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Daniel v Armslist


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#1 Euler

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Posted 16 September 2019 - 04:44 PM

Petition for Certiorari

In 2012, Zina Daniel Haughton obtained a domestic abuse restraining order against her estranged husband. The order prohibited the husband from possessing a gun and made him a "prohibited" firearms purchaser under federal and state criminal laws. He obtained a handgun and three "high-capacity" magazines, facilitated by Armslist.com, in an cash deal consummated in a McDonald's parking lot three days after the restraining order was issued. The next day, he murdered Zina Daniel Haughton and two of her coworkers and wounded four others before killing himself, while her daughter, Yasmeen Daniel, witnessed it.

Yasmeen Daniel is the petitioner, on behalf of herself for the trauma she says she experienced and on behalf of the estate of her mother, appealing to SCOTUS.

The suit contends that, not only is Armslist specifically designed to facilitate the circumvention of gun laws, evidenced by its own terms of service which assures users that Armslist does not check or enforce the legality of any sale, but that it knowingly engages in conduct specifically to attract felons and other prohibited persons while making no attempt to flag any potentially illegal gun sales, such as by identifying the parties in a firearm transfer, checking their criminal backgrounds, or enforcing mandatory waiting periods.

Wisconsin courts dismissed the case, on the grounds that Armslist is not itself involved in any transaction, therefore granting it safe harbor.

Armslist has waived its right to respond.

The cert petition is scheduled for conference October 1.

Docket

Edited by Euler, 16 September 2019 - 04:46 PM.

The welfare of the people in particular has always been the alibi of tyrants, and it provides the further advantage of giving the servants of tyranny a good conscience.

- Albert Camus, Resistance, Rebellion, and Death, 1960.


#2 357

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Posted 16 September 2019 - 09:26 PM

Let's blame cars and car dealers for drunk driving.
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#3 borgranta

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Posted 17 September 2019 - 12:23 AM

It is good that the lawsuit against Armslist was dismissed since it would have sent a dangerous precedent that could open the door to someone suing a newspaper like Chicago Tribune over a car being sold through an add to a drunk driver.


Edited by borgranta, 17 September 2019 - 12:24 AM.

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#4 Euler

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Posted 17 September 2019 - 12:51 AM

It is good that the lawsuit against Armslist was dismissed ...


It was only dismissed in Wisconsin. It's scheduled for SCOTUS conference in October.
The welfare of the people in particular has always been the alibi of tyrants, and it provides the further advantage of giving the servants of tyranny a good conscience.

- Albert Camus, Resistance, Rebellion, and Death, 1960.


#5 lockman

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Posted 17 September 2019 - 11:08 AM

What makes Armslist.com any different than a magazine ad or a community bulletin board listing?


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#6 Talonap

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Posted 17 September 2019 - 11:19 AM

It's not up to Armslist or any online seller to check anything. It's up to the FFL  at which the firearm is picked up.



#7 Flynn

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Posted 17 September 2019 - 11:35 AM

What makes Armslist.com any different than a magazine ad or a community bulletin board listing?

 

Nothing beyond the fact it's an easy anti-gun target.  If the Supreme Court does accept this it they best rule that Armslist and other advertising platforms have safe harbor, because if not a big can of worms would be opened up.


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#8 Euler

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Posted 19 September 2019 - 11:47 PM

...
Armslist has waived its right to respond.

The cert petition is scheduled for conference October 1.

Docket


SCOTUS has requested a response, due October 18 (which is after the Oct 1 conference, obviously).
The welfare of the people in particular has always been the alibi of tyrants, and it provides the further advantage of giving the servants of tyranny a good conscience.

- Albert Camus, Resistance, Rebellion, and Death, 1960.


#9 soundguy

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Posted 20 September 2019 - 08:01 PM

National FOID...


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#10 JTHunter

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Posted 20 September 2019 - 09:25 PM

National FOID...

 

Bite your tongue !!  :no:  We shouldn't give them any ideas as the ones they are already dreaming up are bad enough !! :headbang1:


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#11 Tango7

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Posted 22 September 2019 - 03:06 PM

National FOID...


Here you go: weirdamend-622x415.jpg
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#12 JTHunter

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Posted 22 September 2019 - 08:49 PM

Good reply Tango ! :clap:


“We, the people are the rightful masters of both Congress and the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution, but to overthrow men who pervert the Constitution.” - - Abraham Lincoln

“Small minds adhere to the letter of the law; great minds dispense Justice.” - - S. C. Justice Oliver Wendell Holmes

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#13 Euler

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Posted 19 October 2019 - 12:20 AM

The SC requested Armslist to respond to the cert petition. It did.
The welfare of the people in particular has always been the alibi of tyrants, and it provides the further advantage of giving the servants of tyranny a good conscience.

- Albert Camus, Resistance, Rebellion, and Death, 1960.


#14 Euler

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Posted 31 October 2019 - 12:47 PM

Daniel has replied to Armslist's response.
The welfare of the people in particular has always been the alibi of tyrants, and it provides the further advantage of giving the servants of tyranny a good conscience.

- Albert Camus, Resistance, Rebellion, and Death, 1960.


#15 Euler

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Posted 25 November 2019 - 02:02 PM

SCOTUS denied the cert petition today.

As always, the court doesn't say why it was denied, only that it was.
The welfare of the people in particular has always been the alibi of tyrants, and it provides the further advantage of giving the servants of tyranny a good conscience.

- Albert Camus, Resistance, Rebellion, and Death, 1960.


#16 TomKoz

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Posted 25 November 2019 - 07:43 PM

So what does that mean for us non-lawyerly types ?
Stay Alert ... Stay Alive !!

#17 Euler

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Posted 25 November 2019 - 08:06 PM

Armslist continues to be Armslist.
The welfare of the people in particular has always been the alibi of tyrants, and it provides the further advantage of giving the servants of tyranny a good conscience.

- Albert Camus, Resistance, Rebellion, and Death, 1960.


#18 Flynn

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Posted 25 November 2019 - 08:07 PM

So what does that mean for us non-lawyerly types ?

 

It means the lower court in this case the Supreme Court of Wisconsin's reversal and dismissal of the appeals courts reversal (that said it could go forward) stands, case dismissed and closed no lawsuit can go forward on those claims.


Edited by Flynn, 25 November 2019 - 08:14 PM.

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#19 TomKoz

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Posted 25 November 2019 - 10:23 PM

A Win for the 2A !
Stay Alert ... Stay Alive !!

#20 Flynn

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Posted 25 November 2019 - 10:27 PM

A Win for the 2A !

 

And 1st!


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#21 Raw Power

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Posted 26 November 2019 - 04:50 AM

Great news.






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