Researching 22 LR Pistol - Other Opinions?

[InterestedBystander]

I've developed a recent interest in picking up a .22 LR handgun.

 

After some online research, some overthinking and narrowing things down, thought I would also ask for additional forum opinion in case I overlooked something.

 

Team TL;DR go away :-)

 

Criteria and items under consideration:

 

-Semi Auto Pistols only (plinking use and similar to modern semis permitting familiar use of controls and also allowing use as a "trainer" for someone else new to firearms.)

-No 1911 style at this time

-No revolvers at this time

-Not interested in a high dollar premium pistol, target or otherwise

-No grip styles like the Ruger 22/45, Browning Buckmarks, etc

 

Think I have narrowed choices for now to a Walther PPQ 22 4" bbl (not the P22) or S&W M&P 22 Compact 3.5" bbl. Took the Ruger SR22 out of consideration and a Sig P250-22 off the list.

 

https://www.smith-wesson.com/firearms/mp-22-compact

http://www.waltherarms.com/handguns/ppq/ppq-22/

 

-Magazine capacity of 10 vs 12 seems a non issue in 22

-Supplied with 2 magazines vs 1 magazine provides added value

-Availability and pricing of magazines...seems to vary and require some searching

-Accuracy (for a non target 22) in general should be reasonable

-Reliability (good) and sensitivity (low) using various brands, types and velocity of ammo

-Reasonable trigger pull for a 22. Don't want a heavy pull DA or otherwise.

-Easy racking slide.

-Not a fan of mag disconnects, but another non issue on a 22 I think

-Accessory availability? Other than mags, maybe holsters? PPQ 22 is supposedly identical size as PPQ which opens more options. Smith is 87% of regular M&P.

-PPQ 22 is heavier by several ounces due to identical size as original PPQ but I think another non issue in this caliber.

-Both have threaded bbls (just in case we ever see IL changes) and also have a model that comes with an adapter.

-Special tools needed for take down, adjustment, etc are provided with firearm

 

Guess now it comes down to finding them in stock, seeing how they fit and feel in the hand, and hopefully range rentals to check out the trigger pull, takeup, etc.

 

I know this was kind of long, but any others I should consider?

 

Thanks

[luckydawg13]

my first pick would be a Ruger mark 2 or one of the newer mark models but I'm a big Ruger fan cuzz they just work and there is all kinds

of after market parts for them did you look at http://www.ruger-firearms.com/products/sr22Pistol/models.htmlalso you may want to go over

on a 22 fourm and poke around http://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/index.phpthis is a vary good fourm lots of good people on that

sight good luck just thought i would add this http://www.brownells.com/parts/Ruger/Mark+II/index.htm?f_a=1

[soundguy]

I love shooting my Buckmark and Ruger Mark III.

The S&W 617 is a delight, 10 rounds in a revolver. Big heavy gun. No recoil at all.

I have an old Hi Standard which is also pretty sweet but it's a lot like the Buckmark and Ruger which are easier to find.

There's a Bersa that looks pretty fun, the one reminiscent of a Walther PPK.

 

I'd go with a new Ruger Mark IV or a Browning Buckmark. Reliable. Accurate. Not horribly expensive.

[spu69]

I have two SW 22a pistols with red dots on them that are accurate and reliable and I use for competition NRA 900 matches. Inexpensive (under $300) and mags about $25 each.

 

I believe they stopped making that model and have started selling a similar model the SW22 Victory. Takedown does not appear as simple (push button on the 22a maybe a screw on the victory) but otherwise seems similar.

 

 

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[smokehouse]

If you want Reliability...star FAR away from the Walther. My friend landed up trading his off as the thing was so picky with ammo, it drove him mad.

 

Personally, I landed up with the Ruger. If I had one complaint about the thing it is that the DA trigger pull is pretty hard. Not rough, just hard. Personally, I couldn't care less about that because this thing is a plinker only. It will never be used for home defense, or for carry. At the range/etc...I'll cycle a round intot eh chamber and it's SA from there on...and the SA trigger on the SR22 is way better. Not Buckmark better...but it is still really nice.

 

I got mine as a pistol trainer for my 8 year old daughter so I wanted it to be small, it fit her hand better than the MK xx line and the Buckmark. I'll also say that so far *knocks on wood*, the thing has been rock solid no matter what I've run through it. With that said, all I've ran through it was now extinct Blazer bulk and the Federal Auto Match 325rd box stuff. I'm sure that as sure as the new day, the pistol will FTF, FTE at some point...but so far, it hasn't done it once.

[RandyP]

IMHO the new standard that all other metal rimfire pistols need to meet is the Ruger Mk IV - one push-button for takedown, very accurate design, built like a tank, will last several lifetimes. My Next choice IS the Browning Buckmark. Super accurate and takedown requires only a single allen wrench.

 

I own both the Ruger and the Buckmark, as well as a Taurus long barrel revolver and a Beretta 21a, plus a couple conversion kits for 9mm semi-autos.. But have NO familiarity with polymer rimfires.

[Smallbore]

The Ruger Mark 2 is a work horse. The 4 is easy take down but will it remain tight.

[OldMarineVet]

I know you said no revolvers at this time, but I want to share what I learned buying a 22LR revolver. I had zero experience with 22's... never even fired one.

 

I carry a Ruger LCR 38 for backup and it's great. So when I looked for a 22LR revolver for one of my kids, I bought a Ruger LCR 22LR (same size revolver, but holds 8 rounds instead of 5.) What surprised me was the trigger pull was noticeably heavier than the LCR 38. Then I was reminded the 22LR round is "Rim Fire" not "Center Fire" (FYI, the 22 Magnum is Center Fire)

 

Rim Fire means the gun powder is inside of the outer edge (looks like a fold) around the back of the shell. In contrast, the gun powder of Center Fire is behind a notch-like dent at the center of the back of the shell. Even though the round is smaller for the 22LR than any of the Center Fire rounds, the firing pin strikes a thicker surface for the 22LR round than any of the Center Fire rounds. So that's why the trigger pull has to be heavier.

 

Just a word to the wise for anybody looking for their first 22LR revolver.

[RandyP]

.22LR and .22 Magnum are both rim fire, meaning the impact sensitive priming compound is spun into the rim at the back of the case during manufacture, then powder is added. Centerifre cartridges use a separate 'primer' cup which is inserted into a circular recess at the back of the case after which powder is added. Generally speaking rimfires are more susceptible to 'duds;' than center fire making them a less than optimal choice for self defense. Not an issue with plinking at the range.

[patriot1776]

Have a Walther P22 and a S&W 22 auto they both eat without problems but I only use CCI . The Walther is a little different and harder to take down the S&W is an M&P so it operates and takes down like the other M&P 's .

[rmart]

I don't know why you ruled out the Buckmark. The BM comes with 3 different grip styles, the URX, UDX, and UFX grips. One of which will almost certainly fit you very comfortably. My personal favorite is the original standard grip which is basically the UFX grip.

 

Try them out, you may change your mind on the BM. It's a great pistol.

[patriot1776]

S&W M&P compact / With threaded barrel

[mikew]

22 Revolver:

I have a S&W J frame 6 shot stainless revolver.

very light trigger, shoots every time.

 

WRT Ruger and Grips:

While you can't change the grip angle of the 22/45,

there are certainly different grips around for the traditional shaped models,

and I assume for the 22/45 as well.

 

I have a 22 mkIII that I use for introducing new people to shooting, but it came with RH target grips,

that I have changed out for ambidextrous grips.

[smokehouse]

I don't know why you ruled out the Buckmark. The BM comes with 3 different grip styles, the URX, UDX, and UFX grips. One of which will almost certainly fit you very comfortably. My personal favorite is the original standard grip which is basically the UFX grip.

 

Try them out, you may change your mind on the BM. It's a great pistol.

 

My father purchased a Buckmark 4" micro bull barrel sometime in the early 2000's. He shot that thing to death. I bought it from him around 2007, and did the same thing. That gun was as reliable as the new day, extremely accurate, and would darn near eat anything I cycled through it (except crap ammo and truncated cone stuff). I had to replace a few things like the extractor, recoil spring assembly...but it still ran like a champ. My only beef with it was the takedown, which really sucked (not as bad as the older Ruger's though). It is also heavy for what it is (that's a good/bad thing depending on how you look at it). Other than that, I literally cannot tell you how many rounds that gun saw...I can wager that I personally ran some 25K+ in the time I had it.

 

I'd buy another in a heartbeat if it weren't for the heft of the gun. Like I said before, I wanted something that was easier to my daughter to shoot. She has very small hands that fit the SR22.

 

I will say the take down of the SR22 is just awesome...

 

When it is all said and done...once my daughter is a bit bigger, I'll probably get a MK IV.

[InterestedBystander]

Thanks for comments. I know people love their Rugers and Buckmarks including other friends but they just don't work for me.

 

I did discover rimfirecentral that was pretty useful...until their stupid advertising network chronically kept taking over browser tabs, telling me my tablet was infected and I needed to install software! Yeah, NO!

[InterestedBystander]

I don't know why you ruled out the Buckmark. The BM comes with 3 different grip styles, the URX, UDX, and UFX grips. One of which will almost certainly fit you very comfortably. My personal favorite is the original standard grip which is basically the UFX grip.

 

Try them out, you may change your mind on the BM. It's a great pistol.

I certainly could have missed some grip options there and will look again. Thanks

[Hipshot Percussion]

I second the 'stay away from the Walther P22Q'. I have one and it has been a difficult pistol, and that's being nice. It only works with CCI Mini Mags for me, and I had to do a lot of work to make it work right. The trigger ears had to be sanded down as they were digging into the slide, which also had to be sanded down along with the Hammer, which was dragging against the slide. I added a heavier captured spring system which helps with takedown and putting it back together, and also helped with the gun returning to battery.

 

That being said, I have no idea if they have fixed these "known" problems in the past 5 years. When its running, it is a sweet DA/SA gun. Nicely balanced and I have always liked the way Walther grips fit in my hand.

 

My Son and SIL both bought the Ruger SR22 and this seems to be a fine pistol.

[Not me]

Love my Mark series target models for accuracy, but since they are out of the running I would suggest looking at the SR22. I love mine and it was a good platform to teach my wife with. I have only had issue with Winchester (333s) .22 FTEs every other cheap bulk .22 ammo it gobbles up with surprisingly good accuracy.

[blck10th]

I've had no issues with my regular size M&P .22. I have a p22 for my son. It had to go back to walther 2 times. It's now ok but I should have bought him something else.

 

 

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[OldMarineVet]

.22LR and .22 Magnum are both rim fire, meaning the impact sensitive priming compound is spun into the rim at the back of the case during manufacture, then powder is added. Centerifre cartridges use a separate 'primer' cup which is inserted into a circular recess at the back of the case after which powder is added. Generally speaking rimfires are more susceptible to 'duds;' than center fire making them a less than optimal choice for self defense. Not an issue with plinking at the range.

RandyP, thank you for the correction. I see there are some rifle .22 cartridges that are center-fire (Remington) but not the .22 Magnum. Now I know.

[OldMarineVet]

22 Revolver:

I have a S&W J frame 6 shot stainless revolver.

very light trigger, shoots every time.

 

WRT Ruger and Grips:

While you can't change the grip angle of the 22/45,

there are certainly different grips around for the traditional shaped models,

and I assume for the 22/45 as well.

 

I have a 22 mkIII that I use for introducing new people to shooting, but it came with RH target grips,

that I have changed out for ambidextrous grips.

mikew, might you have a S&W J frame center fire revolver to compare the "very light trigger" to? Wondering if this trigger issue is Ruger LCR only. Thanks

 

UPDATE: thinking more about this. The Ruger LCR 38 and 22LR are both double-action only, no hammer to facilitate concealed carry (Ruger recently released the same models with hammers due to popular demand) Maybe the heavier hammer is only detected in double-action (from pulling hammer, if I'm using term correctly) operation.

[InterestedBystander]

I've had no issues with my regular size M&P .22. I have a p22 for my son. It had to go back to walther 2 times. It's now ok but I should have bought him something else.

 

 

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In general, the M&P series have been well reviewed. It seems the full size M&P .22 is still made by Walther/Umarex while the M&P 22 Compact models are made in the US by S&W.

[quackersmacker]

Totally agree with the positive comments about the Ruger SR22. It's simply terrific!

[Neumann]

I don't own one, but if I were shopping today, I would go for a Ruger Mk xx. They are well made, accurate and easy to shoot. The latest version, Mk IV, is easy to take down and reassemble. Earlier models were easy to take down, but often returned to the gun store, in pieces, for help in reassembly. The fixed barrel, tubular receiver and inline bolt are a plus for accuracy and reliability. I do have an High Standard Citation, SIG Mosquito and a couple of S&W .22 revolvers.

 

The tricky part is "reliability" considering the poor quality of .22 LR ammunition in general. LR ammunition is externally lubricated because of its basic nature. The bullet is the same size as the case, and cannot be lubricated internally. 50 years ago, when my Citation was new, I could shoot all day without experiencing a misfire. Now, using "affordable" white and yellow box ammo, it's two shots between FTEs. Clean (expensive and often hard to find) CCI ammo is stored in individual partitions. Otherwise you may be tempted to throw your pistol at the target and walk away.

 

Reliability is the main reason to reconsider buying a revolver. If it fits, it fires. The single-action crispness of a Smith revolver is unequalled by any but the best target semi-auto, like a Smith 41, Colt Woodsman or my cherished Citation. There is nothing to loosen, nothing to take down or otherwise detract from accuracy. My greatest pleasure derives from shooting a vintage K22 Masterpiece with a 6" barrel. The modern version, the 617, feels better with a 4" barrel, due to the heavy, full-length lug. 2" off-hand groups at 25 yards are easily attainable, not some bench-rest fiction of advertising brochures and pulp gun magazines.

 

The utility of look-alike pistols for teaching handling and shooting is highly overrated. If anything, they are less reliable than dedicated .22 pistols. Many are only 80% full size, conversion kits are almost the same, except for zinc castings, and none have the accuracy of a target-style pistol or revolver. A pistol that shoots accurately and reliably will teach sight alignment, grip and trigger control, without all the noise and recoil of center fire. IMO, that's all that's necessary.

[Chitownshooterz]

I have several .22 shooters and am happy with all except the Sig 938 .22 conversion version. Paid in the upper $500 range for this thing and aside from its good looks it is totally worthless past 21 feet. Shoots more like one of those old school Beretta pocket pistols. However, these are the .22's that I enjoy and recommend very much: S & W 34, S & W 43C, S & W 617 6" barrel, Ruger Single Six, Ruger SR-22.

 

Best one of the above for target accuracy is the 617 hands down. Best one for plinking fun is the SR-22. The only issue I have with the revolvers is the time it takes to clean the cylinders and top strap above the forcing cone. As was said in many of the posts, any brand of ammo will work in these guys.

[smokehouse]

 

The tricky part is "reliability" considering the poor quality of .22 LR ammunition in general. LR ammunition is externally lubricated because of its basic nature. The bullet is the same size as the case, and cannot be lubricated internally. 50 years ago, when my Citation was new, I could shoot all day without experiencing a misfire. Now, using "affordable" white and yellow box ammo, it's two shots between FTEs. Clean (expensive and often hard to find) CCI ammo is stored in individual partitions. Otherwise you may be tempted to throw your pistol at the target and walk away.

 

 

Until the stupidity of 2012, I ran Blazer Bulk and Federal 500 bulk through my Buckmark and S&W M&P 15-22. The Federal was 5-10 fails per box, almost exclusively fail to fire despite a good strike on the rim. Wichester bulk, Remington bulk? "match" low velocity rounds (like Eley offerings)? Stuff like truncated cone stuff? All crap in my semi autos, so I just stayed away form all of it (still do).

 

After the crunch? Well...I sold the Buckmark and nearly boxed the M&P. A few years back, I began getting those Federal Automatch 325rd boxes. For the most part, they have ran perfectly fine through my M&P. I've probably ran 4 boxes of them through it, and had no problems so far (and take in mind, that is one tired rifle...I ran a TON of ammo through that thing).

 

I purchased the SR22 last fall and like I said above, I've yet to have a single failure with the thing, not even a fail to fire. Now, it's a 22 semi auto...it will fail, it just hasn't so far.

[buildbigboats]

I will add my recommendation for any of the Ruger 22LR products. .

I have a pair of Mark IIIs and an SR22. All 3 are great. Eat everything, accurate, excellent for new shooters as well as cheaper way to stay "in shape" for more experienced folks.

Ruger knows 22s and has been building them for ages. Expect my grandson will end up with the Marks.

The new Mark IVs with simplified take down look interesting.

Had a GSG 1911 in 22LR that was a lot of fun to shoot and a decent intro to the 1911 platform. Sold it to thin down vault. Will never get rid of the Rugers

[lee n. field]

I like my Ruger Mark II Target. Hard to go wrong.

[tnertb]

SR22 owners here and happy with it. Got mine with the threaded barrel too.

[narcoden]

I have the SR22 and a new Mark IV. Love them both... My only complaint with the SR22 is that the hammer slaps my hand every so subtle... It's gets uncomfortable after a few hundred rounds. The Mark IV on the other hand... What can I say about it? It's amazing. Everything about it it just right for me. It just feels more refined and is crazy accurate. I love the new one button take down. I can take it apart, clean it and have it back together in 5 minutes.

 

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