InterestedBystander Posted May 23, 2019 at 04:55 PM Share Posted May 23, 2019 at 04:55 PM Only 1332 were revoked for moving out of state? full story at link https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-met-illinois-guns-foid-cards-revoked-20190520-story,amp.html More than 34,000 Illinoisans have lost their right to own a gun. Nearly 80% may still be armed. As many as 30,000 guns may still be in the possession of Illinois residents deemed too dangerous to have them, according to a Tribune investigation. In an analysis of data released for the first time, the Tribune found the state has repeatedly failed to ensure that people surrender their weapons and gun permits after their Firearm Owners Identification cards are revoked, resulting in the breakdown of a system put in place to deter gun violence. In all, nearly 27,000 Illinois residents over the past four years have not informed authorities what they did with their guns after state police stripped their licenses, according to the analysis. That means law enforcement has no idea whether 78% of revoked cardholders since 2015 still possess guns. The uncertainty has created a public safety risk that has been compounded for decades by antiquated policies and limited law-enforcement resources. Among those with dismal compliance rates are residents convicted of domestic violence or people who had their cards rescinded because of mental health concerns, the Tribune analysis shows. About 3 out of 4 such revokees failed to tell the state where their weapons are, despite making a combined 5,000 serious inquiries about purchasing guns before the revocation. The broken system was exposed in February, when a disgruntled employee opened fire at the Henry Pratt Co. warehouse in Aurora, killing five co-workers and wounding five officers before dying in a shootout with police. The gunman, a convicted felon named Gary Martin, had his FOID card revoked in 2014 but was never forced to relinquish the Smith & Wesson handgun he used in the shooting. The Tribunes analysis of closely held Illinois State Police data including how often each rescinded cardholder had made a serious inquiry about purchasing a gun shows that the failure by state and local authorities to follow up on the revocations and account for firearms is widespread and happening in every county in Illinois. I will say the depth and breadth of the problem did take me back just a bit, said acting Illinois State Police Director Brendan Kelly, who has made revocation compliance a top priority since taking office earlier this year. The only way we are going to be able to take a bite out of this problem is just laying it all out there: the good, the bad and the ugly. According to the data released under an open records request, more than 34,000 people had their FOID cards revoked between 2015 and 2019 alone. More than half kept their cards despite orders to relinquish them, meaning they could still buy ammunition with the card even though it could not be used to purchase a new weapon from a licensed dealer. Before the Tribune finished its analysis, gun rights advocates predicted it would be a waste of time, insisting most people had their cards revoked simply because they moved out of state. In reality, less than 4% or 1,332 of 34,221 lost their FOIDs for that reason. Among other findings in the Tribunes investigation: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redlin Posted May 23, 2019 at 05:06 PM Share Posted May 23, 2019 at 05:06 PM Only 1332 people revoked for moving out of state. I’d like to know how many were revoked for non-renewal. Most of the people I know that move out of state don’t inform the ISP, they just don’t renew their card Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InterestedBystander Posted May 23, 2019 at 05:12 PM Author Share Posted May 23, 2019 at 05:12 PM How does someone with a revoked FOID rack up 79 FTIP checks? Would have expected that to trigger something somewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patriots & Tyrants Posted May 23, 2019 at 05:24 PM Share Posted May 23, 2019 at 05:24 PM Only 1332 people revoked for moving out of state. I’d like to know how many were revoked for non-renewal. Most of the people I know that move out of state don’t inform the ISP, they just don’t renew their card Hit the nail on the head with that one. Illinois lost something like 300+K people in that time period. You're gonna tell me only .04% had a FOID card? I am guessing the state simply does a terrible job of tracking down who leaves the state and a majority of the non-renewals are either dead people or people who moved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wig Posted May 23, 2019 at 05:34 PM Share Posted May 23, 2019 at 05:34 PM In researching the total FOID count in IL, I found that applications are roughly 2% of the population for years. So you can use that number to apply to the percentage that left easily. In fact, I would argue that the majority of those that left, or at least significantly higher than the 2% overall, were FOID holders and left partially due to the policies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinmcc Posted May 23, 2019 at 05:37 PM Share Posted May 23, 2019 at 05:37 PM Illinois lost something like 300+K people in that time period. You're gonna tell me only .04% had a FOID card? I am guessing the state simply does a terrible job of tracking down who leaves the state and a majority of the non-renewals are either dead people or people who moved.Shh... You are ruining Tribune's exquisite journalistic reputation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spec4 Posted May 23, 2019 at 05:50 PM Share Posted May 23, 2019 at 05:50 PM The Tribune is on its way to being as bad as the Sun Times. I don't know what their screwball columnists (John Kass excepted) will do when Trump is out of office. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikew Posted May 23, 2019 at 06:10 PM Share Posted May 23, 2019 at 06:10 PM How does someone with a revoked FOID rack up 79 FTIP checks? Would have expected that to trigger something somewhere.That's all the calls made while that person had an active FOID. A lot of people have more than one gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InterestedBystander Posted May 23, 2019 at 06:24 PM Author Share Posted May 23, 2019 at 06:24 PM How does someone with a revoked FOID rack up 79 FTIP checks? Would have expected that to trigger something somewhere. That's all the calls made while that person had an active FOID.A lot of people have more than one gun.The way it read it seemed like those were all while revoked but that makes more sense. Why would anyone need more than one gun? /s LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS1 Posted May 23, 2019 at 06:55 PM Share Posted May 23, 2019 at 06:55 PM Only 1332 people revoked for moving out of state. I’d like to know how many were revoked for non-renewal. Most of the people I know that move out of state don’t inform the ISP, they just don’t renew their card Hit the nail on the head with that one. Illinois lost something like 300+K people in that time period. You're gonna tell me only .04% had a FOID card? I am guessing the state simply does a terrible job of tracking down who leaves the state and a majority of the non-renewals are either dead people or people who moved.According to the article 2/3 of the revocations we're for domestic violence or mental health: "Domestic violence-related infractions are the most common reason for a resident’s card to be revoked, followed by mental health concerns and felony convictions. • The state rescinded 10,527 FOID cards for domestic violence-related reasons, including battery convictions and orders of protection. Of those former cardholders, 81% have not accounted for any guns. • The state revoked 10,067 FOID cards for mental health concerns, including voluntary and non-voluntary hospitalizations. The whereabouts of their firearms are unknown in nearly 3 of 4 cases." Would like to get that actual data though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRJ Posted May 23, 2019 at 07:20 PM Share Posted May 23, 2019 at 07:20 PM If ISP is releasing data to the Tribune, they may as well be releasing data to any other media outlet that wants to see. Somebody with a foot in the door with conservative media needs to make some requests using press creds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InterestedBystander Posted May 23, 2019 at 07:30 PM Author Share Posted May 23, 2019 at 07:30 PM If ISP is releasing data to the Tribune, they may as well be releasing data to any other media outlet that wants to see. Somebody with a foot in the door with conservative media needs to make some requests using press creds.Sounds like they used a FOIA request, at least in part but I wonder if they got more than the average guy would have? ..."The Tribune’s analysis of closely held Illinois State Police data"... ..."According to the data released under an open records request, more than 34,000 people had their FOID cards revoked between 2015 and 2019 alone"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2A4Cook Posted May 23, 2019 at 08:09 PM Share Posted May 23, 2019 at 08:09 PM Get rid of the FOID. Nobody else has it, yet Chitcago is America's murder capital! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guzzimike66 Posted May 23, 2019 at 08:44 PM Share Posted May 23, 2019 at 08:44 PM The thing all these people can't seem to grasp is that a FOID holder does not equal a gun owner. No different than having a drivers license doesn't equal owning a car. But that doesn't fit the narrative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSD Posted May 23, 2019 at 08:59 PM Share Posted May 23, 2019 at 08:59 PM My pops had a FOID for years. Never owned a gun that I knew of. Never knew why he had the FOID other than he used to go shooting with his brother and maybe wanted to buy ammo or thought he needed it to shoot with his brother. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gvw3 Posted May 23, 2019 at 09:35 PM Share Posted May 23, 2019 at 09:35 PM Everyone in my family has a FOID. Most of them have never owned a gun. They do on occasion go to the range with my son and I and need the card to get in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colt guy Posted May 23, 2019 at 09:55 PM Share Posted May 23, 2019 at 09:55 PM Sorry but the timing of this is garbage. I dont trust any of their numbers. They can say anything they want to a political end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bird76Mojo Posted May 24, 2019 at 07:37 AM Share Posted May 24, 2019 at 07:37 AM If the recent court ruling (no foid needed for firearm in the home) gets applied state-wide, then people letting their FOID's expire and still keeping their guns at home will make liberal media heads explode!! It's none of their d*mn business!Come to think of it, if a judge determined that the woman didn't need a FOID to possess a firearm in her home, but because of that FOID system she can't buy ammo without the FOID, then how would she ever be able to defend herself without being able to purchase ammo? That seems like good ground to go after the FOID from another angle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikew Posted May 24, 2019 at 12:34 PM Share Posted May 24, 2019 at 12:34 PM Sorry but the timing of this is garbage. I dont trust any of their numbers. They can say anything they want to a political end.I can't believe they would print this when the interest was low. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
junglebob Posted May 24, 2019 at 01:38 PM Share Posted May 24, 2019 at 01:38 PM Only 1332 people revoked for moving out of state. I’d like to know how many were revoked for non-renewal. Most of the people I know that move out of state don’t inform the ISP, they just don’t renew their card Hit the nail on the head with that one. Illinois lost something like 300+K people in that time period. You're gonna tell me only .04% had a FOID card? I am guessing the state simply does a terrible job of tracking down who leaves the state and a majority of the non-renewals are either dead people or people who moved. If someone doesn't renew their FOID card is that a revolked card or is it an expired card. Does the ISP give any figures on how many cards are not renewed? I expect the renewal rate will go down if prints are required and the cost goes up. For years my wife had a FOID card but didn't own a firearm. She had it so there wasn't a problem if I left a firearm in the car with her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InterestedBystander Posted May 24, 2019 at 01:42 PM Author Share Posted May 24, 2019 at 01:42 PM Only 1332 people revoked for moving out of state. I’d like to know how many were revoked for non-renewal. Most of the people I know that move out of state don’t inform the ISP, they just don’t renew their card Hit the nail on the head with that one. Illinois lost something like 300+K people in that time period. You're gonna tell me only .04% had a FOID card? I am guessing the state simply does a terrible job of tracking down who leaves the state and a majority of the non-renewals are either dead people or people who moved. If someone doesn't renew their FOID card is that a revolked card or is it an expired card. Does the ISP give any figures on how many cards are not renewed? I expect the renewal rate will go down if prints are required and the cost goes up. For years my wife had a FOID card but didn't own a firearm. She had it so there wasn't a problem if I left a firearm in the car with her.My expectation is that an expired, non renewed FOID card becomes a revoked card getting you put in new database, a notice for disposition form and a possible visit from LE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Illini2A312 Posted May 24, 2019 at 03:10 PM Share Posted May 24, 2019 at 03:10 PM They even put together an interactive map: https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-viz-revoked-foid-cards-search-illinois-2019-htmlstory.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tricolor Posted May 24, 2019 at 03:21 PM Share Posted May 24, 2019 at 03:21 PM My expectation is that an expired, non renewed FOID card becomes a revoked card getting you put in new database, a notice for disposition form and a possible visit from LE That was my understanding as well. If a card is not renewed, the FOID number associated with that card becomes revoked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Str8Shooter Posted May 24, 2019 at 03:43 PM Share Posted May 24, 2019 at 03:43 PM “Test400K, a group dedicated to eliminating a national testing backlog of an estimated 400,000 rape kits, hosted the forum at Mesirow Financial in Chicago.”https://chicago.suntimes.com/2016/4/19/18337641/state-crime-lab-takes-a-year-to-test-rape-kits-alvarez-saysGiven that the vast majority of men carry concealed the instrument, when weaponized, that may be used in the crime of rape, and may be, therefore, potential rapists from the perspective of the state, a demand that all men might be compelled to submit DNA samples is analogous to requirement that that all firearm owners are potential murderers and must submit personal information to the state (as if one were on probation).Given that the intrusive act of collecting rape kits after an occurrence of rape is tantamount to a second rape; adding impediments to self-protection from the crime of rape that the state is unable to provide is an unconscionable intrusion.Given the demonstrated inability to process rape kits, or to collect the weapons of revoked FOID holders, the assurances that citizen compliance with further intrusive state laws will reduce the number of rapes and murders is highly suspect, as if merely doing something just to be seen as doing something despite the ineffectiveness of what is to be done.Imposing new restrictions on firearm ownership on the vast majority of law abiding firearm owners is as repugnant as imposing DNA sample requirements on all men with functioning sex organs, treating each class as suspects without reasonable cause. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InterestedBystander Posted May 24, 2019 at 06:39 PM Author Share Posted May 24, 2019 at 06:39 PM They even put together an interactive map: https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-viz-revoked-foid-cards-search-illinois-2019-htmlstory.htmlThis is showing on many of the ones I looked up. We had prior posts about no firearms as standard supervision inclusion in non firearms related matters. #2 Prohibited from firearmsGenerally triggered by court order as part of a defendant's court supervision or probation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Illini2A312 Posted May 24, 2019 at 06:53 PM Share Posted May 24, 2019 at 06:53 PM They even put together an interactive map: https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-viz-revoked-foid-cards-search-illinois-2019-htmlstory.htmlThis is showing on many of the ones I looked up. We had prior posts about no firearms as standard supervision inclusion in non firearms related matters.#2 Prohibited from firearmsGenerally triggered by court order as part of a defendant's court supervision or probation.Scary thing is, it can include cases like this: http://illinoiscarry.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=71770 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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