary you want to pick.

Those who have been in the fight for years understand what you face and are darn proud to have you throw

your lot in with us.

 

Just like we need to give you room to vent, please do likewise with those who are frustrated at being

held back by Cook Co./Chicago. Like family, we pop off at each other but in the long run we're all in this

together!

 

We've been working hard to build a network of support in Cook Co./Chicago and it is growing everyday.

We will continue to build that network until the job of restoring the Right to Carry in IL is done.

 

 

well said. I like the part " Like family" we are like a family and we put the fun back in disfunctional LOL

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You promised not to cuss but you said the H word tongue.png

 

Seriously though, here's my position. I'm done with Chicago. That is all I have to say about that. Now be nice kids

 

If you burn those bridges, get used to disappointment. Gonna have to demote you back to grasshopper!

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I don't mind the frustration, at all. I wouldn't even mind being thrown under the bus and left behind on CCW.

 

But for people to mouth off that I don't carry my weight, or I'm "good" (good being used sarcastically) is absolutely asinine.

 

I understand how frustrated people are. I'm not trying to target specific people, I just would appreciate some understanding. Honestly, if people up here aren't wanted in the fight, that's cool. I'll go back to my hermit isolationist philosophy. It's gotten me by for a long time now, and kept me out of a lot of trouble.

 

The venting doesn't bother me, but it seems to be more than venting at times. It seems that some people down state do not want have any respect for people up north. If we aren't in this together, then I don't know why we call this site Illinois Carry.

 

I've enjoyed my time here, honestly I have. But it seems at times there is something more than just venting.

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But for people to mouth off that I don't carry my weight, or I'm "good" (good being used sarcastically) is absolutely asinine.

 

Please realize those comments are not directed at you personally - they are directed at those who will not get in the fight to save their own lives. You are definitely not one of those.

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You promised not to cuss but you said the H word tongue.png

 

Seriously though, here's my position. I'm done with Chicago. That is all I have to say about that. Now be nice kids

 

Believe me, I understand your strong distaste for Chicago. I really do, and I don't disagree with your choice.

 

But please, don't ever say that those of us living up here aren't carrying our weight, or that we are not good people but "good" people.

 

I understand the frustration, and I can agree with it and encourage it. But if I'm going to be sacrificed so others can carry, don't tell me I didn't do my part.

 

It's like Wake Island up here. Cut off from any support, and left to die. I don't mind that, but to say we have not done our share...?

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But for people to mouth off that I don't carry my weight, or I'm "good" (good being used sarcastically) is absolutely asinine.

 

Please realize those comments are not directed at you personally - they are directed at those who will not get in the fight to save their own lives. You are definitely not one of those.

 

But keep in mind that those people some are calling "lazy" or "stupid" aren't going to be wooed to our way of thinking when approached in that manner.

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I don't mind the frustration, at all. I wouldn't even mind being thrown under the bus and left behind on CCW.

 

But for people to mouth off that I don't carry my weight, or I'm "good" (good being used sarcastically) is absolutely asinine.

 

I understand how frustrated people are. I'm not trying to target specific people, I just would appreciate some understanding. Honestly, if people up here aren't wanted in the fight, that's cool. I'll go back to my hermit isolationist philosophy. It's gotten me by for a long time now, and kept me out of a lot of trouble.

 

The venting doesn't bother me, but it seems to be more than venting at times. It seems that some people down state do not want have any respect for people up north. If we aren't in this together, then I don't know why we call this site Illinois Carry.

 

I've enjoyed my time here, honestly I have. But it seems at times there is something more than just venting.

 

 

To be honest I lost my faith in chicago a long time ago, then I found this site and it has restored some of that faith when I see so many " up staters" supporting the same things I do. This fight depends on the people from there, you guys are on the front lines. What can I do my reps have ALWAYS supported RTC and there is only so much I can do with reps not in my area because they "hear" but do not listen.

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I don't think the down state folks are lazy, or any less hardworking. They've done their part, its a team effort.

 

I fight like heck up here, but there's no support, and my Wake Island reference is very real. In this fight, people up here are totally alone. You guys can't do anything from down there, and we can't get anymore support from people up here.

 

I'd support compromise because I know eventually people up here will see "wow... so guns aren't evil?". It takes time, and they'll need to be slowly introduced to it. It will happen.

 

I don't mind waiting. But when I hear "can't carry their own" or " 'good' people" (being used sarcastically) it bothers me. Imagine waking up and thinking "Well... all alone again". I bang my head against the wall EVERY SINGLE time I contact my reps. Call's are the only time I get a response and it's usually "thanks" and then click. Letters and emails go ignored, completely. ;)

 

The response I got from the President of my University was the ONLY encouraging response I got. Not because he supported it, but because he at least said "hey, I got your letter. You made good points. I disagree with you, and here is why. Thank you for writing me, I appreciate your concern".

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Let's get something straight. I know that YOU members here that are from Chicago are doing everything you can but I'm talking about the people of Chicago as a whole. Those streets should be filled at SAFR. But they won't be, it's over it's gone, the tyrrants have been in control for too long and have too much power. Now they are re-districting and not only are we not getting closer to chicago being it's own state but they are now going to have even more power and influence.

 

Burn the bridges, grass hopper I am so be it.

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Let's get something straight. I know that YOU members here that are from Chicago are doing everything you can but I'm talking about the people of Chicago as a whole. Those streets should be filled at SAFR. But they won't be, it's over it's gone, the tyrrants have been in control for too long and have too much power. Now they are re-districting and not only are we not getting closer to chicago being it's own state but they are now going to have even more power and influence.

 

Burn the bridges, grass hopper I am so be it.

 

I agree. It will come to Chicago, but its gotta start somewhere and make its way in.

 

Hey, if CCW passes I just may consider moving down south to carry ;) .

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You guys can't do anything from down there,

 

SAFR and just about every other thing pro-2A in Chicago is ran by a 5' sweet heart from South of I-70 and it wouldn't happen without her. That's why they call her the unsinkable Molly B. thumbsup.png

 

Well the wording is bad, but I was referring to the average every day voter. You can't come up here and change everyone's mind up here.

 

Basically, you guys have done just about everything you can do. I appreciate all the effort.

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JR,

 

I feel your pain. I grew up near 109th & pulaski. Throughout the years, I've met/talked with ppl that live in a Chicagoland/suburbia "bubble". It is OUR JOBS, as IlliniosCarry members and advocates of the 2nd Ammendment, to talk with these ppl & hopefully persuade them to support or at least acknowledge the cause. I personally love Chicago [flamesuit ON]. What I don't care for are the ppl in Chicago who "vote for a living", lib media, unions, lib pols, etc..that BRAINWASH the masses into thinking guns=crime/ problems, etc. I could go on about how lefties are responsible for the current state of affairs in IL too but thats getting off topic. Notice I didn't say lefties "in Chicago"? Granted they're the majority of the lefties but look at the poll numbers from Nov's election. The rest of the state has their fair share as well. If folks are dead set on voting (D) but happen to be gun owners (I know a few old co workers), at least try to get them to contact their Rep in support of RTC. After all, RTC is non-partisan. At least it's supposed to be... :Drunk emoticon:

 

Moving forward, It is crucial to our mission to educate the heck out of Cook county. Holding townhalls, keeping the legislators feet to the fire, SAFR, etc. I try to volunteer at most of these events and I'd encourage all of you in Cook to do the same. Speaking with friends and family is very important as well. I have a neighbor friend who voted (D) all her adult life who I worked on gradually, starting little brushfires here and there. Long story short, She voted for Brady back in Nov. Also, encourage those who don't vote, to do so. (provided they have a similar mindset as you, LOL).

 

Lastly, as of 2006, there were almost 100k foid holders in the city of Chicago. Surely those number have gone up since then. We need to get more of these folks to come out of the woodwork and get vocal/active. Strength in numbers.

 

P.S. Don't get Buzz started with those north of I80 remarks! ;)

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Here's my .02 fwiw...

 

I'm from Lake County, but was born in Chicago, raised just outside of Chicago, and still have plenty of family in Chicago, so I see both sides.

 

The fact is, people in the city of Chicago in particular are VERY dependant on governement, to a terrible fault. Almost leemings in nature. They allow and accept corruption, because at one time or another, they've benefitted. There is an entire scratch my back and they will scratch yours mentality, but don't buck the system or you will be left out in the dark. As a result, you are required to keep you mouth shut and follow the system.

 

When citizens complain to the alderman, the local rep for dowling out favors, they will do what they can to oil the squeeky wheel. Some aldermen used to get free spots at local big name universities that they'd give out for the most political impact, one of which was my cousin. Naturally, they will vote the machine platform no matter what.

 

That's just how it works. It's corrupt as heck, and either you live with it, or you are totally isolated and punished. So it's very hard for someone to stand up, unless you can get media attention to avoid retribution. This is one of the reasons why it's hard to develop a grass roots support for something like gun rights in the city when the leadership is dead set again. It forces a major show down and frankly most folks don't think it's worth it.

 

My uncle who lived in the city was a machinist, Nam Vet, and had quite a collection. He used to take me combat shooting right outside of the city. One day we got pulled over, they found the 1911's gave him a ticket, and confescated them. He told me later, he just called the alderman and got them back and the situation worked out. See, they rely on the alderman who cooperate jst enough to keep people happy, but make them feel it's not worth fighting the repression.

 

The bottom line is, this same logic permeates virtually every aspect of living in a totally corrupt society, which is exactly what exists in the city of Chicago. People have to survive and until there is enough ground swell support, you just won't get folks stick their necks too far out until there are safe numbers.

 

So, are folks in the city perpetuating the problem - Absolutely they are, but what choice do they have? they didn't coin the phrase, 'You can't fight city hall', from no where. You need alot of support to do so, and with the liberal media unwilling to jump in, it's real tough.

 

Being safely in Republican territory, I'm safe to push my support hard, without fear of retribution, but I do sympathize with thos in the city fighting the battle themselves. You have to realize, there are entire generations of law abiding citizens who have never touched a gun and just can't understand what the 2nd amendment means because the city leaders have made it that way.

 

As such, the rest of the good folks in the state really need to rally around those with the machine hammer over their heads - that is the only way we're going to solve the problem.

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Drylock:

 

The funny thing is. guys like him are slowly putting themselves and their unions out of work. The money ain't there anymore.

 

I can say that about the trucking industry. Driver's wont make what they used to, and will need to get used to a lesser standard for the time being.

 

The problem I have with unions isn't that they fight for their interests, its that they have become bullies who, with their high demands on pay and benefits, are slowly killing many people. Saw a commercial for pensions saying "don't cut my pension."

 

Sorry man, we are all taking cuts, everyone. My family has felt it, everyone has. Why should you be immune. Why should I keep digging myself in a ditch to support you?

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We're making inroads in Chicago, just ask the hand billers at the CTA stations from a few weeks ago about how they were received by the folks they encountered.

 

SAFR has drawn 3 to 5 hundred people. ANNUALLY!!

 

I remember when drawing 30 to 60 people to the counter demonstration to ICAHV's annual dog and pony show was a great day. In the late 1990's. I know, I helped organize, later completely organized them.

 

WHERE am I from? Born and raised in Chicago, when I moved out of Chicago and bought a home, I moved the smallest distance I could to freedom, the edge of DuPage county...

 

Don't judge the discourse here by a snapshot of the last few months: because things were whipped up for HB148, there's STILL a lot of venting going on by those that don't understand the results. Some have dared to hope that our long slog could be shortcut, first by the election, then by 148. Others that jumped on recently just don't understand how glacially slow the change can be. Nor how FAR we HAVE come.

 

My assessment is that we are at the 3/4 point. 15 years into a 20 year task, and if we get a reasonable victory in 2 or 3 years, we are ahead of schedule!!

 

People are feeding off each others venting.... cooler heads have to prevail.

That requires TOLERANCE, UNDERSTANDING and CIVILITY...

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You guys can't do anything from down there,

 

SAFR and just about every other thing pro-2A in Chicago is ran by a 5' sweet heart from South of I-70 and it wouldn't happen without her. That's why they call her the unsinkable Molly B. thumbsup.png

 

I don't think there's ANYONE here who lives further south than Molly B. yet she understands that without gaining the support of the voters in Chicago and Crook County, nothing happens in Illinois. Heck, Quinn only won 3 of 102 counties and still sits in the governor's seat. [Notice I did not call him the governor]

 

JR, you're a new guy here but I've been to the last three SAFR events and looking at who attends, it sure seems like the Chicago folks are underrepresented. I've been to the past 5 IGOLDs and even though Chicago and Crook County have the most voters, they are far outnumbered at IGOLD.

 

I'm Chicago born and raised. When we decided to have kids the wife and I moved to suburban Crook County to escape the failed Chicago school system and lived there for another 26 years. I understand the Chicago Machine.

 

We are in this together. We need to work together to regain our rights because hoping Crook County falls into Lake Michigan is a long shot.

 

I am now $00.02 poorer.

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Ya know, JR1987, I SEE what you are venting about.... (that's not to say I agree or disagree with you on other things)

 

And I too am getting a bit tired of reading/listening to USArmyRet stirring that pot.

 

He's (and a few others) REALLY tempting me to figure out how that IGNORE thing works. I extend a lot of tolerance for new folks and what they say, but after a while.....

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Mark:

 

I don't mind disagreement, but I am a firm believer in mutual respect. I understand the down south crowd saying "nuts to Chicago, lets get this going". But when I hear the anti north attitude, it bothers me. I'm a team player, how I was raised, and its how I work. If people don't want to play as a team, then like I said, bleep it.

 

Generally I've had nothing but positive experiences with everyone here. Even Army (actually I've only communicated with him once, and that one time I misread his comments, so that is just a friendly joke)

 

I am all for supporting CCW in anyway we deem necessary. But if us northern folk aren't welcome, then bleep it. I don't feel that way in general, I just wanted to defend those of us up here putting in efforts to write and call.

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Alright, tell ya what. I'll eat my words and retract my recent statements about Chicago. We got the chiefs, the Sgts and the transit unions. Let's double our efforts and find twice that many more endorsements. We can muster up enough strength to go one more round.

Chicago politicians want to play, ok let's play. No hard feelings I hope and my deepest appologies

 

Gloves off and let's finish this thing

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Chicago is what it is. If there wasn't any Chicago, this forum would probably not exist. The new mayor is as anti gun as the last one. Yet he should be occupied with actually straightening out Chicago's various issues. I will grant that out of the box he is talking the talk. IMO, Quinn is his puppet, so we'll just have to see how this plays out.
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I agree, they are losing ground slowly. Yeah, they are still in this fight but man. I've never seen so many people at local gun stores in my life in this area! More and more people are becoming aware, and while its still a minority up here, its an important one.

 

We need to find ways to reach out to these people and get them to join up. Get in contact with Cook County gun stores and say "hey, I know about this site called Illinois Carry and its fighting for our rights. You should talk to your customers about them". If we can get a sizable portion of that minority up here to join up, we could turn a lot of heads.

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