85 replies to this topic

[drdoom]

vezpa, on 22 July 2012 - 03:45 PM, said:

GarandFan, on 22 July 2012 - 03:36 PM, said:

I can't say for sure, but I strongly suspect any limits on magazine capacity will be a non-starter with those who are ushering the carry bills through the legislature.

I hope you are correct, and don't think I like capacity limits, but if it gets us the votes we need now, I have to say do it.

The above is what screws us over, big time. Let me remind EVERY person, who is all for 'compromise'. I remember last year, when we 'compromised' libraries as a concession to get the anti's to support HB 148, guess what? They wanted more concessions. They wanted higher institutions off limits, we did that, and they STILL voted 148 down. Compromise will NOT get us anywhere on this issue. Right to Carry will come through the 7th, or through more patience and persistence (and not worrying about side  shows, like fixing the FOID). I'm ashamed to be in the company of anyone who would dare sell their right to carry more than 10 rds of ammo down the river, just to get the false promise of votes. In case you did not remember, this is Illinois, the Chicago politicians hate guns, what makes YOU think they will vote for YOU to exercise YOUR rights legally, and lawfully? I'm truly ashamed of people saying they are willing to compromise. By the way, let's say you are carrying, lawfully, and have a permit, and there is a flash mob, would YOU rather have 10 rds. or the max cap?

Edited by drdoom, 22 July 2012 - 04:54 PM.

[Chiburbian]

The only concession I am willing to make at this point is the permit itself.  Everything else is just varying degrees of p***ing me off.

[nocaster]

frankw438, on 22 July 2012 - 04:36 PM, said:

The words of Abraham Lincoln come to mind:

"I may walk slowly, but I never walk backward."

I don't think we need to go backwards in our fight to restore our 2nd Amendment rights.

+1

[Davey]

No bans on carrying standard magazines.  Whatever we give away we will never get back.

[AOJ]

No magazine capacity comprimise.  No training comprimise.  They had their chance for comprimise.  Phelps told them he would ram it down their throats using the court system.  They called his bluff.  We'll find out how well that worked out for them in a couple of days.  They formed a task force.  It sounds like we'll win out on that one too.  If the court decision goes are way we should be looking at lessening the restrictions in HB148.  Ever if it doesn't, now is not the time to be rolling over for the antis. Any more comprimise wont gain us any votes.  It will just chip away at our resolve and stall our progress.

[sfdoc5]

Why does anyone think these Antis will do anything but keep asking for more?
They have already done this time and time again.
I say to heck with them, it is time for us to get everything including the kitchen sink.

[KingWalleye]

It was really good to see a mature African-American woman speaking positively in terms of ccw. We need everybody who would carry to make some noise.

Kotowski sounds like a Brady Parrot.

[C0untZer0]

Quote

Why? He didn't say to get rid of exploding guns. ;-)

Ha ! Couldn't pass that one up could ya? It's not that more Glocks blow up it's that more people blow Glocks up than any other gun.

Edited by C0untZer0, 22 July 2012 - 08:20 PM.

[ilphil]

A thread like this must make the Brady Bunch smile...we are like a starving baby desperately trying to get to it's mother's breast.
Willing to give up a point here and a point there in the pathetic hope that if give up enough the powers that be wil kindly allow us to get a small fraction of our rights back.

DON'T YOU GUYS GET IT? (yeah, I am "shouting" for effect)???

No matter what concessions we make it will not be enough to satisfy the hard-core anti's. We could agree to may issue, tons of off-limits places, no pre-emption, insane training requirements and any other asinine demand that is made and when push comes to shove Madigan & Co still won't support it. And we will have made ourselves look foolish and impotent.

Enough concessions...enough give aways.

[TyGuy]

C0untZer0, on 22 July 2012 - 08:18 PM, said:

Quote

Why? He didn't say to get rid of exploding guns. ;-)

Ha ! Couldn't pass that one up could ya? It's not that more Glocks blow up it's that more people blow Glocks up than any other gun.

I shoot two of them, and my G19 is my primary firearm.  I just like a good laugh.

[TFC]

Ok. Since no one seems willing to ask, I'll do it myself:
Why does Fox have a copy of the preliminary report, but not us?

[colt-45]

TFC, on 22 July 2012 - 08:57 PM, said:

Ok. Since no one seems willing to ask, I'll do it myself:
Why does Fox have a copy of the preliminary report, but not us?

yea why is that.... i want to know to and now i'm a little p----ss cause of it.

[Bud]

Ford has the report and showed it to Fox and other Chicago stations. Fox was the only one that decided to report on it.

Ford is stuck. He honestly thought the report would turn out bad for the pro-gun alliance and was shocked when the opposite happened.

Remember, Todd was on the committee and he is watching out for us. The report turned out great for us, that's the good news, and the other good news is that it was so good for our side that the anti-gun politicians are doing everything they can to bury it.

Contact your local newspapers' managing editor and ask him/her to find out why the report is not being released , ask why Fox has it and is reporting on it and then ask them to get it and  report on it.

Edited by Bud, 23 July 2012 - 07:01 AM.

[bornhunter04]

Here's a thought....if they ask for a mag cap ban, why don't we do the opposite, and demand that CCWer's carry the biggest factory sized mags their guns will hold (i.e g19 = 15 round not 10 round)?

It's good that the report is in our favor, it's complete BS that the others won't report on it because it doesn't fit their agenda, but it's even better that their little plan backfired. You'd think they'd learn by now, that you can buck the facts.

[KingWalleye]

So when do we get to see it?

[Bud]

KingWalleye, on 23 July 2012 - 08:14 AM, said:

So when do we get to see it?

I think there is a very good chance you will never see the complete report.

This is Illinois. Why would you expect Illinois politicians to do the right thing?

The report doesn't do what they want, so if they don't reveal it, it never happened.

[vess1]

Durzo Blint, on 22 July 2012 - 02:44 PM, said:

vezpa, on 22 July 2012 - 01:26 PM, said:

I have grown to hate the ban on high capacity magazines lately but if we will get the votes we need to pass CCW by only allowing us to have a 10- 12 round magazine I'm all for it.  I think that is a point we can all fight later.  Almost every gun made now has a lower capacity magazine made for it.  All you old farts with 1911s are good to go.  My LCP carries 7 on board.  Revolvers are no problem.

I understand that implementing magazine restrictions won't deter any kind of crime but this is one of the areas where we can give our legislatures something and not suffer too much while still getting something we have been fighting for so long to get.  If the votes come with a magazine limit of 10 or 12 I'm game.  If I can't stop a threat with 10-12 rounds I guess it just isn't my day.  if the magazine limit is less than 10 however it is definitely a no-go.

I agree with you vezpa. We need the votes. We can fight the high capacity magazine issue another day.

  You mean how like California is fighting the high cap mag issue, or NOT fighting.  Theyre stuck with it.   Im not willing to give up anything.  Apparently some of us are only worried about concealed carry while others can see the big picture.  

  Lets compromise as much as they did to get their gd casinos.

Sent from my Motorola Electrify using Tapatalk 2

[kurt555gs]

Times of tragedy are not the right moment to negotiate deals like giving up more, or magazine bans. Let this wound heal, and then get back to legislation when clearer heads prevail.

[Gray Peterson]

Does the bill allow carry of AR15's? It doesn't.  It's a handgun only bill.  Don't get too caught up in Ford's statements.

[miztic]

Bud, on 23 July 2012 - 07:00 AM, said:

Ford is stuck. He honestly thought the report would turn out bad for the pro-gun alliance and was shocked when the opposite happened.
Remember, Todd was on the committee and he is watching out for us. The report turned out great for us, that's the good news, and the other good news is that it was so good for our side that the anti-gun politicians are doing everything they can to bury it.

I find this kind of hilarious
One thing, if he honestly believed CCW was 'bad' then he was misinformed, and techically not a liar, which actually gains him a tiny bit of credibility in my mind. I wonder why he showed the report [or parts of it] to FOX of all people. Seems like that doesn't fit with the "bury it" plan.

[snubjob]

Bud, on 23 July 2012 - 08:18 AM, said:

KingWalleye, on 23 July 2012 - 08:14 AM, said:

So when do we get to see it?

I think there is a very good chance you will never see the complete report.

This is Illinois. Why would you expect Illinois politicians to do the right thing?

The report doesn't do what they want, so if they don't reveal it, it never happened.

In a way, it did do what they wanted.  It stalled things for a while. And that was one of it's main purposes.

[vezpa]

Bud, on 23 July 2012 - 08:18 AM, said:

KingWalleye, on 23 July 2012 - 08:14 AM, said:

So when do we get to see it?

I think there is a very good chance you will never see the complete report.

This is Illinois. Why would you expect Illinois politicians to do the right thing?

The report doesn't do what they want, so if they don't reveal it, it never happened.

I'll repeat my comments from an earlier post.......................

The report already served it's intended purpose which was a stall tactic and an incredible waste of time to keep any of our bills from reaching the floor for a vote based on new "information" I would bet that it doesn't exist now and they will find a way to never be required to release it or anything of any significance. Deadlines mean nothing to the Anti's.

Fool us once shame on you, fool us twice.......................

Edited by vezpa, 23 July 2012 - 01:37 PM.

[KingWalleye]

So Todd doesn't have access to the final version?

[Bud]

Like I said, contact your local newspapers and demand they review it. Contact your State Representative and demand a copy. File a Freedom of Information request for it, it is/will be a public document and they will have to produce it.

[junglebob]

I doubt it is wise to support a magazine capacity limit to get Representative Ford's vote, if indeed we could.   What happens if we agree to have that in a LTC bill and then it doesn't pass.  The antis will come back with an magazine capacity limit bill and pressure all the legislators who voted yes on the carry bill to vote for it.  They might get enough to flip their votes on previous magazine ban bills to pass one.

[TFC]

Bud, on 23 July 2012 - 02:17 PM, said:

Like I said, contact your local newspapers and demand they review it. Contact your State Representative and demand a copy. File a Freedom of Information request for it, it is/will be a public document and they will have to produce it.

I work at a newspaper. The report is not here.
[opinion] I suspect that only the committee has copies of it, and they're likely told to keep it quiet or face ruin at the worst, or took some spending money to keep it quiet at the least. [/opinion]

And the state is notorious for ignoring FOIA requests.

Edited by TFC, 23 July 2012 - 03:35 PM.

[Ranger]

With an anti-gun bias; but I like the last line.

http://www.nbcchicag...-163426906.html

[Xwing]

willxjcherokee, on 22 July 2012 - 11:00 AM, said:

High Capacity , rapid fire weapons?

Oh dear I hope this doesn't hurt our chances of RTC.

It will.  The media and the antis will use the tragic events in Colorado as a strike against CCW, and will get some sheeple to believe them.  It matters not that this approach has no basis in truth.

[TyGuy]

Yet they'll ignore the 71 year old that stopped two armed men just two days before the Aurora event, or the April 2012 Aurora church shooting that was stopped by a carrier.

Edited by TyGuy, 24 July 2012 - 08:14 AM.

[Bud]

Got this from my State Rep this morning. All of you should write your State Rep and ask for a copy. Pressure is pressure. if they know we are paying attention it will force themm to pay attention:


Bud,



The final report hasn’t been finalized. It will be readily available upon release. I will keep an eye out for it and forward to you.



Jesse Sheehan

District Director



State Representative Robert W. Pritchard

2600 DeKalb Avenue, Suite C

Sycamore, IL  60178

815.748.3494 - Main office

815.748.4630 - Fax