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#391 soundguy

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Posted 05 August 2017 - 06:04 AM

I just ordered from Target Sports. Hoping it will go well... First timer for mail order ammo.

 

I ordered late on Friday.

Package delivered on Thursday.

 

Pretty fast, very pleased.


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#392 officedrone

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Posted 05 August 2017 - 08:08 AM

Thought this might help our situation... ATF has finally updated their published list of laws. They now have it broken down on their online site by state. For Illinois, it includes all the updated concealed carry including the preemption that the State has preempted all handgun laws over municipality ordinances. Surprisingly it only includes at the end of the document, ordinances for Aurora and for Chicago only. As far as Chicago, it details that the firearms dealers need a license if they are using a physical location inside of Chicago. As everyone here already knows, there is no ordinance prohibiting having ammunition shipped to them in Chicago and any dealers that take the time to review this will not find any prohibition. Illinois law already allows anyone with a valid FOID to have purchased ammunition shipped to them and that is also listed in this document under 430 ILCS 65/3. It says "ANY RESIDENT" and does not distinguish anything regarding any municipality ordinances. One thing ammunition related that Chicago does prohibit is 50bmg rounds and "armor piercing" ammo. Absolutely nothing else is listed under the prohibition. Another interesting thing I saw was in regards to "high capacity" magazines under Chicago's laws. It identifies them as having over 15rd capacity. So anything that is 15rds or less are good to go as well. I ways thought it was 12rds or less. Maybe now that this published through ATF, more dealers will jump on board and start selling to Chicago residents. Here is the link. Hopefully it works for you.

https://www.atf.gov/...oispdf/download

 

Wow, it only took, what, three years? You'd think it wasn't their responsibility to provide up-to-date information regarding firearm laws.

 

Regarding the 50BMG and AP section, it describes this as applying to the State's weapons dealer licensees, their store managers, and authorized employees (see page 45,  Article VII. Firearms Dealers, 4-144-700 Definitions.)

 

“Licensee” means a person issued a weapon dealer-firearms dealer license pursuant to this Article.

 

“Store Manager” means a person who:

(1) is 21 years old or older;

(2) has a valid FOID card; and

(3) is designated by the licensee for the responsibility of the on-site overall day-to-day operations of a firearms dealer licensed premises.

 

“Authorized Employee” means a licensee's employee who:

(1) is 21 years old or older;

(2) has a valid FOID card;

(3) is located at the licensed premises; and

(4) is authorized by the licensee to control, handle, sell, store or otherwise possess firearms or ammunition.

 

Chicago doesn't license businesses outside of the city, so it doesn't seem this would apply.


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#393 mikeyk101

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Posted 05 August 2017 - 09:43 AM

Oops, you are correct on the AP and 50bmg. It does appear to only affect stores. I guess I breezed through it a little too quick. Good catch...

#394 chislinger

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Posted 06 August 2017 - 01:20 PM

Thought this might help our situation... ATF has finally updated their published list of laws. They now have it broken down on their online site by state. For Illinois, it includes all the updated concealed carry including the preemption that the State has preempted all handgun laws over municipality ordinances. Surprisingly it only includes at the end of the document, ordinances for Aurora and for Chicago only. As far as Chicago, it details that the firearms dealers need a license if they are using a physical location inside of Chicago. As everyone here already knows, there is no ordinance prohibiting having ammunition shipped to them in Chicago and any dealers that take the time to review this will not find any prohibition. Illinois law already allows anyone with a valid FOID to have purchased ammunition shipped to them and that is also listed in this document under 430 ILCS 65/3. It says "ANY RESIDENT" and does not distinguish anything regarding any municipality ordinances. One thing ammunition related that Chicago does prohibit is 50bmg rounds and "armor piercing" ammo. Absolutely nothing else is listed under the prohibition. Another interesting thing I saw was in regards to "high capacity" magazines under Chicago's laws. It identifies them as having over 15rd capacity. So anything that is 15rds or less are good to go as well. I ways thought it was 12rds or less. Maybe now that this published through ATF, more dealers will jump on board and start selling to Chicago residents. Here is the link. Hopefully it works for you.

https://www.atf.gov/...oispdf/download

At least one online dealer responded to my email that they believe they need to get a Chicago firearm dealer license to sell to Chicago residents.

It's bizarre, when this provision is clearly meant for dealers physically located within city limits.
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#395 officedrone

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Posted 06 August 2017 - 04:15 PM

At least one online dealer responded to my email that they believe they need to get a Chicago firearm dealer license to sell to Chicago residents.

It's bizarre, when this provision is clearly meant for dealers physically located within city limits.

 

 

Sounds like the guy at Lucky Gunner. He's the reason I started the Lost Causes list.


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#396 BTrain929

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Posted 20 August 2017 - 01:54 PM

My exchange with Grabagun when they cancelled my order. I think that NSSF and NRA should get involved to clear this issue. They are throwing the baby with the bath water. These are bans by people who claim to support the 2nd amendment.


Thanks again for your order. However, we can not ship magazines of this capacity to your state.

Your order has been cancelled and a full refund issued.

Thank you,
Greg

Yes you can ship it in my state and there is no capacity limit. Please check the laws again. Chicago has a limit of 15 rounds but even that is preempted by state law so there is no limit.


New policies have been enacted at Grab A Gun in response to ever-changing state and local laws on firearm
legality and high capacity regulations. As a Texas-licensed gun dealer, we are unable to verify legality
for firearms and ammunition for every state, county and city across the country. For this reason, Grab A
Gun has instituted a policy that if a state (or any county/city within a state) has "assault weapon" or
high capacity magazine restrictions, we will not ship them to that state under any circumstances. This
also applies to law enforcement officers, who are typically exempt from firearm statutes. Hopefully
new legislation will pass in the future that would allow us to resume conducting normal business within
your state.


When were your new policies enacted? There is no "assault weapon" ban in Illinois and this is a pistol magazine. The law in Chicago hasn't changed since 2014 and it doesn't take long to see. Seems like you don't want to bother and are making up excuses.


There are active assault weapon and high capacity statutes in Cook County and ammunition shipping regulations across the whole state of Illinois, which are still in effect to the best of our knowledge. The policies were enacted just within the last month, due to rising incidences of firearms having to be returned to us, and ammunition orders are becoming too troublesome with having to verify active FOID cards. From a logistical standpoint, the cost to ship these items into Illinois/Cook County is simply outweighing the benefits, as well as opening the company up to potential legal issues. Again, we apologize for the inconvenience and sincerely wish that we were able to ship to your state unrestricted.

Thanks,
Greg

 

 

Thought this might help our situation... ATF has finally updated their published list of laws. They now have it broken down on their online site by state. For Illinois, it includes all the updated concealed carry including the preemption that the State has preempted all handgun laws over municipality ordinances. Surprisingly it only includes at the end of the document, ordinances for Aurora and for Chicago only. As far as Chicago, it details that the firearms dealers need a license if they are using a physical location inside of Chicago. As everyone here already knows, there is no ordinance prohibiting having ammunition shipped to them in Chicago and any dealers that take the time to review this will not find any prohibition. Illinois law already allows anyone with a valid FOID to have purchased ammunition shipped to them and that is also listed in this document under 430 ILCS 65/3. It says "ANY RESIDENT" and does not distinguish anything regarding any municipality ordinances. One thing ammunition related that Chicago does prohibit is 50bmg rounds and "armor piercing" ammo. Absolutely nothing else is listed under the prohibition. Another interesting thing I saw was in regards to "high capacity" magazines under Chicago's laws. It identifies them as having over 15rd capacity. So anything that is 15rds or less are good to go as well. I ways thought it was 12rds or less. Maybe now that this published through ATF, more dealers will jump on board and start selling to Chicago residents. Here is the link. Hopefully it works for you.

https://www.atf.gov/...oispdf/download

So, I just want to be clear. I'd like to buy some 17/18/20 rd magazines onilne and have them shipped to my house in Chicago. Is 357 right, or is mikey right?? If they can't be shipped, is that only for Chicago, or Cook? Could I have them shipped to an FFL not in Chicago?

 

Thanks in advance!!!



#397 gunuser17

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Posted 20 August 2017 - 03:20 PM

The Chicago 15 round limit ordinance is still on the books.  A number of people argue that the Illinois state preemption law on handguns rendered that city ordinance moot.  However, I have not found any actual court decision to that effect and I have not found any vendor outside of the state or even in the state (Springfield Armory) that would ship a handgun magazine with a capacity greater than 15 to Chicago.  Companies are just not willing to take the chance.



#398 lockman

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Posted 20 August 2017 - 03:30 PM

The Chicago 15 round limit ordinance is still on the books.  A number of people argue that the Illinois state preemption law on handguns rendered that city ordinance moot.  However, I have not found any actual court decision to that effect and I have not found any vendor outside of the state or even in the state (Springfield Armory) that would ship a handgun magazine with a capacity greater than 15 to Chicago.  Companies are just not willing to take the chance.


How can Chicago enforce it against an out of state seller?

Questionable misdemeanor at best. Extradition?




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#399 lockman

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Posted 20 August 2017 - 05:15 PM

The Chicago 15 round limit ordinance is still on the books.  A number of people argue that the Illinois state preemption law on handguns rendered that city ordinance moot.  However, I have not found any actual court decision to that effect and I have not found any vendor outside of the state or even in the state (Springfield Armory) that would ship a handgun magazine with a capacity greater than 15 to Chicago.  Companies are just not willing to take the chance.


How can Chicago enforce it against an out of state seller?

Questionable misdemeanor at best. Extradition?




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#400 officedrone

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Posted 20 August 2017 - 06:14 PM

Long story short, you are not going to find a mail-order vendor who will sell you magazines with a capacity greater than 15 rounds and be willing to ship them to an address in Chicago. In fact, some won't ship you anything more than 12 rounds (which is the Cook County limit), and some won't ship you any magazines of any size whatsoever (Bud's, Palmetto, etc).

 

Only handgun magazines are (potentially) pre-empted by the state concealed carry law, and even that is treated as vague. I personally think they are, since they're an integral part of a semi-automatic handgun (the gun won't operate without one), but I'm not a lawyer and can't give you legal advice in that regard.

 

As for whether a vendor will ship them to a FFL dealer, you'd have to check that with the vendors and the dealer.

 

How would Chicago enforce any of this against an out-of-state dealer? Who knows?


Edited by officedrone, 20 August 2017 - 06:18 PM.

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#401 Hazborgufen

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Posted 21 August 2017 - 09:46 AM

Long story short, you are not going to find a mail-order vendor who will sell you magazines with a capacity greater than 15 rounds and be willing to ship them to an address in Chicago. In fact, some won't ship you anything more than 12 rounds (which is the Cook County limit), and some won't ship you any magazines of any size whatsoever (Bud's, Palmetto, etc).

 

Only handgun magazines are (potentially) pre-empted by the state concealed carry law, and even that is treated as vague. I personally think they are, since they're an integral part of a semi-automatic handgun (the gun won't operate without one), but I'm not a lawyer and can't give you legal advice in that regard.

 

As for whether a vendor will ship them to a FFL dealer, you'd have to check that with the vendors and the dealer.

 

How would Chicago enforce any of this against an out-of-state dealer? Who knows?

 

Chicago politicians would get in front of a camera and make grim statements about enabling violence and would name the seller directly and state that they are "exporting violence to our streets" and that the City is looking into what legal recourse they have against them. They would then declare that Congress should close the "person buying non regulated items from out of state loophole," but then blame the NRA for being too powerful to allow for these "common sense" laws. Then they would call for Springfield to enact legislation.

 

Honestly, the anti-gun response is pretty much paint by numbers at this point. While I understand merchants not wanting that on their shoulders I also think it's cowardly of them.



#402 Looper

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Posted 21 August 2017 - 02:47 PM

Order your magazines from CDNN.   :cool: 



#403 V088

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Posted 25 August 2017 - 12:45 AM

I'd gotten several orders from Freedom Munitions and really liked their stuff but they don't ship here anymore :( Just an update.



#404 officedrone

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Posted 25 August 2017 - 05:48 PM

I'd gotten several orders from Freedom Munitions and really liked their stuff but they don't ship here anymore :( Just an update.

 

Yes, Freedom Munitions were removed from the OK list a while ago as they changed their minds.


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#405 Glock19NR

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Posted 28 August 2017 - 12:19 PM

I placed an order for a MAGPUL PMAG 15 round magazine from Brownells yesterday. This morning I received the following email from them.

I was going to reply with links to this forum

and this page http://www.handgunla...apChemSpray.pdf

and the ATF page but I thought I would post here first for advice.

 

Your order (Brownells confirmation #xxxxxxxx) contains an item that is
restricted in your area. Your complete order will be put on hold until
the proper documents have been received. One of the following documents
must be on file with us:

A) Large Capacity Magazine Permit issued by your
State (CA)
B) If you are a police officer, your order must be submitted
on Department letterhead stating that they will receive
and validate your ID for the transport of high capacity
magazines. The magazines must be shipped to the Department
address listed on the letterhead. The letterhead must be
signed by your Superior Officer.
C) FFL (CA, CO, MD, NJ, NY)

The document can be faxed or mailed.

If your document is not received within two weeks of the order being
placed, your restricted item will be cancelled, unless we, the Gun
Department, are contacted during this time.

Please fax the documentation to 641-623-8114 or email to
orderdesk@policestore.com

Sincerely,

The Gang at Brownells



#406 Glock19NR

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Posted 28 August 2017 - 12:32 PM

Order your magazines from CDNN.   :cool:

Trying to order a 15 round glock magazine, as soon as I confirmed my address on the checkout page this message popped up

      • Due to our company policy, we do not ship firearms or magazines to your state with a capacity over 10 rounds (Includes Chicago). To order a gun without magazines, please call us 800-588-9500.


#407 officedrone

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Posted 28 August 2017 - 12:50 PM

Magazine shipping is a separate issue from ammo, and has its own set of complexities. Let's keep this thread within the original scope (ammunition), otherwise the info here will become more difficult for people to navigate.

Thank you.

“By concord little things grow great, by discord the greatest come to nothing.”
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#408 BTrain929

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Posted 28 August 2017 - 06:18 PM

Placed an order thru TargetSportsUSA late monday night for 8 boxes of ammo shipping to the 606. Received in Friday's mail.

 

2 big thumbs up!!!







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