129 replies to this topic

[GarandFan]

Here come the antis ... this article is similar to one recently in the NYT (hand-wringing about how certain felons have had their rights restored).  This one links to a 64 page study entitled "FATAL GAPS: How Missing Records in the Federal Background Check System Put Guns in the Hands of Killers."  That study will be officially released (you guessed it) today ... and is commissioned by (you guessed it) Bloomberg and his group of mayors against gun rights.

The entire purpose of this stuff is to try and detract from HR822.  The antis are worried scatless about this bill.

http://www.huffingto..._n_1093899.html

You know ... it's interesting how these anti gun rights groups just aren't getting much traction anymore.  They will, of course, focus much harder on the US Senate because passage of HR822 in the house is almost a foregone conclusion.

[GarandFan]

The US House floor proceedings (sausage-making tutorial) can be viewed on C-span, at 11am Illinois time.

http://www.c-span.or...e-Video/C-SPAN/

[Davey]

Thanks for the link.  Burning my normal sleep time for this.

[Sigma]

you guys have to listen to this cspan. these anti's are ridiculous.
he has gone from topic on hand to talking about gays and blacks in school?

Edited by Sigma, 15 November 2011 - 11:00 AM.

[Davey]

It's game on kids!

[Davey]

Sigma, on 15 November 2011 - 10:59 AM, said:

you guys have to listen to this cspan. these anti's are ridiculous.
he has gone from topic on hand to talking about gays and blacks in school?

Really right?  He's going on and on about gun shows and airports bla de bla de bla.

[Sigma]

does that idiot really think this bill was going to allow people to concealed carry on a friggin airplane!!!! I cant take it

[Davey]

Each substituted amendment shall be considered as substituted as amended to the amendment of the substituted waived commitee....whaaaaat?

[Davey]

What the heck is HR 463?

[Davey]

This twit is complaining because HR 822 isn't a jobs bill?  WTF?

"Er uh...this bill does nothing for the dying koala bears in China.  We must not support this bill!"

[Davey]

Kids under 20 years old?  Oxymoron.

[Sigma]

Davey you crack me up, you think just like me. this guy said absolutely nothing and took up all the time saying nothing, but i dont like guns.
Basically you automatically become a killer when you cross state line.

[Mac]

Yet, these scatter brained people are the ones that pass our laws. The Democratic Senator from Florida went on this spiel about taking guns on airplanes, going to gun shows with their guns for sale and allowing felons real felons to carry concealed weapons. Where is this guy from, most felons do carry concealed weapons, Those that haven't been caught yet.

[GarandFan]

Mac, on 15 November 2011 - 02:48 PM, said:

Yet, these scatter brained people are the ones that pass our laws. The Democratic Senator from Florida went on this spiel about taking guns on airplanes, going to gun shows with their guns for sale and allowing felons real felons to carry concealed weapons.

Well, desperate times call for desperate and hysterical measures.  All I know is this:  It's great to see these freaking anti gun rights yahoo's playing defense for a change.  May the ball stay in our court for a long, long time.

[Lou]

GarandFan, on 15 November 2011 - 03:46 PM, said:

Mac, on 15 November 2011 - 02:48 PM, said:

Yet, these scatter brained people are the ones that pass our laws. The Democratic Senator from Florida went on this spiel about taking guns on airplanes, going to gun shows with their guns for sale and allowing felons real felons to carry concealed weapons.

Well, desperate times call for desperate and hysterical measures.  All I know is this:  It's great to see these freaking anti gun rights yahoo's playing defense for a change.  May the ball stay in our court for a long, long time.

Copy that GF!!

[Mac]

GarandFan, on 15 November 2011 - 03:46 PM, said:

Mac, on 15 November 2011 - 02:48 PM, said:

Yet, these scatter brained people are the ones that pass our laws. The Democratic Senator from Florida went on this spiel about taking guns on airplanes, going to gun shows with their guns for sale and allowing felons real felons to carry concealed weapons.

Well, desperate times call for desperate and hysterical measures.  All I know is this:  It's great to see these freaking anti gun rights yahoo's playing defense for a change.  May the ball stay in our court for a long, long time.

One thing for sure, there was not a whole lot of reasoning in the statements that the Senator from Florida made. Half of his arguement did not even relate to the topic being debated. I do not see how any of his constituants could understand where he was coming from. If all the Antis are responding in this manner, I hope the ball stays in our court. The antis won;t be able to handle the ball. They are running out of time.

[Drylok]

Alright so one more time here. All the amendments that have been offered, will they be voted on tomorrow too or are they dead and it's just the actual bill they're voting on? I thought I heard Cam say last night that the only amendment that made it was the one about doing a study on non-resident licenses.

[GarandFan]

BTW, it's interesting that we haven't seen too many hysterics from the media and the like, regarding this coming house vote.  To be sure, the gun control people are really, really worried about this.

I suspect the house vote is foregone.  My money is on the time when this gets to the Senate.  I suspect at that time, we will see all the plugs pulled, all the seams come unglued, etc.  And you know ... I just don't know whether such hysterics will gain much traction this time.  The mood of the nation has truly shifted on this issue.  Illinois will come along, in time.  Ordinary citizens carrying guns for defensive purpose has simply become routine, if not almost mainstream.  There is simply no denying it much longer.

[PPK]

GarandFan, on 15 November 2011 - 10:09 PM, said:

BTW, it's interesting that we haven't seen too many hysterics from the media and the like, regarding this coming house vote.  To be sure, the gun control people are really, really worried about this.

I suspect the house vote is foregone.  My money is on the time when this gets to the Senate.  I suspect at that time, we will see all the plugs pulled, all the seams come unglued, etc.  And you know ... I just don't know whether such hysterics will gain much traction this time.  The mood of the nation has truly shifted on this issue.  Illinois will come along, in time.  Ordinary citizens carrying guns for defensive purpose has simply become routine, if not almost mainstream.  There is simply no denying it much longer.

If you could only convince some of the members on this site of that. The one's who's "reality" is "we'll never get concealed carry in Illinois" or "Reid will never bring HB 822 up for a vote."

[GarandFan]

PPK, on 16 November 2011 - 07:51 AM, said:

GarandFan, on 15 November 2011 - 10:09 PM, said:

BTW, it's interesting that we haven't seen too many hysterics from the media and the like, regarding this coming house vote.  To be sure, the gun control people are really, really worried about this.

I suspect the house vote is foregone.  My money is on the time when this gets to the Senate.  I suspect at that time, we will see all the plugs pulled, all the seams come unglued, etc.  And you know ... I just don't know whether such hysterics will gain much traction this time.  The mood of the nation has truly shifted on this issue.  Illinois will come along, in time.  Ordinary citizens carrying guns for defensive purpose has simply become routine, if not almost mainstream.  There is simply no denying it much longer.

If you could only convince some of the members on this site of that. The one's who's "reality" is "we'll never get concealed carry in Illinois" or "Reid will never bring HB 822 up for a vote."

I hear you, Sir.  But truthfully, I usually find other things to do with my time.  People with perspectives you mention are more than welcome to join along in the positive "can-do" approach that is getting results, or they can fall behind and whine (or better, just be quiet).  The train is rolling, and it ain't going to wait for nay-sayers and pessimists.

[Ranger]

Getting some press...

http://www.politico....1111/68441.html

[Ranger]

I'm thrilled that it passed the house and hopes it makes it into law.

If it does, anyone want to bet how long it will take for some anti-gunners to claim their state now needs to repeal concealed carry legislation (thinking New York, California, etc.) to protect their citizens from hordes of unqualified people from other states?

[billzfx4]

Ranger, on 16 November 2011 - 05:29 PM, said:

I'm thrilled that it passed the house and hopes it makes it into law.

If it does, anyone want to bet how long it will take for some anti-gunners to claim their state now needs to repeal concealed carry legislation (thinking New York, California, etc.) to protect their citizens from hordes of unqualified people from other states?

That's what I was thinking. IF it makes it all the way into law, Illinois may not be the "only one" for long.

[Drylok]

Ranger, on 16 November 2011 - 05:29 PM, said:

I'm thrilled that it passed the house and hopes it makes it into law.

If it does, anyone want to bet how long it will take for some anti-gunners to claim their state now needs to repeal concealed carry legislation (thinking New York, California, etc.) to protect their citizens from hordes of unqualified people from other states?

Nah because it won't take long for them to realize this is no big damn deal. In fact I suspect they already know this is no big deal they just can't stand that we're winning so they're making a big hype out of it. Ever notice how when a state has moved to shall issue there's doomsday warnings but once it's in affect you hear nothing from them?

[soundguy]

billzfx4, on 16 November 2011 - 07:40 PM, said:

Ranger, on 16 November 2011 - 05:29 PM, said:

I'm thrilled that it passed the house and hopes it makes it into law.

If it does, anyone want to bet how long it will take for some anti-gunners to claim their state now needs to repeal concealed carry legislation (thinking New York, California, etc.) to protect their citizens from hordes of unqualified people from other states?

That's what I was thinking. IF it makes it all the way into law, Illinois may not be the "only one" for long.

Sure... Possibly. I'd think though that only the small "who cares" states would even think to repeal carry. The states that seriously limit carry now. Hawaii might be a candidate.

Upstate New Yorkers and rural Californians will not put up with losing carry. The south and west and the middle are safe. Shall issue seems to be working for the 43. It might just be too hard for anyone to change, including Illinois!

[ilphil]

I am not looking to provoke an argument, but I would just like to know why everyone thinks the decidedly anti-gun Democratic leadership in the Senate won't bury this bill once it gets there?

They are already sitting on a number of House passed bills that don't fit in with their agenda, why would this be different?

I can understand celebrating the House passage as a sign of the weakness of the anti's cause, but let's not allow our vision to be clouded to the point that we ignore reality.

The votes aren't there to force it to the Senate floor bypassing committee and I am not even sure their would be enough votes to cut off a filibuster.

Call it negative, call it defeatist, call it whateveer makes you feel better. I call it a simple matter of not having the votes at this point in time. We are gaining, we WILL win eventually.
I just don't think it is going to happen now.

[Lou]

ilphil, on 16 November 2011 - 08:39 PM, said:

I am not looking to provoke an argument, but I would just like to know why everyone thinks the decidedly anti-gun Democratic leadership in the Senate won't bury this bill once it gets there?

They are already sitting on a number of House passed bills that don't fit in with their agenda, why would this be different?

I can understand celebrating the House passage as a sign of the weakness of the anti's cause, but let's not allow our vision to be clouded to the point that we ignore reality.

The votes aren't there to force it to the Senate floor bypassing committee and I am not even sure their would be enough votes to cut off a filibuster.

Call it negative, call it defeatist, call it whateveer makes you feel better. I call it a simple matter of not having the votes at this point in time. We are gaining, we WILL win eventually.
I just don't think it is going to happen now.

A similar bill gained 58 of the needed 60 votes 2 years ago before the 2010 election when the Rs gained strength.  
The strategy that failed 2 years ago  by 2 votes was to attach it to a must pass appropriations bill Obama can't veto.

[Tvandermyde]

Because Reid has been a decent supporter.

He let it come to the floor before, I bet he will let it come up again.

[belercous]

It won't help us in IL, but I'd at least be able to carry in 49 states rather than the 24 my PA permit allows. If it passes the Senate I doubt Obama would veto it with an election less than 12 months away. I'm going to write Durbin's office now to express my support, I'm sure Kirk's on board.

[kurt555gs]

Durban = No
Kirk = No idea, but more no than yes.