NRA-ILA Lobbied Against IL License to Carry Bill

[2nd amendment forever]

2nd Amendment, whether you supported 2257 or not, I can guarantee you that it's a fact that the NRA's lobbyist lobbied against 2257 and the ISRA's people did not. The ISRA is officially on board supporting the concept of a STHR bill. The only thing that would have taken them off that course would have been a preemptive bill with a chance of passing (and let's face it, all of us would have jumped ship to a preemptive bill if we'd thought it could pass!)

 

Question.......

 

Is Todd Vandermyde a lobbyist for the ISRA or the NRA???

 

Here's the answer to my own question:

 

http://www.isra.org/weblink_email/?index=3...%20-%2002-04-06

 

Send email to Todd Vandermyde

Todd Vandermyde is the NRA's lobbyist for Illinois.

 

So the ISRA was in favor of HB2257 and the NRA was against......

 

AND THE LOBBYIST IS THE SAME PERSON?????? :frantics: :frantics:

[Kenny]

Now that I've vented, how about something constructive. I'd like to see the NRA take HB2257 and go over it with a fine-toothed comb...adding, deleting, or modifying whatever is necessary for them to aggressively support it. However, it will have to remain a true STHR bill which needs only 60 votes. If they would do this, we can review it and see if we can come to terms of a compromise of sorts. Molly or anyone else willing to pursue this with the NRA?

 

 

I think that has been tried before all this went down & they didn't want anything to do with us.

 

The NRA will sit back & do nothing & when we get it close to going through they will step in & put their stamp on it & take all the credit for it. That is how the NRA works!! Look at the Heller case.

[Kenny]

2nd Amendment, whether you supported 2257 or not, I can guarantee you that it's a fact that the NRA's lobbyist lobbied against 2257 and the ISRA's people did not. The ISRA is officially on board supporting the concept of a STHR bill. The only thing that would have taken them off that course would have been a preemptive bill with a chance of passing (and let's face it, all of us would have jumped ship to a preemptive bill if we'd thought it could pass!)

 

Question.......

 

Is Todd Vandermyde a lobbyist for the ISRA or the NRA???

 

 

Todd is the lobbyist for the NRA the ISRA lobbyist is Rich Pearson but they must work together quite a bit.

[Chris]

2nd Amendment, whether you supported 2257 or not, I can guarantee you that it's a fact that the NRA's lobbyist lobbied against 2257 and the ISRA's people did not. The ISRA is officially on board supporting the concept of a STHR bill. The only thing that would have taken them off that course would have been a preemptive bill with a chance of passing (and let's face it, all of us would have jumped ship to a preemptive bill if we'd thought it could pass!)

 

Question.......

 

Is Todd Vandermyde a lobbyist for the ISRA or the NRA???

 

 

Todd is the lobbyist for the NRA the ISRA lobbyist is Rich Pearson

 

The ISRA also has Jim V and a new gentleman as well.

[2nd amendment forever]

Well, I'm disappointed, but I have to make a few comments. Mostly venting.

 

 

 

Now that I've vented, how about something constructive. I'd like to see the NRA take HB2257 and go over it with a fine-toothed comb...adding, deleting, or modifying whatever is necessary for them to aggressively support it. However, it will have to remain a true STHR bill which needs only 60 votes. If they would do this, we can review it and see if we can come to terms of a compromise of sorts. Molly or anyone else willing to pursue this with the NRA?[/color]

 

Nicely put!

[Chiburbian]

I have spent some time thinking about this, and I would like to say.

 

IF the NRA had said to us:

"We didn't think that STHR would bring LTC to the entire state much sooner than non-STHR would be possible, and by supporting it we would risk putting our members in a situation where they could be arrested and forced to defend themselves in costly legal battles that could have been averted if we had gone about bring LTC to Illinois a different way (that would take slightly longer). We are working on it, we believe we will be making progress soon, and we apologize if it appears that we are doing things contrary to your efforts."

 

I wouldn't have been that upset.

 

But they didn't, and I am. This whole thing unraveled poorly and it could have been avoided.

[2nd amendment forever]

2nd Amendment, whether you supported 2257 or not, I can guarantee you that it's a fact that the NRA's lobbyist lobbied against 2257 and the ISRA's people did not. The ISRA is officially on board supporting the concept of a STHR bill. The only thing that would have taken them off that course would have been a preemptive bill with a chance of passing (and let's face it, all of us would have jumped ship to a preemptive bill if we'd thought it could pass!)

 

Question.......

 

Is Todd Vandermyde a lobbyist for the ISRA or the NRA???

 

 

Todd is the lobbyist for the NRA the ISRA lobbyist is Rich Pearson but they must work together quite a bit.

 

And if that IS the case.....

 

Why didn't pearson inform us of what the NRA was doing????

[drdoom]

I guess the NRA is not used to The Chicago way of passing legislature

[Molly B.]

And if that IS the case.....

 

Why didn't pearson inform us of what the NRA was doing????

 

The answer to your question is that TVM, the contract lobbyist for the NRA, told us himself that he opposed the bill.

There was no need for anyone else to tell us.

 

And I want to add here that other than this one issue of which we disagree, TVM is one of the best lobbyist in the state.

He has worked hard with the three ISRA lobbyists and they have defeated many a bad gun bill as a team.

I have personally seen TVM in action in the Capitol - his work when toe to toe, nose to nose with the opposition, is both impressive and a work of art to behold.

 

Let's please try to keep this on topic - our disappointment with the NRA's stance.

[2nd amendment forever]

And if that IS the case.....

 

Why didn't pearson inform us of what the NRA was doing????

 

The answer to your question is that TVM, the contract lobbyist for the NRA, told us himself that he opposed the bill.

There was no need for anyone else to tell us.

 

And I want to add here that other than this one issue of which we disagree, TVM is one of the best lobbyist in the state.

He has worked hard with the three ISRA lobbyists and they have defeated many a bad gun bill as a team.

I have personally seen TVM in action in the Capitol - his work when toe to toe, nose to nose with the opposition, is both impressive and a work of art to behold.

 

Let's please try to keep this on topic - our disappointment with the NRA's stance.

 

1. When did tvm inform you about the NRA opposition to 2257?

 

2. Why is tvm listed right there on the left side of the homepage for ISRA, but nowhere is there anything about any ISRA lobbyists?

 

3. Appears to me that the ISRA is using the NRA lobbyist, plain and simple!

 

4. I'm planning on sending a "donation" to Valinda.....I'll be darned if I'm going to send either NRA or ISRA anything......

[GarandFan]

So the ISRA was in favor of HB2257 and the NRA was against......

 

3. Appears to me that the ISRA is using the NRA lobbyist, plain and simple!

 

4. I'm planning on sending a "donation" to Valinda.....I'll be darned if I'm going to send either NRA or ISRA anything......

 

 

Let's not get too frantic here, shall we not?

 

Vandermyde lobbies in Springfield on behalf of the NRA and its members in Illinois. The ISRA has separate lobbyists. They often work together, but Vandermyde does not work for ISRA in any formal lobbying capacity.

 

The ISRA has recently come out strongly in favor of right-to-carry in Illinois, and is now actively working toward that goal. However, I do not believe that the ISRA has ever officially supported HB2257. The flyer they sent out recently (last couple months) did not endorse any specific bill. In fact, I am not sure they have ever officially come out in support of any specific bill.

 

What I mean by "officially" or "formally" is some sort of public statement or news release in support of a specific bill. That said, the NRA has never "officially" or "formally" opposed HB2257. They are now officially neutral. I am not saying that "officially" means that other stuff doesn't go on behind the scenes.

 

Let's not get carried away with what we think we know. There are so many emotions and hot heads flying around here lately that rumors will be spread too easily. Let's stick with what we know, and let's keep our thinking caps on.

[GWBH]

First, the NRA hardly needs to defend its record of preserving and expanding the right to carry firearms. We have been and will continue to be the national leader in ensuring that all law-abiding Americans eventually have access to this right.

 

Eventually!?!?

 

Yeah - I caught that too. Doesn't set well, does it?

I hope I'm alive long enough to see them EVENTUALLY come around.

Didn't think much of the way the letter was crafted either. Molly is no child and deserves much more respect.

[Molly B.]

"Why is tvm listed right there on the left side of the homepage for ISRA, but nowhere is there anything about any ISRA lobbyists?"

 

Those questions would have to be answered by the ISRA webmasters - those of us that have been around a long time know that Mr. Pearson, Mr. Vinopal, and Mr. Pugh are the ISRA lobbyists.

 

"Appears to me that the ISRA is using the NRA lobbyist, plain and simple!"

 

It could be said that we here at IllinoisCarry are using the ISRA lobbyists and NRA lobbyist. Again we are all on the same side, we just disagree strongly on this one issue. We normally work very well together with both those organizations and the IllinoisCarry leadership will continue to urge everyone to strive for that in the future.

 

"I'm planning on sending a "donation" to Valinda.....I'll be darned if I'm going to send either NRA or ISRA anything......"

 

You are welcome to do that and I assure you it would be put to good use. But please, please understand we at IllinoisCarry do not have a full time or even part-time lobbyist that can do the work of those on the ground in the Capitol. We cannot fund lawsuits like the one the ISRA is fighting in Chicago and the other one in Cook County. We help with the license to carry town hall meetings around the state, with IGOLD, and with the upcoming Second Amendment Freedom Rally in Chicago but we do not have a budget or funds to cover the costs of those events. The ISRA does with the support of its many thousands of members.

[GarandFan]

Yeah - I caught that too. Doesn't set well, does it?

I hope I'm alive long enough to see them EVENTUALLY come around.

 

It "sets" pretty reasonably if you employ some perspective. Over all the United States, look at the changes that have come in the past 20 years or so.

 

Yes, Illinois is way behind with regard to carry.

 

Sometimes I think people here are forgetting the reason why we are so far behind. It's not because of the NRA or the ISRA. To think that, or wish that, if flatly ridiculous.

 

The reasons are:

 

Joyce Foundation

Chicago politicians

Cook county politicians

Illinois Council to Prevent Handgun Violence

Legal Community Against Violence

Freedom States Alliance

The "Gun Guys"

Violence Policy Center

Brady Campaign

Mayors Against Illegal Guns

Coalition to Stop Gun Violence

Etc.

 

People, we need to have perspective, and we need to focus. Coming unglued at the NRA is really pretty foolish. I respect and appreciate the passion in here, but all this angst simply has to be turned and redirected to our real enemies.

[Kenny]

That is one other thing the ISRA has helped financially with a lot of events and even kicked in some $$ for signs when we were doing the Winnebago county thing. The most I have ever seen from the NRA is they sent some reporters to IGOLD this year. WOW!!! Thanks for all the help & support NRA!!

[2nd amendment forever]

 

How about the answer to question #1:

 

1. When did tvm inform you about the NRA opposition to 2257?

[Kenny]

 

How about the answer to question #1:

 

1. When did tvm inform you about the NRA opposition to 2257?

 

 

I heard it the night of the Sportsman's Caucus in Springfield along with a few others and relayed my findings on to Valinda. From there there was a lot of discussion between the mods and a few others heavily involved with this website about how to go about dealing with the NRA. It was tried to get it rectified and she had to resort to an Alert and call to action to get the word to the NRA that they were not just dealing with a few people with a website. Now the NRA is backpedaling a bit with this issue because they really had no idea how many people this website reaches.

[Molly B.]

 

How about the answer to question #1:

 

1. When did tvm inform you about the NRA opposition to 2257?

 

 

PM sent - this question has been addressed by TVM earlier in the discussion - I don't have the post number handy but will get it to you when I run across it.

 

I don't believe he did any behind the scenes shenanigans - he was very honest and forthright in his opposition.

 

Molly B.

[abolt243]

2. Why is tvm listed right there on the left side of the homepage for ISRA, but nowhere is there anything about any ISRA lobbyists?

 

C'mon man, take a breath and READ the page. The left side of the homepage for the ISRA very plainly says:

 

Capitol Commentary (the title of an article)

NRA LOBBYIST

Todd Vandermyde

 

It's a link to the article.

 

 

I'll ask the question again, Are you an ISRA member?? Are you an NRA member? With a handle like Second Amendment Forever how can you not be? Or is that just a cool handle??

 

Tim

[Don Gwinn]

Todd works for the NRA. The ISRA does employ lobbyists at the capitol, but not Todd. Obviously he and the ISRA and industry lobbyists work fairly closely, but he doesn't work for the ISRA.

[2nd amendment forever]

2. Why is tvm listed right there on the left side of the homepage for ISRA, but nowhere is there anything about any ISRA lobbyists?

 

C'mon man, take a breath and READ the page. The left side of the homepage for the ISRA very plainly says:

 

Capitol Commentary (the title of an article)

NRA LOBBYIST

Todd Vandermyde

 

It's a link to the article.

 

 

I'll ask the question again, Are you an ISRA member?? Are you an NRA member? With a handle like Second Amendment Forever how can you not be? Or is that just a cool handle??

 

Tim

 

I'll answer the question (again)

 

No

 

No

 

I'll support Illinois Carry, as I stated earlier, and as I've stated earlier, (somewhere), I don't support any "national" orgs, for the very simple reason that I prefer to keep my hard earned money "in house", as in "in Illinois", where it will be used for our benefit.

[GarandFan]

I am a bit surprised when I learn that gun owners serious about their rights aren't members of the national association, and their state association.

 

In some ways, it's hardly fair to engage in discussions of what they do or don't do if one isn't even a member.

 

My Grandfather, years ago, joked that voting gave him the right to gripe about politics. I know it's not technically so, but he did have a point.

[Tvandermyde]

For the record I "lobby" on behalf of NRA

 

ISRA has their own lobbyists which have been identified here

 

I chair the leg committee for the ISRA as a way to try and coordinate activities. It also gives me a forum to write my commentaries and newsletter columns without having to have all of them be approved by NRA ILA

 

The column reffered in the posts carries my NRA title becuase the prersident and I dissagreed about an issue and he didn't want it going out with ISRAs name for fear of legal trouble so they added my NRA title

 

The ISRA cuts out the amount of time it takes to get things in the public domain they can have sharper elbows and often says things or in ways some would not.

 

We can than have a fater response in cases and issue press releases about things that others do not notice while they are still timely

 

I don't think rich did anything against the bill. The statements actions and disscussions where mine before NRA changed positions

 

Now before anybody jumps up about some conspiricy, I have been working with the ISRA this way for a number of years we work together as a team some times we dissagree but we work as a team

 

But for those who will see people on the grassy knoll there will be no explination

 

And my name is todd vandermyde. One word on the last name with one capitol letter not TVM

 

If you must use a three letter acronym try my first name

[abolt243]

Yes, Illinois is way behind with regard to carry.

 

Sometimes I think people here are forgetting the reason why we are so far behind.

 

The reasons are:

 

Joyce Foundation

Chicago politicians

Cook county politicians

Illinois Council to Prevent Handgun Violence

Legal Community Against Violence

Freedom States Alliance

The "Gun Guys"

Violence Policy Center

Brady Campaign

Mayors Against Illegal Guns

Coalition to Stop Gun Violence

Etc.

 

Great list GF. If I may be so bold, here are some more reasons that we're behind in regards to LTC in IL:

 

Acevedo, Arroyo, Berrios, Brosnahan, Burke, Burns, Chapa Lavia, Collins, Colvin, Coulson, Crespo, Currie, M. Davis, W. Davis, Dunkin, Feigenholz, Flowers, Ford, Fritchey, Golar, Graham, Hamos, Harris, Hernandez, Howard, Jakobsson, Jefferson, Joyce, Madigan, May, Mendoza, Miller, Mulligan, Nekritz, Osterman, Rita, Scully, Soto, Turner, Washington, Yarbrough.

 

Oh, and don't forget: Collins, Crotty, Cullerton, DeLeo, Garret, Harmon, Hendon, Hunter, Kotowski, Lightford, Link, Maloney, Martinez, Meeks, Millner, Munoz, Raoul, Sandoval, Schoenberg, Silverstein, Trotter, and Viverito.

 

If those are your reps or Senators, or serve in districts near you, then you need to do all you can to see that they LOSE the next election that they run in. THEY are also the reason we don't have LTC in IL. One way to oppose them might be to contact Todd about his idea of Freedom Brigades.

 

Am I upset that the NRA and Todd Vandermyde don't hold the same position on STHR LTC that I do?? Damn Right!! But, that's one segment of the gun issues in IL. Here are a few issues on which we hold the same opinion: One gun a month, State Firearm Dealer's License, Private Sale NICS check, State Wide semi-auto ban, $1m insurance for gun owners, <10YO FOID training, .50 Cal ban, Civil liability for firearm sale, Statewide AWB, Firearm Storage Restrictions, 10 round mags, FOID revocation for failure to report lost or stolen guns in XX hours, Semi-Auto ban in Chicago Zip Codes, mandatory safety brochure with each gun sale, locks on ALL handgun sales, gun transfer database held by ISP.

 

Let's see, I'm upset/disappointed with the NRA/Todd's position on one issue, but we see very much eye to eye on what 15-20 issues introduced just this session?? Looks a little one sided to me. I think I'll stick with them a while longer and use my membership and relationships to try to win them to my way of thinking on the one issue we disagree on.

 

Don't get so blinded by one issue that you fail to see the big picture. The fact remains, if it wasn't for the NRA, ISRA, lobbyists and activists like us, all working together, private ownership of guns would just be a footnote in the history books.

 

Sit back, take a breath and get ready for the next push, SAFR!!

 

Tim

[2nd amendment forever]

I am a bit surprised when I learn that gun owners serious about their rights aren't members of the national association, and their state association.

 

In some ways, it's hardly fair to engage in discussions of what they do or don't do if one isn't even a member.

 

My Grandfather, years ago, joked that voting gave him the right to gripe about politics. I know it's not technically so, but he did have a point.

 

Well if your Grandfather's words aren't "technically so", than how can you state what you stated?

 

As for my not being a member of NRA or ISRA, I've been doing some research before deciding whether or not to join ISRA......

 

However.....

 

HOWEVER

 

This little matter of HB2257 and the NRA's opposition to it, until calls, faxes and emails starting coming in....

 

Can you say "back pedal"???

 

(btw, your PM box is full!)

[mikew]

And if that IS the case.....

 

Why didn't pearson inform us of what the NRA was doing????

2nd amendment forever:

You seem to be indicating that the actions of both of these organizations important to you,

I suggest that you join them.

 

There are many ISRA and NRA members here on Illinois Carry.

 

The ISRA represents the interests of Illinois gun owners as a whole,

but is not beholden to non-members,

and will listen to what you have to say, to a point [ie as a non-member].

 

If you're waiting until each of these organizations is perfect and without fault

before joining, then you are not going to join. But if you join, then you have a voice.

 

Regards,

Mike Weisman,

ISRA 1st Vice President

[2nd amendment forever]

And if that IS the case.....

 

Why didn't pearson inform us of what the NRA was doing????

2nd amendment forever:

You seem to be indicating that the actions of both of these organizations important to you,

I suggest that you join them.

 

There are many ISRA and NRA members here on Illinois Carry.

 

The ISRA represents the interests of Illinois gun owners as a whole,

but is not beholden to non-members,

and will listen to what you have to say, to a point [ie as a non-member].

 

If you're waiting until each of these organizations is perfect and without fault

before joining, then you are not going to join. But if you join, then you have a voice.

 

Regards,

Mike Weisman,

ISRA 1st Vice President

 

So my posted question won't be answered unless I join???

 

WOW

 

Guess the question "Is the ISRA beholden to the NRA?" won't be answered either????

[cherryriver]

To the lists of actual enemies that gun-right proponents have to confront, I will add the news profession, almost as a whole.

The garbage being spewed constantly by the Chicago Tribune, CNN, The New York Times, and so many more of their ilk gives rise to the credibility of the Violence Policy Centers and Father Pflegers.

There's a world of ignorance to combat, and education is the foundational element that is utterly critical.

Meanwhile, against my inclination and better judgement, I will take the chance of backstopping GarandFan and point this indisputable fact out:

No organization in the entire modern history of the world has done more to preserve and advance gun rights than the US National Rifle Association. None. In all of history, the only group that might compete would be the US' Founding Fathers.

Without the NRA, none of you here would own a gun at all. For those of you who are on the younger side, or weren't involved in the issue, the statists, very much in their ascendancy back in the 1960's, came perilously close to just plain eliminating the private ownership of firearms altogether. The evidence is in your wallet: the FOID card, the pre-registration the banners put in place specifically to ease confiscation. Along with the dozens of gun registration schemes of the day, it was a non-secret: registration was to save the police time and money and simplify the new world order.

In the darkest days of the late '60s and early '70s, the NRA was nearly all there was, and remains the most powerful progun organization in the world.

They've been wrong a million times, but right a billion. The Heller hesitation is to me, worse than any lone Illinois House bill, but it was a carefully thought-out, well-reasoned position put together by people who know more about beating back the anti-gunners than anyone else, period. That's a case where they were wrong, but looking at 5-4, it clearly wasn't completely wrong.

So was the position on 2257. It may have been wrong to some degree, and in the very special case of Illinois, as close as a dictatorship as exists in the US, it may well have had some merit. I don't see either direction as a slam dunk. Ohio didn't have Mike Madigan; Nebraska had Sebelius, not Blagojevich and Quinn and Daley. The doings here must be considered as different for those reasons, all by themselves.

Kill your allies at your own peril, and take special care not to confuse them with the real enemies like the Times and MSNBC and Obama, the ones who are working hard to do the real damage to gun rights.

[Ol'Coach]

Anybody here wanna see our 2nd Amendment rights recognized in Illinois?

 

Anybody here think any one organization can accomplish it alone?

 

Let's quit tryin' to find a scapegoat and get with it!!

[mikew]

So my posted question won't be answered unless I join???

 

WOW

 

Guess the question "Is the ISRA beholden to the NRA?" won't be answered either????

 

Which question? edit: You have asked a lot of questions, I think that most of them are answered.

 

As to this one:

"Is the ISRA beholden to the NRA?"

 

I will paraphrase and add to Todd's answer:

The NRA and the ISRA have a good working relationship, as a team, and yet do not always agree.

I am not going to focus on any disagreement for you, as I believe that maintaining unity is very important,

a key to survival in a hostile environment like Illinois.