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ABC News: NRA Targets Bump Fire Stocks


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#61 howie

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Posted 06 October 2017 - 03:07 PM

Reports I've seen and heard said the nut had full auto and semi-auto arms fitted with bump stocks.  Do we know for sure he even used any of the rifles equipped with bump stocks?  Or was it just the full auto rifles he used?  Comparing bump stocks to other firearms accessories is apples and oranges, IMHO.  We've seen the proposed assault weapons ban so many times we've got it pretty much memorized.  Pistol grips, flash hiders, detachable mags, barrel shrouds, bayonet lugs....none of which have anything at all with the rate of fire of the rifles they are attached to.  We can't say that about bump stocks.  They DO change the effective rate of fire, and if, in fact, the turd out west used a bump fire stock, we're gonna have a really hard time defending that particular item.

 

I don't like compromising on any of this stuff, and for full disclosure I'm a patron NRA member.  Given the circumstances of what we think happened out west I think it's gonna be very damaging to our cause to try to defend those stocks. 


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#62 RandyP

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Posted 06 October 2017 - 03:35 PM

No harm comes from following the 'spirit' of a law. There seem to always be 'that' group of folks who just HAVE to push the boundaries and stretch them to the breaking point of reason. IMHO one such bunch created the slide-fire/bump-fire devices to thumb their collective noses at the BATF and full auto firearm regs. Once a maniac acquired them however, the joke ceased being funny and the relatively useless devices WILL pay the price along with any groups or individuals who attempt to support them.



#63 snooter

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Posted 06 October 2017 - 04:26 PM

I dont own any of those pos bump stocks...but some of you are a gestapo wet dream...how many jews would you have turned in cause you felt the spirit of the nurenberg laws was not being followed cause old lady johnson was hiding jews in her cellar...

#64 Glock23

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Posted 06 October 2017 - 04:34 PM

There's a big difference in not having a problem with something's prohibition and turning in those who would disobey. Nice judgement, though ;)

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#65 mauserme

    Eliminating the element of surprise one bill at a time.

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Posted 06 October 2017 - 05:51 PM

No harm comes from following the 'spirit' of a law. There seem to always be 'that' group of folks who just HAVE to push the boundaries and stretch them to the breaking point of reason. IMHO one such bunch created the slide-fire/bump-fire devices to thumb their collective noses at the BATF and full auto firearm regs. Once a maniac acquired them however, the joke ceased being funny and the relatively useless devices WILL pay the price along with any groups or individuals who attempt to support them.


I think if the spirit of the law was to prohibit possession of any firearm that fires quickly like full auto, Congress would have included Gatling guns in the original prohibition.

To my knowledge they were not included.

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#66 GT1

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Posted 06 October 2017 - 06:04 PM

Optics?
Here are the optics as I see them, the NRA, GOP led congress, and an administration the ran partially on a pro-2A platform is likely to approve and sign the first gun control legislation that made it to the oval office in decades. My NRA membership is up, not another dime from me.  They can optic that right up their you know what.  :thinking:


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#67 howie

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Posted 06 October 2017 - 07:02 PM

I dont own any of those pos bump stocks...but some of you are a gestapo wet dream...how many jews would you have turned in cause you felt the spirit of the nurenberg laws was not being followed cause old lady johnson was hiding jews in her cellar...

None.  You've got to be kidding.


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#68 Smallbore

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Posted 06 October 2017 - 08:17 PM

No harm comes from following the 'spirit' of a law. There seem to always be 'that' group of folks who just HAVE to push the boundaries and stretch them to the breaking point of reason. IMHO one such bunch created the slide-fire/bump-fire devices to thumb their collective noses at the BATF and full auto firearm regs. Once a maniac acquired them however, the joke ceased being funny and the relatively useless devices WILL pay the price along with any groups or individuals who attempt to support them.

The spirit of the citizen denied full auto law was the camels nose under the tent. It's intent was to start the disarming of America.
There is nothing wrong with free people having full autos or any item. If the people can not be trusted, then those same people drawing a government pay check can not be trusted. Our founding fathers tried to keep the government from being an elite special privilege masters because they personally experienced this under a king. Our founding fathers knew the wisdom of owning canon.

Edited by Smallbore, 06 October 2017 - 08:21 PM.


#69 FF1984

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Posted 06 October 2017 - 08:39 PM

 

No harm comes from following the 'spirit' of a law. There seem to always be 'that' group of folks who just HAVE to push the boundaries and stretch them to the breaking point of reason. IMHO one such bunch created the slide-fire/bump-fire devices to thumb their collective noses at the BATF and full auto firearm regs. Once a maniac acquired them however, the joke ceased being funny and the relatively useless devices WILL pay the price along with any groups or individuals who attempt to support them.

The spirit of the citizen denied full auto law was the camels nose under the tent. It's intent was to start the disarming of America.
There is nothing wrong with free people having full autos or any item. If the people can not be trusted, then those same people drawing a government pay check can not be trusted. Our founding fathers tried to keep the government from being an elite special privilege masters because they personally experienced this under a king. Our founding fathers knew the wisdom of owning canon.

 

Our leaders, in theory, are drawn from the regular populace.  If the "masters" are afforded rights and, by proxy "special" protections that the rest of us are not, the great experiment our founders set out to conduct has failed.  Who is to blame?  



#70 Plinkermostly

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Posted 07 October 2017 - 08:21 AM

It ought to be against the law to kill people.  If we made that ilegal we wouldn't need any other restrictions on how it happens.  Right?



#71 357

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Posted 07 October 2017 - 11:57 AM

It's really disgusting to blame a piece of plastic for the deaths. It's a slippery slope and the NRA should argue that the bump fire stock makes the weapon inaccurate and more people would have died without it and they are used by millions of people for recreation and should not be blamed and banned for the actions of one criminal.
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#72 mauserme

    Eliminating the element of surprise one bill at a time.

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Posted 09 October 2017 - 07:01 AM

I removed a couple posts from view for the reason TRJ stated (good call).


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#73 357

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Posted 09 October 2017 - 09:59 AM

He was a millionaire and was eligible and could afford automatic weapons. He would have killed a lot more people and legislation and ATF rule change would not have stopped him. It doesn't make sense that he used bump fire stocks and a lot of people who have experience with bump fire stocks are saying it sounded like an automatic weapon.
If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy.
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George Orwell

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#74 Glock23

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Posted 09 October 2017 - 11:20 AM

Early on, one of the reports said there was at least one fully automatic rifle found in the room. That was before the bump stocks were revealed, though, so that might've been what it was referring to.

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#75 yurimodin

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Posted 09 October 2017 - 02:48 PM

He was a millionaire and was eligible and could afford automatic weapons. He would have killed a lot more people and legislation and ATF rule change would not have stopped him. It doesn't make sense that he used bump fire stocks and a lot of people who have experience with bump fire stocks are saying it sounded like an automatic weapon.

tbh with the $$$ that guy had I am surprised their were not any black market machine guns.............



#76 mostholycerebus

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Posted 11 October 2017 - 07:54 PM

I hate bump fire stocks, I hate a lot of things, that doesn't mean the Givernement should be banning anything relate to our rights. If anything this should be the poster child for how gun control measures will never stop criminals, and we should repeal the GCA.

Anyone willing to fold for this incrementalism is ignorant, a fool, or a traitor.

#77 Plinkermostly

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 08:31 AM

Considering that you can bump fire with a stick or a finger . . . .



#78 HeavyDuty

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 08:33 AM

Considering that you can bump fire with a stick or a finger . . . .


That’s fine - your finger or a stick aren’t a commercial product designed to tweak the noses of the regulators.

#79 Prairie Pucker

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 10:06 AM

We're giving up the hill before the enemy even gets out of the truck. If there's a case to be made for restrictions, let them make it. Don't give away ground based on feelings.
 

 

Another way to look at it is, the NRA is letting the air out of the truck's tires on its way up the hill. 


Edited by Prairie Pucker, 12 October 2017 - 10:07 AM.

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#80 ChicagoRonin70

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 12:45 PM

 

We're giving up the hill before the enemy even gets out of the truck. If there's a case to be made for restrictions, let them make it. Don't give away ground based on feelings.
 

 

Another way to look at it is, the NRA is letting the air out of the truck's tires on its way up the hill. 

 

 

I thought that is what you do when you want to increase your traction on a slippery hill, so that more of the tire can rest on the ground and transfer more of the engine's power to a greater area, thus helping you get up the hill more effectively, if a bit slower. It looks like it would be unhelpful to an uninformed outsider, but in reality it is a subtle benefit to overcoming the obstacle.

 

Or . . . is that what you mean by that analogy?


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#81 quackersmacker

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 04:16 PM

NRA opposes Feinstein bumpstock bill:

 

http://freebeacon.co...stock-ban-bill/


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#82 OldMarineVet

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 04:54 PM

And Feinstein opposes NRA calling out ATF to review bump stock for regulation...

---------------------------

"Sen. Dianne Feinstein (D., Calif.), who has introduced bills with similar wording in previous years, said calls from the NRA and others for the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives (ATF) to reexamine the legality of bump fire stocks were not enough."

"The ATF lacks authority under the law to ban bump fire stocks," Feinstein said. "Period. The agency made this crystal clear in a 2013 letter to Congress, writing that ‘stocks of this type are not subject to the provisions of federal firearms statutes.' Legislation is the only answer and Congress shouldn't attempt to pass the buck."

Edited by OldMarineVet, 12 October 2017 - 05:30 PM.


#83 Prairie Pucker

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Posted 13 October 2017 - 09:58 AM

 

 

We're giving up the hill before the enemy even gets out of the truck. If there's a case to be made for restrictions, let them make it. Don't give away ground based on feelings.
 

 

Another way to look at it is, the NRA is letting the air out of the truck's tires on its way up the hill. 

 

 

I thought that is what you do when you want to increase your traction on a slippery hill, so that more of the tire can rest on the ground and transfer more of the engine's power to a greater area, thus helping you get up the hill more effectively, if a bit slower. It looks like it would be unhelpful to an uninformed outsider, but in reality it is a subtle benefit to overcoming the obstacle.

 

Or . . . is that what you mean by that analogy?

 

 

Not hardly.


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