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3hr Renewal Discrepancy?


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#61 stm

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Posted 09 August 2018 - 11:47 AM


 

I would be willing to bet there will be an objection period for renewals.
 
To play devil's advocate for a minute, just because there is no arrest, charges or mental health admissions found from the daily checks of the ISP, doesn't mean the local law enforcement agency hasn't had any contacts or run-in's where they would want to object.  There very well have been contacts, but remember.....the objections "should" only be based on if the person is a harm to themselves, or others.  That definition is subject to interpretation depending on the agency and the agency must submit documentation.  Either way, it's understood that once an objection is filed, the applicant is in for a rough ride.


The language in the law is clear and not open to interpretation. There's an objection period in the law for first time applicants, not for renewals. Contact with law enforcement is not a disqualifier. They need to provide proof and documentation that someone is a threat to himself or others.
 


I agree with you to the point that contact with law enforcement isn't an automatic disqualifier and documentation is needed, as I have clearly mentioned above.  However, I haven't found in the law where it mentions an objection period would not be required for renewals.  

And there was nothing in the law that said ISP COULDN'T require everyone to shoot 21/30 rounds inside the 7-ring of the B-27 target, either.

Or that they couldn't require instructors to teach things NOT REQUIRED by JCAR for renewal classes.

ISP has a habit of making things more difficult on us poor civilians than is required. Thankfully we have people like Molly B around to keep them in line!

(No disrespect intended, Craig. I am a fan.)

Edited by stm, 09 August 2018 - 11:49 AM.

yea everyone makes fun of the redneck till the zombies show up. . .


#62 Craigcelia

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Posted 09 August 2018 - 12:15 PM

 

 

I would be willing to bet there will be an objection period for renewals.
 
To play devil's advocate for a minute, just because there is no arrest, charges or mental health admissions found from the daily checks of the ISP, doesn't mean the local law enforcement agency hasn't had any contacts or run-in's where they would want to object.  There very well have been contacts, but remember.....the objections "should" only be based on if the person is a harm to themselves, or others.  That definition is subject to interpretation depending on the agency and the agency must submit documentation.  Either way, it's understood that once an objection is filed, the applicant is in for a rough ride.


The language in the law is clear and not open to interpretation. There's an objection period in the law for first time applicants, not for renewals. Contact with law enforcement is not a disqualifier. They need to provide proof and documentation that someone is a threat to himself or others.
 


I agree with you to the point that contact with law enforcement isn't an automatic disqualifier and documentation is needed, as I have clearly mentioned above.  However, I haven't found in the law where it mentions an objection period would not be required for renewals.  

And there was nothing in the law that said ISP COULDN'T require everyone to shoot 21/30 rounds inside the 7-ring of the B-27 target, either.

Or that they couldn't require instructors to teach things NOT REQUIRED by JCAR for renewal classes.

ISP has a habit of making things more difficult on us poor civilians than is required. Thankfully we have people like Molly B around to keep them in line!

(No disrespect intended, Craig. I am a fan.)

 

None taken.  I couldn't agree more.  We see just from the renewals JCAR and ISP have different thoughts on what should be taught.  



#63 Mr. Fife

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Posted 09 August 2018 - 01:11 PM

I hope they figure it all out now, rather than not having a plan in place once the renewals start.
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#64 357

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Posted 09 August 2018 - 03:50 PM

I would be willing to bet there will be an objection period for renewals.
 
To play devil's advocate for a minute, just because there is no arrest, charges or mental health admissions found from the daily checks of the ISP, doesn't mean the local law enforcement agency hasn't had any contacts or run-in's where they would want to object.  There very well have been contacts, but remember.....the objections "should" only be based on if the person is a harm to themselves, or others.  That definition is subject to interpretation depending on the agency and the agency must submit documentation.  Either way, it's understood that once an objection is filed, the applicant is in for a rough ride.


The language in the law is clear and not open to interpretation. There's an objection period in the law for first time applicants, not for renewals. Contact with law enforcement is not a disqualifier. They need to provide proof and documentation that someone is a threat to himself or others.
I agree with you to the point that contact with law enforcement isn't an automatic disqualifier and documentation is needed, as I have clearly mentioned above.  However, I haven't found in the law where it mentions an objection period would not be required for renewals.

If people who wrote the law wanted to have an objection period for renewals,they would have written it in the law, like they did for first time applicants. Plus it doesn't make sense to have law enforcement object for people who already have a license. Does any other state do that? If they did something wrong their license would have been revoked and it doesn't take much in Illinois and licenses have been revoked even for traffic violations. We should be united in the defense of the 2nd amendment and people's rights.
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#65 jazzemt

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Posted Yesterday, 08:39 PM

We had a lengthy and very productive meeting with the  ISP Firearm Services Bureau Chief, ISP Chief Legal Counsel, and the Legislative Liaison.

 

In regards to the 3-hr. renewal course, we are to cover:

 

A)        any updates to Illinois or federal firearms laws governing concealed carry in Illinois; ownership, storage, carry, transport

 

B]        updates in the Criminal Code Sections listed in Section 1231.10; and

 

C)        appropriate and lawful interaction with law enforcement while transporting or carrying a concealed firearm;

 

D)        Any updates to the FOID Act.

 

E)        prohibited places and parking lot exception

 

F)       Use of Force Statutes - person, dwelling, property - with definitions of dwelling, aggressor, forcible felony, and UUW

 

2)         One hour of instruction to include:

 

            A) Review handgun fundamentals

            B]  Review handgun concealment

            C)  a live fire qualification with a concealable firearm using a B-27 silhouette target consisting of a minimum of 30 rounds and 10 rounds from a distance of 5 yards, 10 rounds from a distance of 7 yards and 10 rounds from a distance of 10 yards.

Is ISP planning on correcting the certificates to reflect what they are now looking for?



#66 Molly B.

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Posted Yesterday, 09:08 PM

We made that request.
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#67 stevem4134

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Posted Today, 06:09 AM

I took the 3 Hour renewal class earlier this month. Will I need to get a new certificate?



#68 Craigcelia

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Posted Today, 06:28 AM

I took the 3 Hour renewal class earlier this month. Will I need to get a new certificate?


Your instructor should have provided one.




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