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ISP FTIP (NICS) Background Check Process


mjw45

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Here is a short version of my understanding of the Illinois Background Check process for purchasing firearms in Illinois.

Based on my understanding from working at an FFL in Illinois, up to November 2016.

 

First off the background check system in Illinois is broken and frustratingly slow, for over the past year, at least since black friday 2015.

Delays of 3-5 days are common, up to 2 weeks are not unheard of.

Sometimes there is no rhyme or reason to who gets instant approval and who gets delayed.

 

While I have not been working at an FFL since November 2016, I just checked a few weeks ago (Jan 2017) and the delay is reported to be as bad or worse than it was most of 2016).

 

Illinois does not do a direct National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS) run by the FBI check like many(most?) states perform.

 

Illinois does it's own background check, Firearms Transfer Inquiry Program (FTIP), run by the Illinois State Police (ISP), which would include a check with NICS.

If the Federal NICS system is down, then the Illinois FTIP system is down/not being updated.

 

The Illinois FTIP system is web based, all inquiries are entered through a web page and responses are gathered from the same system.

The system is for FFL and employees only.

There are no emails from the ISP that I have seen (as reported in a recent thread on ILCarry).

To check on the status of an inquiry you log in and can search by date or transaction number.

 

Our procedure was to batch check all pending transactions once a day (pick up pile of pending 4473's, log in and check each transaction ID) and also whenever a customer would call to check status.

 

There are still people in springfield that you can talk to if you have issues with a background check, but it is not meant to run all your checks through.

Also not meant to call every time there is a delay. Even when we had delays of a week or more, if we called we were normally told it is just taking time.

 

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Background checks and the state mandated waiting periods are 2 completely separate issues.

You have to wait a minimum of 24 hours for long guns (rifles/shotguns) and 72 hours for other firearms (handguns, receivers).

 

So your state mandated waiting period can be over, but you are still delayed because of a delayed background check.

 

In Illinois you also have to wait for a transaction approval from FTIP for however long it takes.

There is no 72 hours exception like there is in Federal law (Federally if there is no response to a background check within 72 hours the transaction may proceed, this is to keep delaying background checks from being a tool to deny 2nd amendment rights)

 

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FTIP System Responses-

Approved- Transaction approved, may be issued instantly or after a delay.

 

Delayed- Keep waiting until approved/denied

 

Denied- May be instant, may be after a delay. Many times when instant denied it was for something simple and customer was able to get it resolved, although it might take months.

 

Invalid Information- Something wasn't right, try reentering, paying close attention to DOB.

Ask customer for latest FOID (some people carried old and new ones).

If that didn't work tell the customer to call springfield, something is wrong.

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So the system does not email individual approvals back?

 

I quit working for a FFL in 2008 when it was a phone system. The ISP would call this dealer several times a day with approvals and FAX them in at night.

 

So dealers now have to take it upon themselves to check for approvals?

 

Do the numbers still start with A(approval), T(transaction/delayed), D(denied)?

 

The last couple years of the phone system the ISP still called and FAXed, but an automated call in check was added to check status of a delayed transaction and worked great.

 

This is one of the larger dealers around and at least 2 people checked status throughout the day. At the time I left there were 5 land lines on the sales floor and 6 computers with internet access,so there was and probably still is no excuse for them not to be checking on a regular basis.

 

I rarely go there often,but I've heard they've had some issues too. Saw alot of things I liked the other day and will try and get there again next week and pick the mgr's brain a little more specifically.

 

I know it's not a free system,but this dealer's FTIP fee reflects the effort they put in. For them,they can't afford not to do it.

 

Before anyone asks, I won't reveal the dealer. If you can't tell, I'm talking as general as possible because I am not and have never been an official spokesperson for them.

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So the system does not email individual approvals back?

 

I quit working for a FFL in 2008 when it was a phone system. The ISP would call this dealer several times a day with approvals and FAX them in at night.

 

So dealers now have to take it upon themselves to check for approvals?

 

Do the numbers still start with A(approval), T(delayed), D(denied)?

 

The last couple years of the phone system the ISP still called and FAXed, but an automated call in check was added to check status of a delayed transaction and worked great.

 

This is one of the larger dealers around and at least 2 people checked status throughout the day. At the time I left there were 5 land lines on the sales floor and 6 computers with internet access,so there was and probably still is no excuse for them not to be checking on a regular basis.

 

I rarely go there often,but I've heard they've had some issues too. Saw alot of things I liked the other day and will try and get there again next week and pick the mgr's brain a little more specifically.

 

I know it's not a free system,but this dealer's FTIP fee reflects the effort they put in. For them,they can't afford not to do it.

 

Before anyone asks, I won't reveal the dealer. If you can't tell, I'm talking as general as possible because I am not and have never been an official spokesperson for them.

 

No the numbers do not start with a letter. The dealer is given the transaction ID immediately so they can proceed with the 4473.

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I had to take it upon myself, the customer to hassle isp about the delays. The gun shop, North American Firearms in Lombard, basically said, "Oh well, YOU deal with it". The man that helped me at ISP was friendly and helpful and stated the feds are getting hung up on the name (I have one of the most common Spanish names you can have). Go on, start the name game in 3, 2, 1...

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Maybe it was just the particular dealer that recorded that way.

 

You're right, it's a transaction number to continue the sales process.

 

At least there is some back and forth communication with the system.

 

The transaction number is the one that is assigned by the NICS system. It is given no matter the response and stays the same the entire time.

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I had to take it upon myself, the customer to hassle isp about the delays. The gun shop, North American Firearms in Lombard, basically said, "Oh well, YOU deal with it". The man that helped me at ISP was friendly and helpful and stated the feds are getting hung up on the name (I have one of the most common Spanish names you can have). Go on, start the name game in 3, 2, 1...

 

Honestly there isn't much the dealer can do. Anytime I call them up to try and check on delays, all they will tell me is to wait and there is nothing they can do. They become quite rude with me and inform me, that they are understaffed and backed up. I have never told a customer they would have to take care of it or YOU deal with it, and I still always try and call in, but typically get no where.

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I had to take it upon myself, the customer to hassle isp about the delays. The gun shop, North American Firearms in Lombard, basically said, "Oh well, YOU deal with it". The man that helped me at ISP was friendly and helpful and stated the feds are getting hung up on the name (I have one of the most common Spanish names you can have). Go on, start the name game in 3, 2, 1...

 

Honestly there isn't much the dealer can do. Anytime I call them up to try and check on delays, all they will tell me is to wait and there is nothing they can do. They become quite rude with me and inform me, that they are understaffed and backed up. I have never told a customer they would have to take care of it or YOU deal with it, and I still always try and call in, but typically get no where.

 

Yeah, I better just get used being a bit delayed on future purchases. Who knew I'd get so cozy with isp? I'm just miffed my dealer , who I've dealt with on numerous occasions, plays "gone fishing'" when I have questions/concerns.

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I had to take it upon myself, the customer to hassle isp about the delays. The gun shop, North American Firearms in Lombard, basically said, "Oh well, YOU deal with it". The man that helped me at ISP was friendly and helpful and stated the feds are getting hung up on the name (I have one of the most common Spanish names you can have). Go on, start the name game in 3, 2, 1...

 

Honestly there isn't much the dealer can do. Anytime I call them up to try and check on delays, all they will tell me is to wait and there is nothing they can do. They become quite rude with me and inform me, that they are understaffed and backed up. I have never told a customer they would have to take care of it or YOU deal with it, and I still always try and call in, but typically get no where.

 

Yeah, I better just get used being a bit delayed on future purchases. Who knew I'd get so cozy with isp? I'm just miffed my dealer , who I've dealt with on numerous occasions, plays "gone fishing'" when I have questions/concerns.

 

 

I can't blame you for becoming miffed. A good dealer should be there for their customers at all times.

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Great information even for those who haven't had any delays in the system.

Might have been better, just mho, if you had kept it in the same thread we already had started here:

http://illinoiscarry.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=64647

 

More eyes on it without moving back n forth......just saying!

 

It also seems these slight delays in the system pop up from time to time and then go away and fall inline with the 3 day window.

I am surprised at the other thread stating that the customer had to do the leg work to get the approval when it didn't come in during the 3 day window! Isn't this the process for which they charge a fee to run? If so, it would seem that a service which was paid for isn't being supplied! When you pay for a service it should be supplied.

 

I haven't been placed into this situation before so I'm not one who researches the ins and outs of what the dealers/ffls do and how.

 

Here's to wishing everyone a quick n speedy nics approval in their future. And take it easy on the state employees, all of them aren't coffee drinking, donut munching, over weight, slightly balding misfits! lol

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FFL to ISP FTIP to NICS back to ISP back to FFL.

 

What, if any, extra value/benefit/processing/background check does the FTIP system do? Is it just a FOID check and logging of transaction record data which I would assume NICS does too (excluding FOID info)? Is it all electronic or does a person get involved at the ISP if not immediate? It sounds like delays are at NICS side but I dont hear about this as much on other board discussions outside of IL.

 

iirc, that is/was a $2 fee which the FFL might eat, pass along to customer (typical), or even charge more (for their time and effort).

 

I thought I read the FBI charged for those checks so dont know if IL is making or losing on the FTIP fee.

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FFL to ISP FTIP to NICS back to ISP back to FFL.

 

What, if any, extra value/benefit/processing/background check does the FTIP system do? Is it just a FOID check and logging of transaction record data which I would assume NICS does too (excluding FOID info)? Is it all electronic or does a person get involved at the ISP if not immediate?

 

iirc, that is/was a $2 fee which the FFL might eat, pass along to customer (typical), or even charge more (for their time and effort).

 

I thought I read the FBI charged for those checks so dont know if IL is making or losing on the FTIP fee.

 

It really isn't benefit, but Illinois along with some other states have opted to use their own system as to not going directly through the FBI. Because the FTIP is directly tied into the NICS IL does not pay anything to the Feds for it. So yes, the state makes the $2 on each background check.

 

It is all technically all electronic. Dealers are supposed to just wait until they receive an email stating there has been a status change on FTIP.

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Maybe it was just the particular dealer that recorded that way.

 

You're right, it's a transaction number to continue the sales process.

 

At least there is some back and forth communication with the system.

The numbers were an A number if you got an approval with the call in system but with the web system the number does not change. It is a number only.

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You guys know it isn't just IL having delays. Its in the whole country. Common names seem to be the main reason.

 

I don't think it's common names that is causing the delay. There's only five other people in the US with my last name, and in early January, I was delayed five days. Today, I'm supposed to pickup a new rifle from my FFL that was delivered this morning. He entered the background check last Friday when I made the purchase, and so far, he hasn't called me back to confirm pickup. I wonder if this one is being delayed.

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  • 2 weeks later...

A delay is typically the result of a Soundex match. Soundex is a phonetic algorithm for indexing names by sound, as pronounced in English. For example, if your name is John Smith, you will typically get a match for Jon Smith, John Smyth, Jon Smythe, John Smit, Jon Zmit, Jan Smitty, etc. Pretty much anything that is close. When the ISP runs your name (btw, all they run are first name, last name, dob, and FOID#) if there is a person with an outstanding warrant that matches your name in the Soundex database, you will get delayed. I found this out several years ago when a customer of mine who is a Police Officer got delayed. He was in disbelief and contacted the state and that was the explanation given.

 

A delay can also occur if the FBI database is down as Illinois connects to the Feds. That has been happening more frequently lately. For instance, I have a customer who was delayed because I couldn't get a NICS# late last week. Since then I have other customers who have been approved but he is still waiting for a NICS confirmation.

 

I have heard, but cannot confirm, that if you have had a prior arrest, you will always be delayed.

 

While not a scientific sample (but to give you a rough idea) I have over 1000 customers and I would estimate that about a third get delayed. It also seems like they have loosened the algorithm since the election as I have been getting many more delays than I used to.

 

Also, while the state emails a notice when there has been a change to a delay, at times hours or even a day can go by between the approval being issued and receiving the email notification.

 

I cannot speak for all FFLs but as for myself I want you to get your firearm as quickly as possible. I do not want to run a storage business and I do not ask for the fee until you receive the approval. So a delay is inconvenient for both of us: you have to make a second trip and you don't get your purchase; I have to store the firearm(s) and don't get paid.

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  • 7 months later...

This is just crazy and a tremendous pain for you. Cost too. Too bad this will never be addressed by our financially challenged (crooked) state. But if the right contract goes to the right people they will all work it out. And it will still be broken.

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There are two other people in IL who have my exact same name and middle initial One of them is not the most honest person and has had his name published in the local paper under police reports.

Kind of embarrassing for me. That said, I've never been delayed but then my purchases have been handguns with a 3 day delay anyway.

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We just need somebody to introduce a bill to abandon FOID because it is NOT being used, and is, in fact, being IGNORED in performing background checks. After all, FOID was, and is, developed as a method to identify those allowed to own firearms in Illinois.

Multiple bills get introduced to repeal FOID, but they are not allowed to move forward...they dont usually even get to committee where they could be voted down.

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We just need somebody to introduce a bill to abandon FOID because it is NOT being used, and is, in fact, being IGNORED in performing background checks. After all, FOID was, and is, developed as a method to identify those allowed to own firearms in Illinois.

Multiple bills get introduced to repeal FOID, but they are not allowed to move forward...they dont usually even get to committee where they could be voted down.

 

Even beyond that, they build on the FOID Act in ways that reinforces it. Last session's gun trafficking bill carved out an exception for Illinois residents with a FOID card rather than Illinois residents who are not otherwise disqualified. And our universal background check doesn't look directly at background, it looks at the validity of the piece of plastic.

 

It's silly, really. By putting that layer between the data and the purchase they risk missing a disqualified person, but it gives them comfort to think only people who got their OK will have a gun.

 

The switchblade bill is another example.

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We just need somebody to introduce a bill to abandon FOID because it is NOT being used, and is, in fact, being IGNORED in performing background checks. After all, FOID was, and is, developed as a method to identify those allowed to own firearms in Illinois.

I've never been much of an optimist, but I'm extremely hopeful that Trump is going to encourage (or force) a re-evaluation of gun laws across the nation. We've drifted so far from where we should be, and we've gotten to the point where the 2nd Amendment seems to be open to discussion/interpretation. It's not.

 

I know it's a touchy subject, and I'm not going to turn this into a political discussion, but I trust and support my president. I truly believe he has America's best interests at heart, and I believe he will do everything in his power to keep us from becoming disarmed subjects. You know, like the globalists have done to Europe, and we all see how that's going for them.

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  • 4 months later...

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