Slappy Posted January 14, 2009 at 09:27 AM Share Posted January 14, 2009 at 09:27 AM The first day the new congress is in and not 2 weeks before Obama is sworn in, they are trying to get the presidential term limits lifted... This is just plain nuts... article Synopsis:H.J.RES.5 Title: Proposing an amendment to the Constitution of the United States to repeal the twenty-second article of amendment, thereby removing the limitation on the number of terms an individual may serve as President. Sponsor: Rep Serrano, Jose E. [NY-16] (introduced 1/6/2009) Cosponsors (None) Latest Major Action: 1/6/2009 Referred to House committee. Status: Referred to the House Committee on the Judiciary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest YASLIFF Posted January 14, 2009 at 02:03 PM Share Posted January 14, 2009 at 02:03 PM I think Clinton is still dreaming. Heck Obama is naming mostly ex-Clinton cabinet members anyways. I think we should be pushing for term limits and these political Monarchy's with retiring and naming a relative to step-in and take over the offices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buzzard Posted January 14, 2009 at 02:30 PM Share Posted January 14, 2009 at 02:30 PM US Representative Jose E. Serrano, Jose E. for New York's 16th District, Democrat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BShawn Posted January 14, 2009 at 03:32 PM Share Posted January 14, 2009 at 03:32 PM Should Nobama even be president in the first place, legally I mean, I know the obvious answer of everyone's opinion, including my own Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slappy Posted January 15, 2009 at 05:11 AM Author Share Posted January 15, 2009 at 05:11 AM Should Nobama even be president in the first place, legally I mean, ??? he was popularly elected. what do you mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buzzard Posted January 15, 2009 at 05:41 AM Share Posted January 15, 2009 at 05:41 AM There are a few of us here that continue to question Obama's eligibility to hold the office of President of the United States. These doubts are rooted in the fact that his own grandmother and also a Kenyan official claim he was born in Kenya and not Hawaii, which would cause him not to be a natural born citizen, which, is required by the U.S. Constitution to hold that office. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slappy Posted January 15, 2009 at 08:32 AM Author Share Posted January 15, 2009 at 08:32 AM There are a few of us here that continue to question Obama's eligibility to hold the office of President of the United States. These doubts are rooted in the fact that his own grandmother and also a Kenyan official claim he was born in Kenya and not Hawaii, which would cause him not to be a natural born citizen, which, is required by the U.S. Constitution to hold that office. This was handled, though, by the Naturalization Act of 1795 which states that any children born to United States Citizens outside of the country are, in fact, considered Citizens of the United States. Thus, if I was born in China to American Citizen Parents, I am a Citizen of the US as soon as I take my first breath... Obama's mother was a US Citizen. If he was born on Mars, he is still a US citizen due to this mother's status. What am I missing here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slappy Posted January 15, 2009 at 08:36 AM Author Share Posted January 15, 2009 at 08:36 AM Section 3 of the Naturalization Act of 1795. Emphasis mine: SEC. 3. And be it further enacted, that the children of persons duly naturalized, dwelling within the United States, and being under the age of twenty-one years at the time of such naturalization, and the children of citizens of the United States born out of the limits and jurisdiction of the United States, shall be considered as citizens of the United States. Provided, that the right of citizenship shall not descend on persons whose fathers have never been resident of the United States. No person heretofore proscribed by any state, or who has been legally convicted of having joined the army of Great Britain during the late war, shall be admitted as foresaid, without the consent of the legislature of the state in which such person was proscribed. Given this, Obama is a natural citizen, simply because he is born to an american parent. I don't like his policies as much as the next guy, but I'm not seeing a legal leg to stand on here... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTIN Posted January 15, 2009 at 03:09 PM Share Posted January 15, 2009 at 03:09 PM Slap,I think the bone of contention here is the difference in citizen and natural born citizen that you would have to be to be president.You've been gone for awhile when all this came about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slappy Posted January 15, 2009 at 03:20 PM Author Share Posted January 15, 2009 at 03:20 PM Slap,I think the bone of contention here is the difference in citizen and natural born citizen that you would have to be to be president.You've been gone for awhile when all this came about. im seeing the distinction but to recall a popularly elected president on it seems unlikely. dont get me wrong, i wouldnt complain if it happened though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirMatthew Posted January 15, 2009 at 04:01 PM Share Posted January 15, 2009 at 04:01 PM Section 3 of the Naturalization Act of 1795. Emphasis mine: SEC. 3. And be it further enacted, that the children of persons duly naturalized, dwelling within the United States, and being under the age of twenty-one years at the time of such naturalization, and the children of citizens of the United States born out of the limits and jurisdiction of the United States, shall be considered as citizens of the United States. Provided, that the right of citizenship shall not descend on persons whose fathers have never been resident of the United States. No person heretofore proscribed by any state, or who has been legally convicted of having joined the army of Great Britain during the late war, shall be admitted as foresaid, without the consent of the legislature of the state in which such person was proscribed. Given this, Obama is a natural citizen, simply because he is born to an american parent. I don't like his policies as much as the next guy, but I'm not seeing a legal leg to stand on here... More legal documents can be found at the link noted below, but here is a summary of what has happened. The law at the time Obama was born said he would be a U.S. citizen if he was born outside U.S. borders AND BOTH of his parents were also U.S. citizens. The word "citizens" (plural, from your post, noted in red above) suggests Obama would have to have TWO parents having U.S. citizenship. Since his father was from Kenya, under UK authority at the time, Obama didn't meet this requirement. Having only one U.S. citizen parent, Obama would have also been a U.S. citizen providing his mother had lived in the U.S. for (a certain amount of time, I think ten years) OF WHICH five of those years had to be after the age of 14. Since she was only 18 at the time she gave birth she couldn't have met the five-year requirement either. By default it appears Obama was a UK citizen at the time of his birth in Kenya (due to laws in effect at that time), made more complicated by the fact his mother immediately registered his birth in Hawaii when she returned there with newborn infant in hand. Hawaii law at that time allowed registrations of foreign births, but that doesn't necessarily mean Obama was actually born in that state. She registered his birth only and that legal document (a fresh copy, printed in 2007 I believe) is the one Obama and everyone has posted on various websites as "proof" of his U.S. citizenship. It is NOT the same as a certificate of live birth which is completed when the newborn has just been delivered in a hospital. Indeed, it appears Obama is NOT a natural-born citizen. Interestingly, the term "natural-born" has never really been defined. I am no lawyer, but I presume this term has little to do with method of delivery. Vaginal delivery (natural) or delivery by C-Section (not natural) would not come into play here in such a way as to determine citizenship. The term has to do with being born within the borders and/or under juridiction of the laws of a specified country (e.g. citizenship). It appears Obama is not a natural-born U.S. citizen given the fact he is trying to seal up the very records which could prove it. To complicate things further, Obama insists he was born in Hawaii rather than Kenya. This is contrary to what his Kenyan grandmother has said in a recorded conversation, for she claims to have been present when Obama was born IN KENYA. If Obama was truly born in Hawaii he shouldn't have any legal documents in any Kenyan government office, yet notice was sent out last Fall stating all official Obama records have been sealed in Kenya. The author of "Obama Nation" was ejected from Kenya last Fall for allegedly snooping into this situation and all of Obama's family were ordered to stop talking to the press. So we have the foundation of a mystery, but it get's better! Even Kenyan Obama's aunt, recently tracked down in Boston (living there illegally), said she couldn't talk about Obama until after the election. Someone obviously got to her before the media did. If Obama was born in Hawaii then producing his REAL birth certicate, the same one he mentions in his book as having in his possession as of 1995, shouldn't be a problem. He won't produce it and only an immediate family member can request it from Hawaii officials, which they won't do either. In fact, the day after he visited his sick grandmother in Hawaii (one week before the election) the governor of Hawaii announced Obama's birth certificate record was officially sealed. Obviously he is hiding something as he could just as easily acquired a REAL certified copy of his birth certificate while there. Adding even more mystery, it seems Obama's step-father was an Indonesian who adopted him and they all lived in that country for a while. One has to be an Indonesian citizen in order to attend public school there, which Obama did as a child. Apparently Obama's UK citizenship ended through a change of law in later years, but we know he travelled from the U.S. to various countries (on vacation) in 1981 with an Indonesian passport. Does that mean he had Indonesian citizenship? Obama's U.S. passport registry was accessed many months ago by three State Department workers who were later fired for inappropriate breach of security. Few details have been released about that incident, but it does tell us he has a U.S. passport. No record can be found that he relinguished Indonesian citizenship, or that he officially became a U.S. citizen. The fact of the matter is, he has probably been claiming to be a U.S. citizen all along using the birth registration document from Hawaii. If he has been defrauding people for years in this way (e.g. drivers' license, marriage certificate, college and scholarship applications, government documents, etc.) then he could be in a serious mess of trouble. The suspicion arises because Obama has spent a lot of money fighting Phil Berg's lawsuit (www.obamacrimes.com) which demands he prove he is eligible to be U.S. President. Obama need only provide a copy of the ORIGINAL birth certificate, yet he won't do it. There is simply too much mystery and secrecy going on with this issue for me (personally) to believe he truly is a U.S. citizen. Many lawsuits have been filed demanding Obama prove his citizenship. However, due to lack of standing, all have been dismissed, including the one which made it before SCOTUS. It seems no one wants to touch this issue with a ten-foot pole, yet no one seems to have enough standing to question Obama's eligibility either. So, as Phil Berg likes to say, the biggest hoax in American history may very well happen on January 20th when a man who is fully aware he doesn't meet Constitutional requirements to be President is sworn in as such under oath to honor and support the U.S. Constitution. If it is later discovered he wasn't and isn't eligible to be President then Democrats and Republicans will argue over whether or not anything Obama did while in office should be deemed null and void. The voters may also file lawsuits claiming Obama knew all along he wasn't eligible to be President and, therefore, defrauded them to get campaign donations to the tune of nearly a billion dollars and millions of instances of mail fraud. The most likely outcome will be a "stay calm" attitude from our leaders who then change the Constitution to relax the requirements concerning future Presidential eligibility. If that happens we could very well one day elect an Iranian Muslim, Mexican Catholic, Russian Atheist, Israeli Jew, Japanese Buddist or Chinese Hindu as our President. It is unlikely foreigners would respect the Constitution as much as a natural-born citizen, so it is hard telling what our way of life might be like under such a Presidency. Regardless of what happens, this situation could soon lead the way for a national or Constitutional crisis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slappy Posted January 15, 2009 at 04:54 PM Author Share Posted January 15, 2009 at 04:54 PM Regardless of what happens, this situation could soon lead the way for a national or Constitutional crisis. thanks for clearing that up... there is obviously more here than what I understood.... namely about the status of his mother at the time of his birth. Although If I and my future pregnant wife are traveling outside the country and she gives birth, my child will be a natural citizen because we are both american, correct? I know Obama's case is different, given his father is Kenyan, but im still curious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirMatthew Posted January 15, 2009 at 05:00 PM Share Posted January 15, 2009 at 05:00 PM Regardless of what happens, this situation could soon lead the way for a national or Constitutional crisis. thanks for clearing that up... there is obviously more here than what I understood.... namely about the status of his mother at the time of his birth. Although If I and my future pregnant wife are traveling outside the country and she gives birth, my child will be a natural citizen because we are both american, correct? I know Obama's case is different, given his father is Kenyan, but im still curious. Yes, assuming you are both U.S. citizens your child would be a U.S. citizen also, even if the delivery happens in another country. John McCain was born a U.S. citizen in this very way despite his delivery taking place in a U.S. military zone in Panama. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slappy Posted January 15, 2009 at 05:09 PM Author Share Posted January 15, 2009 at 05:09 PM Yes, assuming you are both U.S. citizens your child would be a U.S. citizen also, even if the delivery happens in another country. John McCain was born a U.S. citizen in this very way despite his delivery taking place in a U.S. military zone in Panama. just as long as my kids can run for president... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buzzard Posted January 15, 2009 at 05:31 PM Share Posted January 15, 2009 at 05:31 PM Section 3 of the Naturalization Act of 1795. Emphasis mine: SEC. 3. And be it further enacted, that the children of persons duly naturalized, dwelling within the United States, and being under the age of twenty-one years at the time of such naturalization, and the children of citizens of the United States born out of the limits and jurisdiction of the United States, shall be considered as citizens of the United States. Provided, that the right of citizenship shall not descend on persons whose fathers have never been resident of the United States. No person heretofore proscribed by any state, or who has been legally convicted of having joined the army of Great Britain during the late war, shall be admitted as foresaid, without the consent of the legislature of the state in which such person was proscribed. Given this, Obama is a natural citizen, simply because he is born to an american parent. NO. Go back and read it. It says citizen and that's it. He is not a NATURAL BORN citizen!! This is where it gets confusing. There is a difference between a citizen, being born a citizen and a NATURAL BORN citizen. It also involves the citizenship of your parents at the time of birth and also the length of time that they have been citizens. We've debated this at length and it almost started to get nasty around here. I don't care to start it again. I will try to find the threads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slappy Posted January 15, 2009 at 05:34 PM Author Share Posted January 15, 2009 at 05:34 PM NO. Go back and read it. It says citizen and that's it. He is not a NATURAL BORN citizen!! This is where it gets confusing. There is a difference between a citizen, being born a citizen and a NATURAL BORN citizen. It also involves the citizenship of your parents at the time of birth and also the length of time that they have been citizens. We've debated this at length and it almost started to get nasty around here. I don't care to start it again. I will try to find the threads. Yeah, sirmatthew cleared it up for me... no need to go searching! we're all good! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buzzard Posted January 15, 2009 at 05:50 PM Share Posted January 15, 2009 at 05:50 PM You really missed a debate there! Just for you - I will dig some up. Interesting reading! ---------------------------- Birth Certificate Lawsuit - Obama can't be President? Kenyan Ambassador admits Obama born in Kenya!, If this is for real.... CNN and Obama's citizenship Obama's birth certificate sealed by Hawaii governor, Only Obama may now request it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rem870 Posted January 15, 2009 at 07:13 PM Share Posted January 15, 2009 at 07:13 PM Ok so back to the first post here.... Its getting damn scary when people start introducing bills like this. I mean i think, or i hope, the sheeple are smarter than this... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hotpig27 Posted January 15, 2009 at 07:23 PM Share Posted January 15, 2009 at 07:23 PM The first day the new congress is in and not 2 weeks before Obama is sworn in, they are trying to get the presidential term limits lifted... This is just plain nuts... article Synopsis:H.J.RES.5 Title: Proposing an amendment to the Constitution of the United States to repeal the twenty-second article of amendment, thereby removing the limitation on the number of terms an individual may serve as President. Sponsor: Rep Serrano, Jose E. [NY-16] (introduced 1/6/2009) Cosponsors (None) Latest Major Action: 1/6/2009 Referred to House committee. Status: Referred to the House Committee on the Judiciary.Obama was on Nightline last summer talking about his policies in his tenth year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papa Posted January 15, 2009 at 07:40 PM Share Posted January 15, 2009 at 07:40 PM Rem870 ... Don't bet on the people being smart enough to not want this. I have chated with a lady for several years on yahoo. Yesterday I brought up the fact that they were wanting to try to repeal the 22nd A . She told me she thought the pres. elect was the best choice and also that if the 22nd was repealed it wouldn't matter because if someone like Bush was in they would be ousted in no time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hotpig27 Posted January 15, 2009 at 08:10 PM Share Posted January 15, 2009 at 08:10 PM Keep in mind that a poll taken back in October showed how smart people are. Twenty four percent of the people polled that were voting for Obama were doing it just to get Bush out of the office. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slappy Posted January 15, 2009 at 08:27 PM Author Share Posted January 15, 2009 at 08:27 PM Obama was on Nightline last summer talking about his policies in his tenth year. please tell me you have a link!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flagtag Posted January 15, 2009 at 10:08 PM Share Posted January 15, 2009 at 10:08 PM Obama was on Nightline last summer talking about his policies in his tenth year. please tell me you have a link!!! I second that. (Fingers crossed) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hotpig27 Posted January 15, 2009 at 11:14 PM Share Posted January 15, 2009 at 11:14 PM It was on tv. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
45superman Posted January 15, 2009 at 11:29 PM Share Posted January 15, 2009 at 11:29 PM Keep in mind that this isn't a bill, because a Constitutional amendment can't be repealed that way--it takes another amendment to do so, and this is a resolution calling for such an amendment. That seems unlikely enough that normally I wouldn't worry about it--but then again . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slappy Posted January 16, 2009 at 12:16 AM Author Share Posted January 16, 2009 at 12:16 AM You really missed a debate there! Just for you - I will dig some up. Interesting reading! ---------------------------- Birth Certificate Lawsuit - Obama can't be President? Kenyan Ambassador admits Obama born in Kenya!, If this is for real.... CNN and Obama's citizenship Obama's birth certificate sealed by Hawaii governor, Only Obama may now request it. Wow!!! Thanks for the links!!! Interesting reading... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ocellairs Posted January 16, 2009 at 12:40 AM Share Posted January 16, 2009 at 12:40 AM Regardless of what happens, this situation could soon lead the way for a national or Constitutional crisis. thanks for clearing that up... there is obviously more here than what I understood.... namely about the status of his mother at the time of his birth. Although If I and my future pregnant wife are traveling outside the country and she gives birth, my child will be a natural citizen because we are both american, correct? I know Obama's case is different, given his father is Kenyan, but im still curious. My son was born in Landstuhl Germany to "two American parents on a US military installation. He had dual citizenship till the age of 18. He is now a full fledge American citizen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slappy Posted January 16, 2009 at 12:41 AM Author Share Posted January 16, 2009 at 12:41 AM My son was born in Landstuhl Germany to "two American parents on a US military installation. He had dual citizenship till the age of 18. He is now a full fledge American citizen. Can he run for president? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BShawn Posted January 16, 2009 at 11:10 PM Share Posted January 16, 2009 at 11:10 PM Should Nobama even be president in the first place, legally I mean, ??? he was popularly elected. what do you mean?Sorry I missed this one, and didn't get to respond to you in time, but everything there is probably put better than I could have put it to you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BShawn Posted January 16, 2009 at 11:12 PM Share Posted January 16, 2009 at 11:12 PM Obama was on Nightline last summer talking about his policies in his tenth year. :o :o :thumbsup: :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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