Riverpilot Posted December 23, 2013 at 10:26 PM Share Posted December 23, 2013 at 10:26 PM (edited) Good afternoon all,I just wanted to create a thread about those who happen to live outside of Illinois.After getting my Illinois Digital I.D. created today, I went to the Illinois CCL site just to see what would happen when inputing my data.At the question of what state I live in, I clicked on Iowa.. at which point I got the following message:"Your state does not qualify for a non-resident license in accordance to Illinois Statute 430 ILCS 66/40 BI then attempted to click on the rest of the states, and all gave me the same error message except for the following, listed below:Thanks much all. Added 02/02/2014: Valinda/Molly B is asking out-of-state residents for contact information.1) As of 09/1/2014, Hawaii, South Carolina, Virginia, New Mexico are the ONLY states approved for residents to apply for a non-resident Illinois CCL.2) The list of states approved can be found on http://ccl4illinois....ublic/home.aspx3) Once on that web site, click on "Checklist prior to applying" found under "New Applicants".4) Scroll down, and under "Non-Residents", will be the list of approved states. Edited September 2, 2014 at 03:42 AM by Riverpilot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob Posted December 23, 2013 at 10:37 PM Share Posted December 23, 2013 at 10:37 PM (edited) the law seems clear. (430 ILCS 66/40)Sec. 40. Non-resident license applications.(a) For the purposes of this Section, "non-resident" means a person who has not resided within this State for more than 30 days and resides in another state or territory.( The Department shall by rule allow for non-resident license applications from any state or territory of the United States with laws related to firearm ownership, possession, and carrying, that are substantially similar to the requirements to obtain a license under this Act. as part of this act, Illinois added a gem that required voluntary admissions to mental health facilities to be reported to the state and that a voluntary admission was a dis-qualifier for a FOID card and a LTC. no other states have a similar provision, so no non-residents qualify. I don't know if the wording of the law was an unintentional or deliberate thing. Either seems possible. Edited December 23, 2013 at 10:37 PM by bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riverpilot Posted December 23, 2013 at 11:21 PM Author Share Posted December 23, 2013 at 11:21 PM I'm not sure Bob. I just wanted to bring this information out for everybody to see. I'm hoping it's just a pre-5th bug, but :shrugs: I'd hate to see persons go spend hundreds of dollars specifically for Illinois training to end up finding out they can't get an Illinois non-resident license. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aka Posted December 24, 2013 at 01:18 AM Share Posted December 24, 2013 at 01:18 AM I have at least two students from IN and FL who took the classes in IL. They are probably going to face the same issue I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikemsu1 Posted December 24, 2013 at 01:21 AM Share Posted December 24, 2013 at 01:21 AM the good ole Illinois screw job! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgsailor Posted December 24, 2013 at 04:17 PM Share Posted December 24, 2013 at 04:17 PM Like I have said before, they don't want anybody carrying concealed and will continue to make it so hard, so complicated, so restrictive and so expensive that many people will just give up. That is just for residents of Illinois. By they, I mean a hand full of people at the top. It gets more complicated every day and until taken to court it will remain that way. Iowan also and I have just about given up on being an approved instructor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riverpilot Posted December 24, 2013 at 09:00 PM Author Share Posted December 24, 2013 at 09:00 PM Like I have said before, they don't want anybody carrying concealed and will continue to make it so hard, so complicated, so restrictive and so expensive that many people will just give up. That is just for residents of Illinois. By they, I mean a hand full of people at the top. It gets more complicated every day and until taken to court it will remain that way. Iowan also and I have just about given up on being an approved instructor. I've read about your plight, sailor, and it is a shame. Not that it will help you in terms of being an instructor, but I am hoping on the 5th we can at least apply for a CCL non-resident license. I know there are folks looking into this, and hopefully we'll have good news soon. Regardless.. Merry Christmas to all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WtJen Posted December 24, 2013 at 10:56 PM Share Posted December 24, 2013 at 10:56 PM So, create a non-resident permit that no non-resident can qualify for. Illinois at its finest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad O. Posted December 25, 2013 at 12:06 AM Share Posted December 25, 2013 at 12:06 AM Well that's gonna suck for people living on the other side of border communities like the Quad Cities etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
III Posted December 25, 2013 at 12:49 AM Share Posted December 25, 2013 at 12:49 AM Each and every day I find another reason which makes me question why I moved back to this state.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgsailor Posted December 25, 2013 at 09:56 AM Share Posted December 25, 2013 at 09:56 AM So, create a non-resident permit that no non-resident can qualify for. Illinois at its finest.That's good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChicagoZman Posted December 25, 2013 at 02:46 PM Share Posted December 25, 2013 at 02:46 PM the law seems clear. (430 ILCS 66/40)Sec. 40. Non-resident license applications.(a) For the purposes of this Section, "non-resident" means a person who has not resided within this State for more than 30 days and resides in another state or territory.( The Department shall by rule allow for non-resident license applications from any state or territory of the United States with laws related to firearm ownership, possession, and carrying, that are substantially similar to the requirements to obtain a license under this Act. as part of this act, Illinois added a gem that required voluntary admissions to mental health facilities to be reported to the state and that a voluntary admission was a dis-qualifier for a FOID card and a LTC. no other states have a similar provision, so no non-residents qualify. I don't know if the wording of the law was an unintentional or deliberate thing. Either seems possible.So an Illinois resident that seeks mental health care in another state can be an instructor and obtain a permit while a resident of another state that has never been to a mental health facility cannot? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob Posted December 26, 2013 at 06:14 PM Share Posted December 26, 2013 at 06:14 PM (edited) So an Illinois resident that seeks mental health care in another state can be an instructor and obtain a permit while a resident of another state that has never been to a mental health facility cannot? An interesting point. I think you would have to lie under oath about it though I think that question is likely to be on the app. Some of this stuff will probably be sorted out by the courts in our favor eventually. Edited December 26, 2013 at 06:15 PM by bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riverpilot Posted December 26, 2013 at 08:32 PM Author Share Posted December 26, 2013 at 08:32 PM So an Illinois resident that seeks mental health care in another state can be an instructor and obtain a permit while a resident of another state that has never been to a mental health facility cannot? An interesting point. I think you would have to lie under oath about it though I think that question is likely to be on the app. Some of this stuff will probably be sorted out by the courts in our favor eventually. I'm hoping, at least for non-resident CCL, that this will be sorted out come January 5th. Especially considering Illinois requires all out-of-state residents to fill out a notarized affidavit stating that "the applicant meets the mental health standards in Illinois to obtain a firearm". There are much smarter people than I am looking into this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riverpilot Posted December 28, 2013 at 03:48 AM Author Share Posted December 28, 2013 at 03:48 AM An update for out of state residents. Illinois will accept applications from the state of... :drum roll please: Hawaii. They just updated the CCL web site to list that state. So, if you're from Hawaii, congratulations on being able to apply for an Illinois CCL. Hopefully this is only the beginning of residents from other states which can apply for an Illinois CCL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rail Posted December 28, 2013 at 04:20 AM Share Posted December 28, 2013 at 04:20 AM The "substantially similar" clause was supposedly a drafting error in the original bill. Hopefully that part is struck out in a clean-up bill. Otherwise I will be very unhappy as a non-resident unable to apply. I want more than car-carry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChicagoZman Posted December 28, 2013 at 05:09 AM Share Posted December 28, 2013 at 05:09 AM An update for out of state residents. Illinois will accept applications from the state of... :drum roll please: Hawaii. They just updated the CCL web site to list that state. So, if you're from Hawaii, congratulations on being able to apply for an Illinois CCL. Hopefully this is only the beginning of residents from other states which can apply for an Illinois CCL.I predict that they will soon also add Maryland and the District of Columbia but no others. Just a hunch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riverpilot Posted December 28, 2013 at 05:21 AM Author Share Posted December 28, 2013 at 05:21 AM (edited) An update for out of state residents. Illinois will accept applications from the state of... :drum roll please: Hawaii. They just updated the CCL web site to list that state. So, if you're from Hawaii, congratulations on being able to apply for an Illinois CCL. Hopefully this is only the beginning of residents from other states which can apply for an Illinois CCL.I predict that they will soon also add Maryland and the District of Columbia but no others. Just a hunch. I certainly hope you're incorrect. I am cautiously optimistic that those on our side will be able to oil the squeaky door so it opens all the way. I'll be all ready to complete my app on the 5th. After a little research, it appears that the ability to get a CCW in Hawaii is close to zero, unless you're an armed guard. Edited December 28, 2013 at 04:32 PM by Riverpilot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aka Posted December 29, 2013 at 12:18 AM Share Posted December 29, 2013 at 12:18 AM An update for out of state residents. Illinois will accept applications from the state of... :drum roll please: Hawaii. They just updated the CCL web site to list that state. So, if you're from Hawaii, congratulations on being able to apply for an Illinois CCL. Hopefully this is only the beginning of residents from other states which can apply for an Illinois CCL. My understanding is that Hawaii has never issue a CCL. They are a May Issue state and basically thumbing their noses at the 2nd Amendment. Now let me add - that is my understanding and I could be totally wrong. So if someone has better information please post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChicagoZman Posted December 29, 2013 at 01:00 AM Share Posted December 29, 2013 at 01:00 AM An update for out of state residents. Illinois will accept applications from the state of... :drum roll please: Hawaii. They just updated the CCL web site to list that state. So, if you're from Hawaii, congratulations on being able to apply for an Illinois CCL. Hopefully this is only the beginning of residents from other states which can apply for an Illinois CCL. My understanding is that Hawaii has never issue a CCL. They are a May Issue state and basically thumbing their noses at the 2nd Amendment. Now let me add - that is my understanding and I could be totally wrong. So if someone has better information please post.According to the State of Hawaii Crime Prevention and Justice Assistance Division: "Hawaii’s county police departments also process license applications for the open and/or concealed carry of firearms in public. Statewide in 2012, 168 employees of private security firms were issued carry licenses, and two were denied. Four private citizens applied for a concealed carry license in the City & County of Honolulu, and one applied in Maui County, and all five were denied at the discretion of the respective county police chief." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoadyRunner Posted December 29, 2013 at 01:06 AM Share Posted December 29, 2013 at 01:06 AM (edited) In HI, "may issue" = "No issue" Just like many other "may issue" States I'm sure. Edited December 29, 2013 at 01:07 AM by RoadyRunner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryan_j Posted December 29, 2013 at 05:53 PM Share Posted December 29, 2013 at 05:53 PM NJ is similar as well. We are "May issue" but only 1600 or so people get licenses per year and 99% of these are security guards and armored car drivers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
domin8 Posted December 30, 2013 at 01:39 AM Share Posted December 30, 2013 at 01:39 AM This will be interesting. I'm a Utah resident living in Illinois. This will setup an interesting scenario should I get denied. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borgranta Posted December 30, 2013 at 03:01 AM Share Posted December 30, 2013 at 03:01 AM This will be interesting. I'm a Utah resident living in Illinois. This will setup an interesting scenario should I get denied.If you end up suing ILLINOIS remember to use the equal protection as one of your chief arguement since there will be at least three classes of individuals: residents with carry licenses, non-residents with carry licenses, and non-residents without carry licenses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
domin8 Posted December 30, 2013 at 03:08 AM Share Posted December 30, 2013 at 03:08 AM I think everybody sees that as a slam dunk case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borgranta Posted December 30, 2013 at 03:22 AM Share Posted December 30, 2013 at 03:22 AM I think everybody sees that as a slam dunk case.Imagine if people from INDIANA and/or WISCONSIN sued and the case ended up going to the 7th circuit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
domin8 Posted December 30, 2013 at 03:35 AM Share Posted December 30, 2013 at 03:35 AM I would like to. Imagine if somebody from Utah sued and by some miracle it ended up in the 10th Circuit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gray Peterson Posted December 30, 2013 at 07:44 AM Share Posted December 30, 2013 at 07:44 AM (edited) This will be interesting. I'm a Utah resident living in Illinois. This will setup an interesting scenario should I get denied.If you end up suing ILLINOIS remember to use the equal protection as one of your chief arguement since there will be at least three classes of individuals: residents with carry licenses, non-residents with carry licenses, and non-residents without carry licenses. This would be a mistake considering what was stated in Shepard II and Posner's statement about "open carry" laws and the reaming that occurred of counsel during the Shepard II oral arguments. As someone who has directly litigated this precise issue in the 10th Circuit, it would be a mistake to solely focus on equal protection. When Moore v. Madigan went up last year, it was against a facial challenge against the public carry ban statute. Merely going after the concealed carry license issuance would be a mistake, as both the District Court or even the 7th Circuit could, in the hypothetical case of Non-Residents of Illinois v. Hiram Grau could cite Peterson v. Martinez. You need to go after the public carry ban again and ask for an injunction against that statute, along with an alternative relief for issuance of the license, and you need to basically attack the carry ban again. It can even be done on a preliminary injunction, or even a TRO. The substantially similar requirement is irrational without 2A being thrown in, in light of the fact that substantially similar language has only been used in reciprocal licensing agreements instead of being allowed to even apply. This all being said, it's been made clear repeatedly by Todd and Molly that the current ISP interpretation is going to be constitutionally problematic, particularly when no bordering state of Illinois qualifies under their interpretation, and if Moore was any indicator, the non-resident vehicle carry provision isn't going to be enough to satisfy. Edited December 30, 2013 at 07:50 AM by Gray Peterson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xwing Posted December 30, 2013 at 03:59 PM Share Posted December 30, 2013 at 03:59 PM (edited) I just saw the list too. So they've picked that state which has never, even once issued a license to someone who is not a LEO. And they call that "similar". We certainly know that those running the show are pure anti-freedom, and also what their goal is. Edited December 30, 2013 at 03:59 PM by Xwing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riverpilot Posted December 30, 2013 at 05:53 PM Author Share Posted December 30, 2013 at 05:53 PM I'm still hoping they add several states before Sunday. At the very least the border states. lol I guess I'm just glad I've only spent $150 so far in pursuit of getting an Illinois CCL. I just want to ensure that people out-of-state realize they cannot get a license at this point in time. I'd REALLY hate to see people spending hundreds of dollars JUST for this license and then end up finding they can't. I know Todd, Molly, ISRA, and I'm sure others are looking into it. :crosses fingers: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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