Denied By ISP Board of Review - Official Help Topic

[Brad O.]

That is exactly what ISP are banking on, that most here will not be able to afford a lawyer. Don't let them get away with that. use cash advance on credit card, use those checks to get advances on.

My thoughts exactly.

 

And It horkes me off those who have been denied only have 35 days (not including time time it takes to receive the denial letter) to appeal. The letters don't give specifics. How is anyone supposed to mount a defense against "secret" evidence? Sure, you may subpoena the information, but how many days does that eat into those 35? The ISP, on the other hand has 90/120 days to do what probably only takes a few days in a largely automated process (excluding the 30 day LE objection window).

 

Glad I have my CCL in hand and this whole process from trying to get Java to work, setting up a digital ID to dealing with the DMV (so that all my information jived. (they royally screwed things up the last time I renewed. everything on my DL was right but not in their computers) but many have been left behind.

[Dr. Rat]

 

Clearly, we are not in this together. I have better things to do than subject myself to internet caricatures casting aspersion. Good day to you sir, and good luck to the rest of you .

 

Well, for the sake of brevity, I'll just say you're wrong about almost everything you wrote, so take pdpsc's advice and hire an attorney if you're going to pursue this. Good luck.

[GTStang08]

Molly , Todd I sent both you a email with the past conversations we had

[Dfens]

 

Well, for the sake of brevity, I'll just say you're wrong about almost everything you wrote, so take pdpsc's advice and hire an attorney if you're going to pursue this. Good luck.

 

 

 

Naturally you believe so, irrespective of reality.

 

Out of morbid curiosity, is that your professional opinion or your amateur legal analysis?

[Dfens]

 

That is exactly what ISP are banking on, that most here will not be able to afford a lawyer. Don't let them get away with that. use cash advance on credit card, use those checks to get advances on.

My thoughts exactly.

 

And It horkes me off those who have been denied only have 35 days (not including time time it takes to receive the denial letter) to appeal. The letters don't give specifics. How is anyone supposed to mount a defense against "secret" evidence? Sure, you may subpoena the information, but how many days does that eat into those 35?

 

 

In all fairness, I don't believe one has to secure all one's evidence inside that 35 day window. True, one has to decide whether to mount an appeal and file within that 35 day window.

 

It would be virtually impossible to secure a subpoena return within that time frame.

You can't issue a subpoena until you have a case on file in which a subpoena can be issued.

You can't file a case until you draft a complaint.

You can't draft a complaint until you have at least some vague notion of the reason for denial and

You won't know that until you get the letter which will likely be at least two days after it was mailed.

 

[marathonrunner]

I think Molly said the 35 days does not apply to circuit court but stand to be corrected.

[Molly B.]

I think Molly said the 35 days does not apply to circuit court but stand to be corrected.

Now we believe it does. I stand corrected.

[john_horstman]

This topic is for IllinoisCarry members who have received official notification that their CCL application has been officially denied by the ISP Board of Review.

 

Please keep in mind this is new territory. We have never been here before and we are all learning the process as we go. There are a lot of questions we cannot answer yet, but we will find the answers. We ask that you be patient as we find our way through this.

 

First, if you have officially been denied by the Board of Review, please email as much information to me as you can:

 

1. Your complete legal name.

2. Your application number

3. TCN fingerprint number if you submitted prints.

4. A copy of the official notification letter(s).

5. Any personal history you think might have played a part in the denial.

6. Any interactions with law enforcement. This includes conversations, interviews, reports, arrests, convictions.

 

Email to VRowe(at)IllinoisCarry.com

Please add an item to the list in 6: lawsuits. Were you party to a lawsuit against a police officer, police department, States attorney, municipality, or the like? Retaliation against plaintiffs is not unheard of.

 

Also, please add item 7: "The entire record of proceedings of the Concealed Carry Licensing Review Board (CCLRB)." This can be achieved, pro se, by filing an administrative review complaint in your county that demands the CCLRB file an answer consisting of its "entire record of proceedings under review, including such evidence as may have been heard by it and the findings and decisions made by it." (735 ILCS 5/3-108)

Here's a link to Cook County's Pro-Se form, tailor it to your needs. Note item 4.

http://www.cookcountyclerkofcourt.org/?Section=FormsPage&FormsPage=ALL&FORMNAME=CCG+0125&TITLE=&Submit=Submit

 

 

Please see the Illinois State Bar Association article entitled, "A checklist for judicial review of an administrative agency decision" for very helpful information.

http://www.isba.org/sections/adminlaw/newsletter/2010/07/achecklistforjudicialreviewofanadministrativeagencyde

 

Remember, this is not an appeals process. It is administrative review.

[gpsgreek]

 

 

That is exactly what ISP are banking on, that most here will not be able to afford a lawyer. Don't let them get away with that. use cash advance on credit card, use those checks to get advances on.

My thoughts exactly.

 

And It horkes me off those who have been denied only have 35 days (not including time time it takes to receive the denial letter) to appeal. The letters don't give specifics. How is anyone supposed to mount a defense against "secret" evidence? Sure, you may subpoena the information, but how many days does that eat into those 35?

 

 

In all fairness, I don't believe one has to secure all one's evidence inside that 35 day window. True, one has to decide whether to mount an appeal and file within that 35 day window.

 

It would be virtually impossible to secure a subpoena return within that time frame.

You can't issue a subpoena until you have a case on file in which a subpoena can be issued.

You can't file a case until you draft a complaint.

You can't draft a complaint until you have at least some vague notion of the reason for denial and

You won't know that until you get the letter which will likely be at least two days after it was mailed.

 

 

 

 

one slight problem with the last statement.

 

The ISP/Board are not giving you a reason or who objected so your pretty much flying blind...

 

Most of the denials have been a generic "you are denied" letter with no specifics including appeal time limit and process.

 

So you have to file an appeal so that you can gain discovery of a SEALED case (remember the Board of Review is not required to be transparent) so that you can get another date to fight a case that you have no idea about what. Your lawyer cant even prepare until he knows what or who he is fighting.

[mdt]

I was contacted by the NRA investigator. I assume working with Todd & Valinda.

 

She said I need to send letter to ISP noting that I will be appealing...... Anyone have a template for this? Where should it be sent?

[Molly B.]

Hold on. We're working on this. Hope to have something up in the next few days.

[mdt]

Holding.... Thanks much for the quick reply and all that you are doing!

[Dfens]

 

 

In all fairness, I don't believe one has to secure all one's evidence inside that 35 day window. True, one has to decide whether to mount an appeal and file within that 35 day window.

 

It would be virtually impossible to secure a subpoena return within that time frame.

You can't issue a subpoena until you have a case on file in which a subpoena can be issued.

You can't file a case until you draft a complaint.

You can't draft a complaint until you have at least some vague notion of the reason for denial and

You won't know that until you get the letter which will likely be at least two days after it was mailed.

 

 

 

 

one slight problem with the last statement.

 

The ISP/Board are not giving you a reason or who objected so your pretty much flying blind...

 

Most of the denials have been a generic "you are denied" letter with no specifics including appeal time limit and process.

 

So you have to file an appeal so that you can gain discovery of a SEALED case (remember the Board of Review is not required to be transparent) so that you can get another date to fight a case that you have no idea about what. Your lawyer cant even prepare until he knows what or who he is fighting.

 

 

I realize that some letters provide no specific reason, hence the use of the phrase "vague notion." For example, my letter indicates that I was denied due to the filing of an objection and a subsequent finding that I am 'dangerous.' That's a lot more than I knew before receiving the letter but clearly less than I need to know to address the board's determination upon review.

 

As to the time period, the letter (and statute) appear to make clear that any review of a denial by the board is subject to the Administrative Review Law, see 430 ILCS 66/87.

 

The Administrative Review Law provides that:

"Every action to review a final administrative decision shall be commenced by the filing of a complaint and the issuance of summons within 35 days from the date that a copy of the decision sought to be reviewed was served upon the party affected by the decision..." See 730 ILCS 5/3-103.

 

I would suggest that the 35 day period as described above sets forth the time limit for seeking review for board denials. When one can apply again, if ever, remains unclear.

 

Evidently, those denied for other reasons that board review need to appeal to the "Director" as provided for in 430 ILCS 66/87.

[Shadow71]

I emailed my info.

 

I believe that they used a record from over 20 years ago.

Which I thought they could only go back 5 years.

 

I was arrested for a Felony, but it was dismissed and I was convicted of a misdemeanor.

So if they'd asked or checked with the other IL county this would have been found

 

It's on the counties public records search, open to the public on the internet.

8-x

[mdt]

Received my official letter today from the ISP. Apparently LEO has been upheld and I am a threat to myself/others/public safety.

 

Review letter dated 3/19

Denial letter dated 4/4

 

Any updates on circuit court appeal process?

[Hatchet]

Received my official letter today from the ISP. Apparently LEO has been upheld and I am a threat to myself/others/public safety.

 

Review letter dated 3/19

Denial letter dated 4/4

 

Any updates on circuit court appeal process?

There is a thread somewhere (i forgot where it was) that was started by molly about being denied by board review.

[Molly B.]

http://illinoiscarry.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=47833

[Torrence T.]

I just received my official denial letter, dated 04/04/14, stating that I am a danger to the public and/or myself. It is ironic that the State of Illinois granted me a license to help save lives, I am a registered nurse, but I can't get a license to protect my own. On top of that, I am an employee of the very county that filed the objection.

[Pepeskids@2014]

Hello Molly,

I haven't heard anything from Suzanne Comas the NRA Investigator about my denial you know if there working on the denial its been about two weeks or im I just jumping the guns here and I should just wait to see the out come, any updates on circuit court appeal process?

Thanks again Molly,

Jose Meraz

suzannemccomas@gmail.com.

[Ed223]

Should we assume all we can presently do is send something similar to the forms posted in the linked thread and hope for the best?

I also have heard nothing from the NRA going on two weeks now. Oh well, time's running out on my appeal time.

Woohoo, lawyer fees!

[Shadow71]

I would have thought that you should include the county sheriff's office.

Since they are the ones that objected to your CCL and the CCLRB agreed with there objection.

[Molly B.]

Work continues on trying to find a way to stop the 35 day clock and finding out what we need to know for the appeals. If anyone is concerned about running past the deadline to file an appeal, there is nothing wrong with going ahead and filing an appeal at your local circuit court to get the process started.

[Ed223]

I truly hope so, all we have is guessing at the moment. The clock is ticking on those of us who received the letter dated 3-19.

County just stonewalling us, hoping we go away?

[marathonrunner]

I like the way the ISP is bragging how nobody appealed yet. Makes you want to barf right?

[Franko]

I truly hope so, all we have is guessing at the moment. The clock is ticking on those of us who received the letter dated 3-19.

County just stonewalling us, hoping we go away?

Have you contacted your Rep? I hope it gets worked out.

[Dfens]

I just received my official denial letter, dated 04/04/14, stating that I am a danger to the public and/or myself. It is ironic that the State of Illinois granted me a license to help save lives, I am a registered nurse, but I can't get a license to protect my own. On top of that, I am an employee of the very county that filed the objection.

 

 

You are not alone.

 

I shook hands with Attorney General Lisa Madigan last year right before she presented me with an award and we had our photo taken together at a downtown office building with no security screening.

[Dfens]

 

I just received my official denial letter, dated 04/04/14, stating that I am a danger to the public and/or myself. It is ironic that the State of Illinois granted me a license to help save lives, I am a registered nurse, but I can't get a license to protect my own. On top of that, I am an employee of the very county that filed the objection.

 

 

You are not alone.

 

I shook hands with Attorney General Lisa Madigan last year right before she presented me with an award and we had our photo taken together at a downtown office building with no security screening.

 

I also frequently do work for the County where I have filed my administrative review complaint.

 

[cubarican0360]

I just received my official denial letter, dated 04/04/14, stating that I am a danger to the public and/or myself. It is ironic that the State of Illinois granted me a license to help save lives, I am a registered nurse, but I can't get a license to protect my own. On top of that, I am an employee of the very county that filed the objection.

Same here Im a armed security Guard that was given a license to carry fire arm while at work and protect the life and property of others , but i get denied a ccl. I really dont get it.

[jkdkaliman101]

 

Well, for the sake of brevity, I'll just say you're wrong about almost everything you wrote, so take pdpsc's advice and hire an attorney if you're going to pursue this. Good luck.

 

 

Naturally you believe so, irrespective of reality.

 

Out of morbid curiosity, is that your professional opinion or your amateur legal analysis?

advice.... take it with a grain of salt. For me personally, I've been smelling a rat since Jan 2014.... something don't sit well with me and no I'm not the original owner of that sentiment.

[Yme]

LAWYER UP!!!