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CCL class for someone with MM card? Joliet/Morris area


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#1 Molly B.

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Posted 17 March 2018 - 10:27 AM

I have been contacted by a lady wanting to take the IL CCL course.  She has a MM card and has been told by some instructors that she cannot get an IL CCL - but we know she can - and others have said they will not instruct someone with a MM card.

 

Do we have any instructors in the Morris/Joliet area who would accept her as a student?

 

Please answer here or in PM.


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#2 biggun 1

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Posted 17 March 2018 - 10:41 AM

contact john miller from trigger farm.i see no reason not to allow a person in a class just because they have a mm card.john is a member here but i don,t know how often he logs in.i believe that if she has a mm card the isp will not allow her to purchase a firearm from a gun store but not sure about a private owner deal.


Edited by biggun 1, 17 March 2018 - 10:44 AM.


#3 mic6010

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Posted 17 March 2018 - 11:23 AM

contact john miller from trigger farm.i see no reason not to allow a person in a class just because they have a mm card.john is a member here but i don,t know how often he logs in.i believe that if she has a mm card the isp will not allow her to purchase a firearm from a gun store but not sure about a private owner deal.

I don't believe its the ISP or state of IL that's stopping her from buying from an FFL, its the feds. You can't fill out a 4473 and pass if you have a medical marijuana card from any state.

I believe the new updated 4473 forms now specifically ask about that and thus you have to answer yes to the disqualifying question. Or lie about it an commit a felony which obviously nobody is gonna do.

 

Person to person transfers are legal at the state level. Its a grey area federally. Well its actually not a grey area, that is also illegal in their eyes. But they have no way of knowing because there's no federal background check for person to person transfers. There's only the ISP FOID card check and the state is fine with MMJ card holders possessing firearms and also having an FOID and CCL.

So that's the route she would have to go in order to purchase a firearm. Its really silly but until the feds catch up with the rest of us that's the reality.


Edited by mic6010, 17 March 2018 - 11:25 AM.

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#4 biggun 1

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Posted 17 March 2018 - 11:24 AM

i sent a text to john miller,i believe he will log in when he can molly.



#5 lockman

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Posted 17 March 2018 - 12:32 PM

A M/M card is irrelevant to an FCCL instructor, why even reveal that.

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#6 tkroenlein

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Posted 17 March 2018 - 01:42 PM

How about just pick any instructor and don't offer that information?

#7 WitchDoctor

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Posted 17 March 2018 - 02:05 PM

You probably should not be "medicated" while in class....


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#8 chicagoresident

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Posted 17 March 2018 - 02:55 PM

contact john miller from trigger farm.i see no reason not to allow a person in a class just because they have a mm card.john is a member here but i don,t know how often he logs in.i believe that if she has a mm card the isp will not allow her to purchase a firearm from a gun store but not sure about a private owner deal.

I don't believe its the ISP or state of IL that's stopping her from buying from an FFL, its the feds. You can't fill out a 4473 and pass if you have a medical marijuana card from any state.
I believe the new updated 4473 forms now specifically ask about that and thus you have to answer yes to the disqualifying question. Or lie about it an commit a felony which obviously nobody is gonna do.
 
Person to person transfers are legal at the state level. Its a grey area federally. Well its actually not a grey area, that is also illegal in their eyes. But they have no way of knowing because there's no federal background check for person to person transfers. There's only the ISP FOID card check and the state is fine with MMJ card holders possessing firearms and also having an FOID and CCL.
So that's the route she would have to go in order to purchase a firearm. Its really silly but until the feds catch up with the rest of us that's the reality.
Exactly, you can legally purchase a firearm without filling out form 4473, at least for now...

Maybe if we changed "the gun show loophole" to the "medicinal marijuana patient" loophole the leftys would oppose banning private sales.

Edited by chicagoresident, 17 March 2018 - 02:56 PM.


#9 Mick G

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Posted 17 March 2018 - 06:23 PM

I would think that a credit card is much more important to most instructors then a MM card.

MM never even came up in my class but I think some of my classmates were baked.



#10 Buzzard

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Posted 17 March 2018 - 07:31 PM

You probably should not be "medicated" while in class....

 

Not sure if you meant that in jest. It wasn't displayed in purple or noted, so I assume you were serious. And while I firmly agree someone should not  be handling a firearm while under the influence of drugs and/or alcohol - I have been told there is medical marijuana that has been "depleted" of it's THC content - which is the chemical component in marijuana that gives you a 'buzz".

(I would think that a witch doctor would know this, wink, wink, nudge, nudge!)

 

So technically, if you are medicating yourself with the "right stuff", there is no reason for the feds or anyone to mandate that a person with a MM card and using "Non-THC" cannabis to medicate themselves should suffer a loss of their rights. It's my opinion that marijuana should be treated like alcohol and a person should only run afoul of the law if they are "under the influence" while either driving or handling carrying firearms.



#11 RacerDave6

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Posted 17 March 2018 - 08:12 PM

Check with MMI guns in Minooka.
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#12 WitchDoctor

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Posted 17 March 2018 - 08:21 PM

 

You probably should not be "medicated" while in class....

 

Not sure if you meant that in jest. It wasn't displayed in purple or noted, so I assume you were serious. And while I firmly agree someone should not  be handling a firearm while under the influence of drugs and/or alcohol - I have been told there is medical marijuana that has been "depleted" of it's THC content - which is the chemical component in marijuana that gives you a 'buzz".

(I would think that a witch doctor would know this, wink, wink, nudge, nudge!)

 

So technically, if you are medicating yourself with the "right stuff", there is no reason for the feds or anyone to mandate that a person with a MM card and using "Non-THC" cannabis to medicate themselves should suffer a loss of their rights. It's my opinion that marijuana should be treated like alcohol and a person should only run afoul of the law if they are "under the influence" while either driving or handling carrying firearms.

 

Sir, you raise valid points and have discovered my laziness for not having made those remarks in purple. But I did think about it and i am not sure if I want someone handling live firearms next to me under the influence of anything. The medical marijauna that works without making one silly is a cool idea and i hope it works.


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#13 WitchDoctor

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Posted 17 March 2018 - 08:23 PM

Let folks do their own thing as long as it does not keep me from enjoying mine...


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#14 Craigcelia

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Posted 18 March 2018 - 12:53 AM

Molly, We have a Morris class coming up in May. I would have to check with the property owner. I think we would have to discuss it with the MM holder first as well. Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

#15 Mick G

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Posted 18 March 2018 - 01:57 AM

 

You probably should not be "medicated" while in class....

 

Not sure if you meant that in jest. It wasn't displayed in purple or noted, so I assume you were serious. And while I firmly agree someone should not  be handling a firearm while under the influence of drugs and/or alcohol - I have been told there is medical marijuana that has been "depleted" of it's THC content - which is the chemical component in marijuana that gives you a 'buzz".

(I would think that a witch doctor would know this, wink, wink, nudge, nudge!)

 

So technically, if you are medicating yourself with the "right stuff", there is no reason for the feds or anyone to mandate that a person with a MM card and using "Non-THC" cannabis to medicate themselves should suffer a loss of their rights. It's my opinion that marijuana should be treated like alcohol and a person should only run afoul of the law if they are "under the influence" while either driving or handling carrying firearms.

 

 

I'm pretty sure that the "medical marijuana" is ultra high potency stuff in regards to THC. 

I'm no expert in this but my ex moved to Colorado, had serious back problems and was HIGH 24/7.

I'm sure somebody else can chime in on this, she would call me and say how high she was as if she wasn't annoying enough already.

She was barely able to dial a phone. Luckily for my sanity, she still lives there.



#16 Mick G

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Posted 18 March 2018 - 03:55 AM

Let folks do their own thing as long as it does not keep me from enjoying mine...

 

I agree with this.

What you do in your own abode as long as you aren't harming anyone is your business.

If you crash into my car and aren't under the influence it's an accident.

If you are under the influence then you are an idiot.

Actually I think the police pull over the people who are high on pot because they are the ones driving under the speed limit. 



#17 lockman

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Posted 18 March 2018 - 07:05 AM


You probably should not be "medicated" while in class....


 
Not sure if you meant that in jest. It wasn't displayed in purple or noted, so I assume you were serious. And while I firmly agree someone should not  be handling a firearm while under the influence of drugs and/or alcohol - I have been told there is medical marijuana that has been "depleted" of it's THC content - which is the chemical component in marijuana that gives you a 'buzz".
(I would think that a witch doctor would know this, wink, wink, nudge, nudge!)
 
So technically, if you are medicating yourself with the "right stuff", there is no reason for the feds or anyone to mandate that a person with a MM card and using "Non-THC" cannabis to medicate themselves should suffer a loss of their rights. It's my opinion that marijuana should be treated like alcohol and a person should only run afoul of the law if they are "under the influence" while either driving or handling carrying firearms.


There are combinations of cannabinoids that can provide THC in high doses but contain equal or greater amounts of other cannabinoids, such as CBD that counteract the “high” but still allow the THC to bind to the receptors that provide the relief intended.


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#18 DomG

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Posted 18 March 2018 - 07:31 AM

A M/M card is irrelevant to an FCCL instructor, why even reveal that.

  

How about just pick any instructor and don't offer that information?


Exactly. All you need to do is ask YOURSELF, "Is it legal for me to do this?" If the answer is yes, then it is nobody else's business, including the instructor. JUST like I never ask a business if it is OK for me to carry in their building, if they don't have a GFZ sign. NONE of their business.

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#19 Molly B.

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 10:31 AM

A M/M card is irrelevant to an FCCL instructor, why even reveal that.

 

 

It came up with the first instructor because the prospective student asked if they could get a CCL if they had a MM card.  That instructor said no, MM card holders can not get a CCL in IL. and would not instruct a student that had one.  The student doesn't want to pay for a class if the license is going to be denied and isn't sure the instructor was right.  So, call another instructor, he says yes the student can get a CCL in IL but won't teach a student that has one.

 

Next step - found IllinoisCarry and inquired to get the straight scoop.  


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#20 Mick G

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 03:43 PM

 

You probably should not be "medicated" while in class....


 
Not sure if you meant that in jest. It wasn't displayed in purple or noted, so I assume you were serious. And while I firmly agree someone should not  be handling a firearm while under the influence of drugs and/or alcohol - I have been told there is medical marijuana that has been "depleted" of it's THC content - which is the chemical component in marijuana that gives you a 'buzz".
(I would think that a witch doctor would know this, wink, wink, nudge, nudge!)
 
So technically, if you are medicating yourself with the "right stuff", there is no reason for the feds or anyone to mandate that a person with a MM card and using "Non-THC" cannabis to medicate themselves should suffer a loss of their rights. It's my opinion that marijuana should be treated like alcohol and a person should only run afoul of the law if they are "under the influence" while either driving or handling carrying firearms.


There are combinations of cannabinoids that can provide THC in high doses but contain equal or greater amounts of other cannabinoids, such as CBD that counteract the “high” but still allow the THC to bind to the receptors that provide the relief intended.


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After talking with some that are on MM, it is indeed very ultra high potency. The THC levels are insanely high and it is what the recreational pot smokers refer to as a kind bud or Kush.

http://www.medicalma...ag/very-potent/

Most wouldn't be able to fill out the application, let alone fire a gun accurately.



#21 Glock23

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 05:00 PM


 


You probably should not be "medicated" while in class....
 
Not sure if you meant that in jest. It wasn't displayed in purple or noted, so I assume you were serious. And while I firmly agree someone should not  be handling a firearm while under the influence of drugs and/or alcohol - I have been told there is medical marijuana that has been "depleted" of it's THC content - which is the chemical component in marijuana that gives you a 'buzz".
(I would think that a witch doctor would know this, wink, wink, nudge, nudge!)
 
So technically, if you are medicating yourself with the "right stuff", there is no reason for the feds or anyone to mandate that a person with a MM card and using "Non-THC" cannabis to medicate themselves should suffer a loss of their rights. It's my opinion that marijuana should be treated like alcohol and a person should only run afoul of the law if they are "under the influence" while either driving or handling carrying firearms.


There are combinations of cannabinoids that can provide THC in high doses but contain equal or greater amounts of other cannabinoids, such as CBD that counteract the “high” but still allow the THC to bind to the receptors that provide the relief intended.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 


 
After talking with some that are on MM, it is indeed very ultra high potency. The THC levels are insanely high and it is what the recreational pot smokers refer to as a kind bud or Kush.
http://www.medicalma...ag/very-potent/
Most wouldn't be able to fill out the application, let alone fire a gun accurately.

As has been said, there are many forms of MM, including those that focus directly on relieving whatever health issue that exists while providing ZERO of the "stonedoutofyourmind" effects.

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#22 Mick G

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 05:25 PM

 

 


You probably should not be "medicated" while in class....
 
Not sure if you meant that in jest. It wasn't displayed in purple or noted, so I assume you were serious. And while I firmly agree someone should not  be handling a firearm while under the influence of drugs and/or alcohol - I have been told there is medical marijuana that has been "depleted" of it's THC content - which is the chemical component in marijuana that gives you a 'buzz".
(I would think that a witch doctor would know this, wink, wink, nudge, nudge!)
 
So technically, if you are medicating yourself with the "right stuff", there is no reason for the feds or anyone to mandate that a person with a MM card and using "Non-THC" cannabis to medicate themselves should suffer a loss of their rights. It's my opinion that marijuana should be treated like alcohol and a person should only run afoul of the law if they are "under the influence" while either driving or handling carrying firearms.


There are combinations of cannabinoids that can provide THC in high doses but contain equal or greater amounts of other cannabinoids, such as CBD that counteract the “high” but still allow the THC to bind to the receptors that provide the relief intended.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 


 
After talking with some that are on MM, it is indeed very ultra high potency. The THC levels are insanely high and it is what the recreational pot smokers refer to as a kind bud or Kush.
http://www.medicalma...ag/very-potent/
Most wouldn't be able to fill out the application, let alone fire a gun accurately.

As has been said, there are many forms of MM, including those that focus directly on relieving whatever health issue that exists while providing ZERO of the "stonedoutofyourmind" effects.

 

 

I don't have exact figures so this just an estimate.

More then 80% of people on MM are stoned to the bejesus.

Including my ex for back pain.

I was PMed from someone who said you get the CBD hemp oil at health food stores 

and it's useless. If you are on MM you are probably twisted wasted.

Apples and Oranges. MM is Kush and the THC content is over 30%.

Colorado wanted their law to say no higher then 14% but that didn't pass.

Look at more then one result when you Google something.

 

Beethoven Kush Medical Marijuana - Potency: Very Strong

 

20130429_192234-578x433.jpg



#23 .40carry

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Posted 30 March 2018 - 04:12 PM

Having lived through this with a family member, there are varying types of MM available including tinctures that have varying amounts of CBD and THC depending on the desired effect or symptom one is trying to control. That being said, I have seen individuals with a MM card that are indeed baked and in my own mind I question if they truly need it for medical purposes or if it's a way for them to poses legally.  I will outright admit that I was opposed to its use until I lived through the decision process with my family.  My opinion on it changed when I was facing the cold reality of watching a loved one slowly die in front me and through careful thought and deliberation with the family decided that if it had a chance of providing some relief in the final stages of life why not try it.  With it's use I never saw or perceived the effects highness or any outward symptoms that you would normally associate with marijuana that is used for recreational purposes.  I'd suggest - from my limited perspective - that if it's truly used and necessary to control an illness, it's effects are not likely to be seen as someone being "baked".  However I would also state - again from my limited perspective - that if the situation in life presents itself that you need it for the sake of illness, you are not likely to be in any real physical shape to be concerned with much more than just trying overcome the illness you're fighting.   



#24 Mick G

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Posted 30 March 2018 - 06:11 PM

Having lived through this with a family member, there are varying types of MM available including tinctures that have varying amounts of CBD and THC depending on the desired effect or symptom one is trying to control. That being said, I have seen individuals with a MM card that are indeed baked and in my own mind I question if they truly need it for medical purposes or if it's a way for them to poses legally.  I will outright admit that I was opposed to its use until I lived through the decision process with my family.  My opinion on it changed when I was facing the cold reality of watching a loved one slowly die in front me and through careful thought and deliberation with the family decided that if it had a chance of providing some relief in the final stages of life why not try it.  With it's use I never saw or perceived the effects highness or any outward symptoms that you would normally associate with marijuana that is used for recreational purposes.  I'd suggest - from my limited perspective - that if it's truly used and necessary to control an illness, it's effects are not likely to be seen as someone being "baked".  However I would also state - again from my limited perspective - that if the situation in life presents itself that you need it for the sake of illness, you are not likely to be in any real physical shape to be concerned with much more than just trying overcome the illness you're fighting.   

 

I'm not arguing about the fact that it is has legitimate medical purposes. My friend who is a doctor got a rare form of pancreatic cancer, not the one the kills you quickly. He has doctor friends and is prescribed medical marijuana for the pain associated with his cancer. They keep going in and going after a tumor and then another one pops up on his liver. He's a good friend and is a bit older so lets just say back in the day he possibly recreationally smoked pot. I asked him well how does the medical stuff compare to the old pot? He laughed and said there is no comparison. The medical stuff is unreal in its strength and helps him a lot. It has it's uses for medical purposes.

 

My ex OTOH lives in Colorado and was a pothead here. I wouldn't let her smoke in the house and really that was the least of our problems. When she moved to Colorado she all of a sudden had back problems which she never had here. It enabled her to get a MM card in Colorado but now they just sell the stuff to any adult. It's legal there for recreational use. She will call when she's wasted and most of the time I wont even answer so she will leave these rambling voicemails. I set my account up to limit them to 3 minutes but I will listen to them just for grins. She was definitely abusing the MM program they had but make no mistake about it, MM has a very legitimate use and perhaps I shouldn't have wrote "stoned to the bejesus". That was what my doctor friend said and is a line from Caddyshack.

 

Its not any different then say people who take pain meds. At first they are pretty wasted until they build up a tolerance. I wasn't saying that MM doesn't have legitimate uses but a lot of people are pretty wasted when they are using it. If that helps then from feeling pain or nausea or any other medical problem I have no problems with it. I am not a sadist, I don't want to see anyone suffer. I was just pointing out what I was told and my ex was proof of that, the stuff is very strong.

 

I wasn't being judgmental of people that have a legitimate use for it and if I came across that way, I apologize.



#25 .40carry

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Posted 30 March 2018 - 06:27 PM

 

Having lived through this with a family member, there are varying types of MM available including tinctures that have varying amounts of CBD and THC depending on the desired effect or symptom one is trying to control. That being said, I have seen individuals with a MM card that are indeed baked and in my own mind I question if they truly need it for medical purposes or if it's a way for them to poses legally.  I will outright admit that I was opposed to its use until I lived through the decision process with my family.  My opinion on it changed when I was facing the cold reality of watching a loved one slowly die in front me and through careful thought and deliberation with the family decided that if it had a chance of providing some relief in the final stages of life why not try it.  With it's use I never saw or perceived the effects highness or any outward symptoms that you would normally associate with marijuana that is used for recreational purposes.  I'd suggest - from my limited perspective - that if it's truly used and necessary to control an illness, it's effects are not likely to be seen as someone being "baked".  However I would also state - again from my limited perspective - that if the situation in life presents itself that you need it for the sake of illness, you are not likely to be in any real physical shape to be concerned with much more than just trying overcome the illness you're fighting.   

 

I'm not arguing about the fact that it is has legitimate medical purposes. My friend who is a doctor got a rare form of pancreatic cancer, not the one the kills you quickly. He has doctor friends and is prescribed medical marijuana for the pain associated with his cancer. They keep going in and going after a tumor and then another one pops up on his liver. He's a good friend and is a bit older so lets just say back in the day he possibly recreationally smoked pot. I asked him well how does the medical stuff compare to the old pot? He laughed and said there is no comparison. The medical stuff is unreal in its strength and helps him a lot. It has it's uses for medical purposes.

 

My ex OTOH lives in Colorado and was a pothead here. I wouldn't let her smoke in the house and really that was the least of our problems. When she moved to Colorado she all of a sudden had back problems which she never had here. It enabled her to get a MM card in Colorado but now they just sell the stuff to any adult. It's legal there for recreational use. She will call when she's wasted and most of the time I wont even answer so she will leave these rambling voicemails. I set my account up to limit them to 3 minutes but I will listen to them just for grins. She was definitely abusing the MM program they had but make no mistake about it, MM has a very legitimate use and perhaps I shouldn't have wrote "stoned to the bejesus". That was what my doctor friend said and is a line from Caddyshack.

 

Its not any different then say people who take pain meds. At first they are pretty wasted until they build up a tolerance. I wasn't saying that MM doesn't have legitimate uses but a lot of people are pretty wasted when they are using it. If that helps then from feeling pain or nausea or any other medical problem I have no problems with it. I am not a sadist, I don't want to see anyone suffer. I was just pointing out what I was told and my ex was proof of that, the stuff is very strong.

 

I wasn't being judgmental of people that have a legitimate use for it and if I came across that way, I apologize.

 

Don't apologize on my behalf.  I agree with you wholeheartedly that there is a certain amount of use that folks justify with back pain, or knee pain or whatever pain.  I have some acquaintances in other states that justify their "medical use" of it with those symptoms.  Frankly, they are stoners and I wish they'd just call their use what it is.  I could care less if that's their substance of choice - just don't let it effect my life.  Unfortunately, I feel as if use of that type clouds the true need cases that are legitimate, like your friend or my mother who had brain cancer.  I believe that other methods of relief exist for "the back pain" but MM is a convenient cure that serves another purpose someone would rather not admit to.



#26 Grandpa59

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Posted 01 April 2018 - 07:31 PM

My wife was recently given her mm card due to a serious back injury as a result of a car accident. Several back surgeries including removing her tail bone and implanting an electrical stimulator to mask the pain, the pain remains. She recently went to a dispensery which as someone else here pointed out has many items with different thc levels for different effects. They helped her pick out something that might help her. Although the pain is still there even with moderate use it at least helps her sleep. I believe that with any medicine, the user can use as directed or as needed or abuse it which with anything is bad. Defeats the purpose. I chose to not be a caregiver which would have allowed me to make mm purchases but would limit me to making private sale foid purchases. I shop for that online so I declined the caregiver permit.
If I was a ccl instructor I wouldn't disallow someone from taking the class because of a possible disqualifying condition. That would be up to the person taking the class to look into it further before they spend the money to take the class.




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