29 replies to this topic

[moneepd100]

Would a student taking the concealed carry course  who has served or is serving in the reserves of the U.S. Armed Forces be exempt from 8 hours of the mandatory training?  Not sure if section 75 of ILCS 430 clarifies it.

 

 

ILCS 430, Sec. 75

 (i) The Department and certified firearms instructors shall recognize 8 hours of training as completed toward the 16 hour training requirement under this Section, if the applicant is an active, retired, or honorably discharged member of the United States Armed Forces. Any remaining hours that the applicant completes must at least cover the classroom subject matter of paragraph (4) of subsection ( of this section, and the range qualification in subsection © of this Section.

[InterestedBystander]

prior training credit

http://www.ilga.gov/...31ZZ9996BR.html

[Bubbacs]

Has he been called up?
Is he on active duty now?

Cause if not, then no prior credit.

Active duty calls for full time service.
Unless called up and on duty now!

[ragsbo]

I would say they should get the 8 hour credit. They do go through boot camp so that is where they receive weapon training. BUT I don't know and would like to know if they do or if they don't and why

[Bubbacs]

Easy google search
I did this before posting
I kind of knew so I thought
But the boot camp and two weeks a year do not avail active duty status

If called up and serving 90 plus days straight in active duty status would make it though
Reserves do not get a DD214 as it states also
They can retire but they do not get a military retirement

Sounds complicated but........

The student should know if he is active duty or not!
Just saying

[kyle50cal]

Guard and Reserves do get DD214's for service (not just combat) over 90 consecutive days. Anything less is a DD220 or nothing. I do not think a DD220 is acceptable for prior training credit.I have only accepted Dd214's with honorable discharge.

[Bubbacs]

Yes I think I said 90 days called up active duty
As for the DD214, it will state the same.

But I’m not going to say I’m totally correct
But here’s a link and even tho it’s Reddit, there are others.

Please, google already knows everything about you, so use it! lol

[kyle50cal]

Yes I think I said 90 days called up active duty
As for the DD214, it will state the same.
But I’m not going to say I’m totally correct
But here’s a link and even tho it’s Reddit, there are others.
Please, google already knows everything about you, so use it! lol

You are correct however, The main thing I wanted to point out is that the difference between active, guard, and reserve have been blurred since 2001 and it's common to see younger kids with dd214's due to basic and job schooling being longer or the same kids in the guard or reserve being combat vets at an early age. I think Reddit is a good tool but it would be the last reference I use to prove facts. Bottom line, a DD214 with honorable discharge is the key and we both agree to that. Further more, I hope the OP got what they were looking for

[Gator4838]

I served in the active military for 3 years.I reserved my conceal class seat a couple months ahead of time.a couple days prior I learned of the 8 hr exemption.I called the instructor to inquire,and he was resistant to give me credit.I already set aside the weekend,and my service was a long time ago,so I did not argue with him.in the end,I'm glad I attended both days.I believe I benefited from having completed the entire course.just saying.

[domin8]

It doesn't take much for a reservist to obtain their 90 days. For example Marine Corps reservists go to the same exact training as active duty Marines. Bootcamp of 13 weeks is more than enough to get the 90 days. That doesn't account for the SOI or MCT that follows. I believe SOI would be the shortest way to go for the least amount of training. SOI is 38 training days. MCT is shorter, but Marines going through MCT have additional training for their specific jobs after MCT concludes. Do not assume bootcamp provides firearms training. It doesn't in all cases. You would need to look at the DD214 long form to determine if the service member/veteran has firearms training. For example, Navy ODS does not provide firearms training. My wife went to ODS. She's been in for 10 years, is an O-4, and still has 0 firearms training through the military. There are many officers that have 0 firearms training. My advice is that you make sure you look at the long form and not the short form. Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

[Bubbacs]

If you read the military sites the boot camp will not give active duty credit or status.
But again its out there for all.

Yes, boot camp is more or at 90 days and then there is tech school.
But my reading is IF its for reserves, it doesnt add for active duty and someone who signed up for several years active duty.

Again, its not that Im against the reserves.
It just the original question is answered with a NO.
But then Im sure with it being IC and the way we debate all things law, someone will soon point out that it states that the instructor is responsible for making sure of the prior training be legit. So just fudge the cert right? No.


b ) It is the responsibility of the Instructor to verify successful completion of prior training and apply credit as listed. Once this credit is combined with additional training hours provided by the Instructor, the Instructor will certify that the 16 hour training requirement was met.

Edited by Bubbacs, 27 August 2019 - 10:36 PM.

[domin8]

If you read the military sites the boot camp will not give active duty credit or status. But again its out there for all. Yes, boot camp is more or at 90 days and then there is tech school. But my reading is IF its for reserves, it doesnt add for active duty and someone who signed up for several years active duty. Again, its not that Im against the reserves. It just the original question is answered with a NO. But then Im sure with it being IC and the way we debate all things law, someone will soon point out that it states that the instructor is responsible for making sure of the prior training be legit. So just fudge the cert right? No. b ) It is the responsibility of the Instructor to verify successful completion of prior training and apply credit as listed. Once this credit is combined with additional training hours provided by the Instructor, the Instructor will certify that the 16 hour training requirement was met.

Would you like to see a DD214 just for completing bootcamp? I can provide a copy. This is why I said people need to look at the long form DD214. Often times people provide the short form when a DD214 is requested. Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

[domin8]

Btw, anybody come across a DD215 yet? Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

[Quiet Observer]

Btw, anybody come across a DD215 yet? Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

 

“The paperwork needed to correct a Certificate of Release of Discharge from Active Duty from the United States military is called a DD 215, and it can be obtained by submitting a request letter to the commander of the U.S. Army Human Resources Command. This request must include the reason a change is necessary”.

https://www.referenc...c067bb0a9758ef6

[Bubbacs]

If you read the military sites the boot camp will not give active duty credit or status.
But again its out there for all.
Yes, boot camp is more or at 90 days and then there is tech school.
But my reading is IF its for reserves, it doesnt add for active duty and someone who signed up for several years active duty.
Again, its not that Im against the reserves.
It just the original question is answered with a NO.
But then Im sure with it being IC and the way we debate all things law, someone will soon point out that it states that the instructor is responsible for making sure of the prior training be legit. So just fudge the cert right? No.
b ) It is the responsibility of the Instructor to verify successful completion of prior training and apply credit as listed. Once this credit is combined with additional training hours provided by the Instructor, the Instructor will certify that the 16 hour training requirement was met.

Would you like to see a DD214 just for completing bootcamp? I can provide a copy. This is why I said people need to look at the long form DD214. Often times people provide the short form when a DD214 is requested.

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Nope but thanks anyway.
We’ve now gotten off the topic and into the Show Me State........
I’ve got a DD214
Long and short.......

If the student shows he is active duty right now, or has a DD214 then he is good to go.
Would like to hear from the original OP and see what his possible student says and provided.
I’ll be the first to salute the young man and be over joyed for his saving 8 hours of training.


Peace

[domin8]

If you read the military sites the boot camp will not give active duty credit or status.
But again its out there for all.
Yes, boot camp is more or at 90 days and then there is tech school.
But my reading is IF its for reserves, it doesnt add for active duty and someone who signed up for several years active duty.
Again, its not that Im against the reserves.
It just the original question is answered with a NO.
But then Im sure with it being IC and the way we debate all things law, someone will soon point out that it states that the instructor is responsible for making sure of the prior training be legit. So just fudge the cert right? No.
b ) It is the responsibility of the Instructor to verify successful completion of prior training and apply credit as listed. Once this credit is combined with additional training hours provided by the Instructor, the Instructor will certify that the 16 hour training requirement was met.

Would you like to see a DD214 just for completing bootcamp? I can provide a copy. This is why I said people need to look at the long form DD214. Often times people provide the short form when a DD214 is requested.
Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

Nope but thanks anyway.
We’ve now gotten off the topic and into the Show Me State........
I’ve got a DD214
Long and short.......
If the student shows he is active duty right now, or has a DD214 then he is good to go.
Would like to hear from the original OP and see what his possible student says and provided.
I’ll be the first to salute the young man and be over joyed for his saving 8 hours of training.
Peace

I have my DD214 blanket too. I suspect the reason you don't want to see a DD214 just for completing bootcamp is because you know they exist and would nullify your point. This is still on point because a DD214 from bootcamp would show the type of training and equipment the service member was trained to use, including firearms. This, herein lies the problem. A DD214 is issued to service members upon completion of training who go into the reserves because it is a release from active duty status.

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[kyle50cal]

It is irrelevant that a DD214 is issued for completion of boot camp or fighting in Normandy for the purposes of training credit. It's also irrelevant what type of equipment a person trained on while in service.

[Bubbacs]

Domin8

I can be wrong, just like others, I have my view and they have theirs.
Not sure what a DD214 blanket is, unless something I said was read wrongly?
I don’t have blankets, it’s just papers! Just confused about that part.
Sorry if I’ve over stepped my bounds with pride in serving and the paper work received.
I’m sure everyone here is filled with pride too, don’t read too much into that!

And Kyle50cal
If the DD214 is irrelevant as stated, then why is it in the statutes as a requirement of 1 of the prior credits?

[domin8]

This is a DD214 blanket: https://www.aafnatio...ant=31613549194 I'm also a veteran. Btw, I don't really have a DD214 blanket. That was sarcasm. Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

[domin8]

Btw, my wife is active duty. Photo courtesy of some email I received earlier today from an organization I'd never heard of. Apparently companies go and take pictures of service members while they are deployed as if they're kids in elementary school. Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

[Bubbacs]

This is a DD214 blanket: https://www.aafnatio...ant=31613549194

I'm also a veteran.

Btw, I don't really have a DD214 blanket. That was sarcasm.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

Oh snap
I missed the sarcasm again!

Thank YOU and Thank your wife for me 2!

ha ha ha......blanket
I do want one of those..... lol

Edited by Bubbacs, 28 August 2019 - 09:28 PM.

[moneepd100]

We had a customer conact us to see if he would receive 8 hours credit for reserve duty. So my original post was to help us establish the proper company policy for concealed carry classes.  We have accepted DD214's and drivers licenses marked "veteran" for 8 hours prior training.  

[cybermgk]

If you read the military sites the boot camp will not give active duty credit or status.
But again its out there for all.

Yes, boot camp is more or at 90 days and then there is tech school.
But my reading is IF its for reserves, it doesnt add for active duty and someone who signed up for several years active duty.

Again, its not that Im against the reserves.
It just the original question is answered with a NO.
But then Im sure with it being IC and the way we debate all things law, someone will soon point out that it states that the instructor is responsible for making sure of the prior training be legit. So just fudge the cert right? No.


b ) It is the responsibility of the Instructor to verify successful completion of prior training and apply credit as listed. Once this credit is combined with additional training hours provided by the Instructor, the Instructor will certify that the 16 hour training requirement was met.

I was an Army Reservist before going Active Duty (and then active Reserves) Air Force.  My DD 214 shows active duty days served for both my actual active duty, as well as some (albeit it's a small amount) for my active reserve time.  

 

But neither here nor there.

 

THe INTENT of the portion, is to exempt those who have had basic firearms training and safety training from the Military.  Any Army Reservist who has been through boot camp, I can guarentee has.  Any Air Force Reservist, IF they went through Boot camp back when I did, did as well.  LOL, I went through AF boot AFTER being an Army Reservist and ROTC Cadet in College.  They had me go through an abridged AF boot, just taking AF specific classes etc.  HOWEVER, even though I had qualified Expert on rifle and Grenade in boot, and yearly 2 week Reserve session, AF still made me take their firearms training, which was definately basic, and NOWHERE what was done in Army basic back in the 80s. 

[tdiller]

 

If you read the military sites the boot camp will not give active duty credit or status. But again its out there for all. Yes, boot camp is more or at 90 days and then there is tech school. But my reading is IF its for reserves, it doesnt add for active duty and someone who signed up for several years active duty. Again, its not that Im against the reserves. It just the original question is answered with a NO. But then Im sure with it being IC and the way we debate all things law, someone will soon point out that it states that the instructor is responsible for making sure of the prior training be legit. So just fudge the cert right? No. b ) It is the responsibility of the Instructor to verify successful completion of prior training and apply credit as listed. Once this credit is combined with additional training hours provided by the Instructor, the Instructor will certify that the 16 hour training requirement was met.

Would you like to see a DD214 just for completing bootcamp? I can provide a copy. This is why I said people need to look at the long form DD214. Often times people provide the short form when a DD214 is requested. Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

 

My father in  law (WWII) barley made it out of boot camp before being kicked out of the Army for medical reasons. Not sure how long  after boot but he has a DD214 and is buried at the Lincoln National cemetery.

[moneepd100]

cybermgk, I agree with your reasoning. After all, students taking an NRA course get prior training credit why shouldn't someone with military training get the same consideration.  

FYI, a co-worker who served in the Illinois National Guard does not have a DD214, he has an NGB Form 22. He used this to get a "veteran" marked drivers license and secured a VA loan using this document.

[TriumphRider]

If the individual has qualified in a military weapons course, then YES.

 

BUT they need to have the documentation they qualified/attended.

[domin8]

 
If you read the military sites the boot camp will not give active duty credit or status. But again its out there for all. Yes, boot camp is more or at 90 days and then there is tech school. But my reading is IF its for reserves, it doesnt add for active duty and someone who signed up for several years active duty. Again, its not that Im against the reserves. It just the original question is answered with a NO. But then Im sure with it being IC and the way we debate all things law, someone will soon point out that it states that the instructor is responsible for making sure of the prior training be legit. So just fudge the cert right? No. b ) It is the responsibility of the Instructor to verify successful completion of prior training and apply credit as listed. Once this credit is combined with additional training hours provided by the Instructor, the Instructor will certify that the 16 hour training requirement was met.
Would you like to see a DD214 just for completing bootcamp? I can provide a copy. This is why I said people need to look at the long form DD214. Often times people provide the short form when a DD214 is requested. Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk
 


My father in  law (WWII) barley made it out of boot camp before being kicked out of the Army for medical reasons. Not sure how long  after boot but he has a DD214 and is buried at the Lincoln National cemetery.

Even today there are a lot of people who get through MEPS only to find out in bootcamp they are medically dq. They still get a dd214.

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[DomG]

If you read the military sites the boot camp will not give active duty credit or status. But again its out there for all. Yes, boot camp is more or at 90 days and then there is tech school. But my reading is IF its for reserves, it doesnt add for active duty and someone who signed up for several years active duty. Again, its not that Im against the reserves. It just the original question is answered with a NO. But then Im sure with it being IC and the way we debate all things law, someone will soon point out that it states that the instructor is responsible for making sure of the prior training be legit. So just fudge the cert right? No. b ) It is the responsibility of the Instructor to verify successful completion of prior training and apply credit as listed. Once this credit is combined with additional training hours provided by the Instructor, the Instructor will certify that the 16 hour training requirement was met.
Would you like to see a DD214 just for completing bootcamp? I can provide a copy. This is why I said people need to look at the long form DD214. Often times people provide the short form when a DD214 is requested. Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk
 


My father in  law (WWII) barley made it out of boot camp before being kicked out of the Army for medical reasons. Not sure how long  after boot but he has a DD214 and is buried at the Lincoln National cemetery.

Even today there are a lot of people who get through MEPS only to find out in bootcamp they are medically dq. They still get a dd214.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

Not that it has anything to do with this topic. They do, but I believe theyre given an entry level separation which disqualifies them from veteran benefits. I may be wrong. I retired.

Edited by DomG, 31 August 2019 - 08:16 AM.

[domin8]

If you read the military sites the boot camp will not give active duty credit or status. But again its out there for all. Yes, boot camp is more or at 90 days and then there is tech school. But my reading is IF its for reserves, it doesnt add for active duty and someone who signed up for several years active duty. Again, its not that Im against the reserves. It just the original question is answered with a NO. But then Im sure with it being IC and the way we debate all things law, someone will soon point out that it states that the instructor is responsible for making sure of the prior training be legit. So just fudge the cert right? No. b ) It is the responsibility of the Instructor to verify successful completion of prior training and apply credit as listed. Once this credit is combined with additional training hours provided by the Instructor, the Instructor will certify that the 16 hour training requirement was met.
Would you like to see a DD214 just for completing bootcamp? I can provide a copy. This is why I said people need to look at the long form DD214. Often times people provide the short form when a DD214 is requested. Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk
 
My father in  law (WWII) barley made it out of boot camp before being kicked out of the Army for medical reasons. Not sure how long  after boot but he has a DD214 and is buried at the Lincoln National cemetery.Even today there are a lot of people who get through MEPS only to find out in bootcamp they are medically dq. They still get a dd214.
Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk
Not that it has anything to do with this topic. They do, but I believe theyre given an entry level separation which disqualifies them from veteran benefits. I may be wrong. I retired.

I'll have to ask my wife. She dealt with this when she was at Great Lakes. 18 months at Red Rover meant she had to tell people who really wanted to serve their country that something was discovered in the bloodwork that is an auto DQ. She'd know more than I do about this aspect. Unfortunately, she's in Curaçao right now on liberty. Cell service isn't the greatest. An email response will be slow since she's not on the ship.

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[Helpdesk9]

If you read the military sites the boot camp will not give active duty credit or status. But again its out there for all. Yes, boot camp is more or at 90 days and then there is tech school. But my reading is IF its for reserves, it doesnt add for active duty and someone who signed up for several years active duty. Again, its not that Im against the reserves. It just the original question is answered with a NO. But then Im sure with it being IC and the way we debate all things law, someone will soon point out that it states that the instructor is responsible for making sure of the prior training be legit. So just fudge the cert right? No. b ) It is the responsibility of the Instructor to verify successful completion of prior training and apply credit as listed. Once this credit is combined with additional training hours provided by the Instructor, the Instructor will certify that the 16 hour training requirement was met.
Would you like to see a DD214 just for completing bootcamp? I can provide a copy. This is why I said people need to look at the long form DD214. Often times people provide the short form when a DD214 is requested. Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk
 
My father in  law (WWII) barley made it out of boot camp before being kicked out of the Army for medical reasons. Not sure how long  after boot but he has a DD214 and is buried at the Lincoln National cemetery.Even today there are a lot of people who get through MEPS only to find out in bootcamp they are medically dq. They still get a dd214.
Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk
Not that it has anything to do with this topic. They do, but I believe theyre given an entry level separation which disqualifies them from veteran benefits. I may be wrong. I retired.

Like most things, it depends..

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