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Conceal carry, partial conceal, imprinting.


Texasgrillchef

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Its not an issue in states where open carry is allowed. However as i understand open carry is NOT allowed in Illinois unless on your own property.

 

Which leads me to my question.

 

Partial concealment and imprinting.

 

I understand that if I have my weapon fully concealed, but in the process of changing costs, or opening my coat to get something out of the inside pocket and briefly exposing the handgun is not a violation of concealment.

 

However... if you have a short on covering your weapon, and the bottom of the gun and/or holster is viewable poking out of the bottom of your shirt. Is that still considered concealed carry from a legal standpoint?

 

What about imprinting, shirt is fully covering your firearm, but its obvious that you have a gun from imprinting. Is that still legal concealment?

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However... if you have a short on covering your weapon, and the bottom of the gun and/or holster is viewable poking out of the bottom of your shirt. Is that still considered concealed carry from a legal standpoint?

 

What about imprinting, shirt is fully covering your firearm, but its obvious that you have a gun from imprinting. Is that still legal concealment?

 

That law says.

 

 

 

"Concealed firearm" means a loaded or unloaded handgun carried on or about a person completely or mostly concealed from view of the public or on or about a person within a vehicle.

 

That gives wiggle room on printing and even some exposure of the holster/firearm itself, how much can be seen under the term "mostly" to the best of my knowledge not tested in the courts but the plain definition of mostly concealed would mean more concealed then in plain view.

 

Obvously the best course of action is to conceal the best and most you can as to not enter into the gray area, but the plain language of the law doesn't necessitate total concealment.

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The statute doesnt define partially concealed. I wouldnt stress much, but still try to avoid it as you may get someone reporting you as a person with a gun.

 

...A license shall be valid throughout the State for a period of 5 years from the date of issuance. A license shall permit the licensee to:

(1) carry a loaded or unloaded concealed firearm,

fully concealed or partially concealed, on or about his or her person;...

 

I dont think "printing" is discussed in the act. As long as it is covered and I suspect most arent going to notice. I followed a guy through Walmart and he had an inch or two of revolver and holster poking beyond the waist of his jacket. I dont think a single other person noticed from my observations.

 

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A license shall be valid throughout the State for a period of 5 years from the date of issuance. A license shall permit the licensee to:

(1) carry a loaded or unloaded concealed firearm, fully concealed or partially concealed, on or about his or her person; and

(2) keep or carry a loaded or unloaded concealed firearm on or about his or her person within a vehicle.

There is no legal definition of "partially concealed." In practice, it means if your holster sticks out below your jacket or if you print, you're not in violation of the law. I've been places in the Chicago area when some guys were massively printing, surrounded by lots of people who would probably have freaked out if they knew they were armed, but nothing happened because the people were all totally oblivious. Apparently some people can't recognize a gun unless they see it in a movie. (The airport scene in "Get Shorty" comes to mind.)

 

Note, however, that your firearm has to be completely hidden from outside view in your vehicle.

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Note, however, that your firearm has to be completely hidden from outside view in your vehicle.

 

 

I would argue that is ambiguous in the law as well based on the definition of "concealed firearm" in the law itself.

 

"Concealed firearm" means a loaded or unloaded handgun carried on or about a person completely or mostly concealed from view of the public or on or about a person within a vehicle.
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This year I have discovered OWB carry to be far more comfortable than IWB carry, and I don't need bigger pants. Sometimes it's a tiny Sig P238. Other times it's a Browning High Power. I nearly always wear a fleece vest (I want the extra pockets) which serves to cover my pistol. With this method I have achieved "completely or mostly concealed from view of the public" and I have never felt as though anyone can tell I am armed. This is in the City of Chicago. I was more paranoid when carry in Illinois first became legal.

 

I avoid printing. I don't want anyone to know I am carrying and do not have the physique to wear a shirt tight enough to print. Legal or not, some goof is gonna freak out one day and call 911 on you.

 

I don't like short jackets, either. My pistol will never poke out the bottom.

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I never tuck my shirt in unless at work. I carry OWB all the time, it helps my fat arse wear some of my clothes that are a little snug.

 

As stated there is no case law or plain definition so all anyone can do is guess.

 

My guess is that intent matters, if you have attempted to conceal you firearm and have an inadvertant exposure or are printing due to tight clothing or reaching/bending then intent means everything.

 

AFAIK there are no brandishing laws in IL so even if you temporarily intentionally expose you still mostly concealed. I personally dont want to be the test case though.

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A license shall be valid throughout the State for a period of 5 years from the date of issuance. A license shall permit the licensee to:(1) carry a loaded or unloaded concealed firearm, fully concealed or partially concealed, on or about his or her person; and(2) keep or carry a loaded or unloaded concealed firearm on or about his or her person within a vehicle.

There is no legal definition of "partially concealed." In practice, it means if your holster sticks out below your jacket or if you print, you're not in violation of the law. I've been places in the Chicago area when some guys were massively printing, surrounded by lots of people who would probably have freaked out if they knew they were armed, but nothing happened because the people were all totally oblivious. Apparently some people can't recognize a gun unless they see it in a movie. (The airport scene in "Get Shorty" comes to mind.)Note, however, that your firearm has to be completely hidden from outside view in your vehicle.

Ok... so leads me to two questions. There are holsters, that completely hide from view (flap holsters) he handgun, but are obvious that they are handgun holsters.... concealed or not?

 

Vehicle wise, Texas plates, but legally tinted windows in Texas... you can’t see in, unless you are being vagrantly trying to look in?

I am assuming covering the handgun on the passenger seat with a coat, towel, or backpack would also be considered concealed??

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As stated there is no case law or plain definition so all anyone can do is guess.

 

My guess is that intent matters, if you have attempted to conceal you firearm and have an inadvertant exposure or are printing due to tight clothing or reaching/bending then intent means everything.

 

AFAIK there are no brandishing laws in IL so even if you temporarily intentionally expose you still mostly concealed. I personally dont want to be the test case though.

BINGO

 

If you scare someone and they call in "man with a gun" and you are arrested for violating the CCL act (printing or partially exposing) you will need to convince the judge or jury that they would have done the same thing. Even on this pro gun forum it's members can't agree on mostly & partially. Now add in some anti-gun folks to your jury pool........ I'll pass.

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Those who are sloppy may have a badge.

I thought the legislators discussed this as momentary.

Who want to be the test case?

 

"The Test Case"...

We have been saying this for years, yet I/we have yet to come across the "Test Case"...

<Shrug>.. I dunno. Since we have yet to have any documented case, I simply carry on as I always have.

No.. this doesnt mean I wear a wife-beater with 1911 and 3 mags on my hip. I still conceal quite well. I just down 'worry about it'.

Years ago when I started carrying** I was very concerned and purchased smaller firearms to conceal better. While I still have those and carry them as I see fit, I find myself going for the larger capacity firearms a lil bit more often.

 

 

 

** "Years ago"... its nice to be able say that eh?? :)

I think IL is past the honeymoon stage for conceal carry, and hope to see it grow even more.

If IL would streamline and fix the licensing process (Ya..I know..wishful thinking), More folks would possess an FCCL.

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Ok... so leads me to two questions. There are holsters, that completely hide from view (flap holsters) he handgun, but are obvious that they are handgun holsters.... concealed or not?

 

Flap holsters = probably not concealed.

Unless the holster is also concealed, it's rather obvious you have a handgun.

 

This is where the Sneaky Pete comes in handy.

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Now you bring up a different subject, window tint. In Illinois it is illegal to have your front windows tinted to more then 35%. Texas is 25%.

While you are legal if you have out of state plates, don't be surprised if you get pulled over if your windows are what a local deems "too dark."

https://www.tinting-laws.com/

I have seen this in action, actually a local pulled a U turn right in front of me to go after a car with an out of state plate that was going the same direction as me.

No front plate and it almost looked like limo tint on a coupe. You wont get either ticket but years ago I saw this happen right when we passed into a different suburb.

We had been on the same stretch for miles and the second we went into another suburb, a LEO was all over this guy and lit him up.

Certain suburbs by me have their own set of rules. There is a certain stretch of road by me where the suburb over will "patrol" after 11PM until about 3AM.

By patrol I mean tailgate you from their western border until you pass into the next town and then they hang a U turn and follow some other person.

It's to try and unnerve you. I haven't been pulled over but know many who have. If you brake check them, you will get lit up.

 

Welcome to Illinois :no:

 

 

^^This, it has got better since IL legalized tinting on front windows, but there are still some communities where cops use it as an excuse to pull over people and test to make sure your tint is compliant as they dig for something else.

 

As for the cops that tailgate from edge of town to edge of town, been there done that a lot in my younger days, still see it happen quite often in some communities, and I have been pulled over for a plethora of petty reasons when they do that. Even got pulled over for dropping down to about 5 under when the cop pulled up behind me, he kept badgering me as to why I wasn't going the speed limit, I kept telling him that it was a speed limit and I didn't want to accidentally exceed it since I knew he had pulled up behind me and was pacing me, he didn't like that answer.

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Now you bring up a different subject, window tint. In Illinois it is illegal to have your front windows tinted to more then 35%. Texas is 25%.

While you are legal if you have out of state plates, don't be surprised if you get pulled over if your windows are what a local deems "too dark."

https://www.tinting-laws.com/

I have seen this in action, actually a local pulled a U turn right in front of me to go after a car with an out of state plate that was going the same direction as me.

No front plate and it almost looked like limo tint on a coupe. You wont get either ticket but years ago I saw this happen right when we passed into a different suburb.

We had been on the same stretch for miles and the second we went into another suburb, a LEO was all over this guy and lit him up.

Certain suburbs by me have their own set of rules. There is a certain stretch of road by me where the suburb over will "patrol" after 11PM until about 3AM.

By patrol I mean tailgate you from their western border until you pass into the next town and then they hang a U turn and follow some other person.

It's to try and unnerve you. I haven't been pulled over but know many who have. If you brake check them, you will get lit up.

 

Welcome to Illinois :no:

 

 

^^This, it has got better since IL legalized tinting on front windows, but there are still some communities where cops use it as an excuse to pull over people and test to make sure your tint is compliant as they dig for something else.

 

As for the cops that tailgate from edge of town to edge of town, been there done that a lot in my younger days, still see it happen quite often in some communities, and I have been pulled over for a plethora of petty reasons when they do that. Even got pulled over for dropping down to about 5 under when the cop pulled up behind me, he kept badgering me as to why I wasn't going the speed limit, I kept telling him that it was a speed limit and I didn't want to accidentally exceed it since I knew he had pulled up behind me and was pacing me, he didn't like that answer.

 

You must not be a white guy if you're getting pulled over that much.

 

All summer riding on a motorcycle I'm sure I exposed more than enough when my shirt flaps in the wind. I generally keep my shirt tucked under my ace so it isn't flying everywhere. It doesn't stay put forever though. No doubt it had to have been noticed at some point. Never been pulled over for it..

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As long as you're not taking it out of your holster and waving it around you should be ok.

 

If you lay a gun on a table 50 percent is already concealed. Now put it in a holster and about 75 percent is concealed.

 

If your shirt rides up, you should be ok as long as you're not doing it on purpose.

 

If your lawyer can't get you off then you need a new lawyer.

 

Stupid speelchick.

 

.

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"Mostly concealed" can vary in interpretation depending on the demographic of your area; sort of like "mostly peaceful."

Mostly peaceful = not peaceful

 

 

^ this ***

 

 

Then Mostly belligerent = not belligerent?

 

This mostly concealed argument has been a dead horse for a long time. Some jockeys must have very tired arms.

I have yet to see any postings here about numerous people being arrested for improper concealment.

 

Maybe some cop somewhere in this state in the next 50 years will arrest a CCLer because 0.25 sq. inches of a pistol butt is visible.

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"Mostly concealed" can vary in interpretation depending on the demographic of your area; sort of like "mostly peaceful."

Mostly peaceful = not peaceful

 

 

^ this ***

 

 

Then Mostly belligerent = not belligerent?

 

This mostly concealed argument has been a dead horse for a long time. Some jockeys must have very tired arms.

I have yet to see any postings here about numerous people being arrested for improper concealment.

 

Maybe some cop somewhere in this state in the next 50 years will arrest a CCLer because 0.25 sq. inches of a pistol butt is visible.

 

 

Ya know......

The OP is a basically new...(See post count)

Nothing wrong with hitting an old topic...throwing a few newer-to-date thoughts from members at it...and/or directing to previous threads.

 

Get over yourself...Mr. Operator.

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"Mostly concealed" can vary in interpretation depending on the demographic of your area; sort of like "mostly peaceful."

 

Mostly peaceful = not peaceful

^ this ***

Then Mostly belligerent = not belligerent?

 

This mostly concealed argument has been a dead horse for a long time. Some jockeys must have very tired arms.

I have yet to see any postings here about numerous people being arrested for improper concealment.

 

Maybe some cop somewhere in this state in the next 50 years will arrest a CCLer because 0.25 sq. inches of a pistol butt is visible.

Been waiting to use this again, just didnt want to be the first one!

 

 

post-14937-0-73698600-1602089424_thumb.jpeg

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