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AR malfunction, need help


Camar10

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I bought my first AR and right out of the box it would not chamber next round or hold open bolt on empty chamber so i sent it back to manufacturer. I received rifle back with a note from the "gunsmith" stating he put 10 rounds through it and it ran fine, his suggestion was more oil. I took it out yesterday and it still will not cycle correctly, i put 50 rounds through it and 2 cycled correctly. Before sending it back again is there anything i can look for that they obviously missed. I have ran 3 different types of ammo, 556 and 223 and 4 different type magazines and all do the same. There is no way they ran this rifle at the manufacturer. Im a newb to the AR platform and really did not want one but the price was right.

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It sounds like a not getting enough gas problem. I have a fn/fal 5.56 with adjustable gas and if you have too little it won't eject/chamber or hold open the bolt. Too much gas and the bolt carrier slams against the frame and ejects cases about 25 ft.

My AR doesn't like plastic or aluminum mags either, So I went to stainless and haven't had a feed problem since.

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It can be an issue both overgassed (especially with shorter gas systems) and undergassed (more common).

 

If it's overgassed you will get premature bolt unlock before the case pressure goes all the way down. You'll notice damage to the extractor rim, occasional failures to extract, and even broken extractors.

 

If you're chambered for 223 and shoot 5.56 this can cause excess case pressure that will cause additional drag on pulling the case out of the chamber. 223 out of 5.56 is fine. I don't have any experience with chambering that splits the difference like. 223 Wilde. Yes there are slight differences in the 2 rounds, especially when tolerances stack.

 

Undergassed guns are going to be more ammo sensitive, which is probably why it works at the gun shop but not when you shoot it.

 

Both issues are solved by changing buffer weights heavier or lighter. Overgassed will cause more problems in the long run mainly because the gas system isn't properly spec'd.

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If you truly believe youve ruled out ammo and mags as the cause, AND your rifle does NOT have an adjustable gas block...try running it wet and oil the heck out of it. Occasionally a MFG lets a few lemons out, but since you have already sent it back in once and they said it functioned, I would try the most simple thing first. Oil it.

 

I had one rifle build I did that was giving me fits when I first took it out to the range (rifle length gas tube on a 20" barrel). I went through checking everything from the gas port size, making sure the gas tube was aligned correctly with the gas port, tried a few different types of ammo, tried a few different magazines. It still would never lock open after the last round was fired, and occasionally FTE and jam. Ended up just needing a LOT of oil on it for about 200rds to get everything broken in and running smooth.

 

If you haven't field stripped your bolt carrier group yet, go ahead and do so and double check the gas rings on the bolt itself. If they are in good shape, then oil the heck out of it all, put it back together, and head to the range!

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I will say that while my semi autos are not finicky, I have one bolt rifle that LOVES oil and one bolt rifle that HATES oil. If I over oil my daughters savage 10 it locks the bolt closed after firing 3-4 rounds. If I oil it then dry it off, it cycles perfectly. Kind of off topic but shows how different “freedom sticks” operate differently. Something as simple as amount of oil will screw operation.
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ARs are like old Harleys, they need plenty of oil and regular cleaning to run right. Also use high quality ammo for the first two or three hundred rounds. You may want to contact the gunsmith who said it worked fine and ask him what ammo he used and buy that ammo for the break in period. Did I mention to clean and oil it well on a regular basis?

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thanks all, the only thing different they could have done was lock it in a gun vise and maybe that did the trick on short stroking, but i ain't carrying a gun vise around. I am gonna take the furniture off tonight and oil the crap out of it and try and see if it runs better, and maybe even shoot it out of a vise to see if it is sorta "limp wristing" like some handgun do.

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As have mentioned, it could be a gas issue. Another thing to check is to pull the charging handle all the way back. Check the distance of the bolt from the bolt catch. Should have at least 10mm. If not means your buffer is too long or something inside the buffer tube blocking it to move all the way back.
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I just bought my first AR (ruger ar 556) so I don't know anything. But, what I would do is go back to the range with a camera or go-pro, film my ammunition laid out, my mags laid out and then film me firing - and all the malfunctions. Then I would make a copy and send it back with the gun and tell them you want them to fix it, send me a new one or refund my money... and be done with it.

 

JMO :)

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This might sound strange, but give this a shot while you have it apart....

 

Remove the buffer and spring, lube both, reinstall.

 

I've had similar short stroking malfunctions due to the buffer and spring not being lubed. After lubing those both, and heading back out to the range, the malfunction was gone.

 

If you can, find some M193 ammo, since that's close to the hottest loads out there (provided your barrel/chamber are wylde or 5.56 rated.

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This, plus BigJim and Skrapyard's suggestions. New ARs need to be run oily/ greasy the first few hundred rounds for proper break in. They are designed so that if it's too much lube it'll blow out the ejection port or burn up.

 

Also, don't just rely on a half @$$ed chamber cleaning with a Bore Snake. Really keep the chamber and lug recesses scrubbed clean, and the chamber DRY.

 

This might sound strange, but give this a shot while you have it apart....

 

Remove the buffer and spring, lube both, reinstall.

 

I've had similar short stroking malfunctions due to the buffer and spring not being lubed. After lubing those both, and heading back out to the range, the malfunction was gone.

 

If you can, find some M193 ammo, since that's close to the hottest loads out there (provided your barrel/chamber are wylde or 5.56 rated.

 

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Those new to the AR15 always put tons of lube where you do not need lube, and no lube where it actually needs lube. If you are taking furniture off, you are not putting lube in the right place.

 

What needs lube is between the bolt and bolt carrier, and the four "rails" on the sides of the bolt carrier. The little tabs on the side of the charging handle and the grooves they ride in is good too.

 

Your post doesn't really describe what is happening, so what exactly is the malfunction? The times that it does work, what direction from the rifle do the cases eject? What is the rifle configuration?

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taking the furniture off is in reference to how it was at the manufacturer when they ran it and said it was fine, it was naked so i am just trying to duplicate the conditions in which it ran for them. Casing eject about 4-5 ft pretty much in the same area everytime , about my 4 o'clock. And as far as the malfunctions it does not chamber next round or lock open on last round.

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I just bought my first AR (ruger ar 556) so I don't know anything. But, what I would do is go back to the range with a camera or go-pro, film my ammunition laid out, my mags laid out and then film me firing - and all the malfunctions. Then I would make a copy and send it back with the gun and tell them you want them to fix it, send me a new one or refund my money... and be done with it.

 

JMO :)

And yes, this is the plan if i cannot get it to run correctly in the next 100-150 rounds.

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Everyone's first reaction is to look at gas system issues, and they are possible but lets look at a couple other things quickly also.

 

Do these tests:

 

Pull the bolt all the way to the rear with the charging handle. Look in the ejection port and see how far the face of the bolt is behind the bolt catch.

 

Open up the rifle and take the BCG out. Make sure that the gas key on top of the bolt carrier is not loose. Inspect the area around the gas key for any signs that gas is escaping from that area. Reassemble BCG and charging handle.

 

Then, take the buffer and spring out of the buffer tube, the reassemble the rifle. Slowly pull the charging handle to the rear, the bolt should retract with a minimum amount of force. Don't pull it all the way back. Push the charging handle back and then you should be able to point the rifle down and give it a little jerk and the bolt should go closed. What we're trying to see here is if the hammer or anything else is causing excessive drag. A broken in rifle you should be able to "slosh" the bolt back and forth with little effort, although use care because the gas key will hit the charging handle. Can also just push the bolt back with a finger through the ejection port all the way to the rear, you will feel when the bolt carrier comes into contact with the hammer.

 

Now try the same test with an EMPTY magazine inserted. This is to determine if the magazine is riding too high and pushing against the BCG. Plastic magazine have thicker feedlips so more likely to encounter this issue.

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I had one of mine that wouldn't cycle. Maybe get 3 rds to feed then jamb. Talked to friend who now works for Rock River and he said the top screw that holds the butt plate on the full stock does not have a through hole in it without looking at it. Gave it to him and 80 cents later it worked fine. Needs the hole to relieve pressure as the bolt and buffer come back. Told him he was full of $$it but in the end I was wrong. YMMV
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I have a RGuns AR I bought days after Sandy Hook when there were few choices. After a couple hundred rounds the first round in a fresh mag (regardless of how many loaded in the mag) would get stuck going in the chamber.

 

I went to their shop and they cleaned it up and did a little other work. They were evasive on what they did. Took it home, same problem. I made them send a call tag as I am over an hour away.

 

Got it back with a laundry list of work they did and it runs fine now.

 

Mine had a noticeable slowdown with about a half inch to go from a fully closed bolt, something was definitely out of tolerance if you rode the bolt release you could feel it catch.

 

Long story short - call em and express frustration and don’t tolerate lame excuses for poor quality.

 

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I have a RGuns AR I bought days after Sandy Hook when there were few choices. After a couple hundred rounds the first round in a fresh mag (regardless of how many loaded in the mag) would get stuck going in the chamber.

 

I went to their shop and they cleaned it up and did a little other work. They were evasive on what they did. Took it home, same problem. I made them send a call tag as I am over an hour away.

 

Got it back with a laundry list of work they did and it runs fine now.

 

Mine had a noticeable slowdown with about a half inch to go from a fully closed bolt, something was definitely out of tolerance if you rode the bolt release you could feel it catch.

 

Long story short - call em and express frustration and don’t tolerate lame excuses for poor quality.

 

 

I’ll never buy another gun from there ever again.

 

I had a similar issue, but despite bringing it back, it never ran. I wound up having the barrel and bcg replaced, and upon removing the gas block from their barrel, it looked like a chipmunk chewed on the top of the barrel over the gas port. They did the right thing by replacing it, but I had to settle for a shorter barrel, which was fine.

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