skinnyb82 Posted August 9, 2017 at 04:14 PM Share Posted August 9, 2017 at 04:14 PM I think the relevant question is...have ANY OTHER pistols had accidental discharges like this? Yes. For all we know, an M&P will discharge if you smack the slide with a dead blow hammer, hit it with your car, whatever. Same for a Glock. They're only doing this to trash Sig's reputation, or the whole "look at meeeee, I have to get in on the action" mentality. I own a pair of legacy P229s and...good luck getting one of those to accidentally discharge, even in SA mode (stories of hammers getting caught up on door jambs and not discharging, drops with no discharge, not one documented incident of an accidental discharge). When in DA mode, hammer decocked, it will not discharge unless the trigger is pulled. Period. Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drumgod Posted August 9, 2017 at 06:34 PM Share Posted August 9, 2017 at 06:34 PM IDK. Just because a guy on youtube throws his p320 in a wood chipper and it goes off it doesn't mean there isn't a problem with the gun's design. It just means the youtube guy is a doofus. Fact is, someone dropped their p320 and it discharged injuring them. That is virtually unheard of with modern pistols and a real problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinnyb82 Posted August 9, 2017 at 07:55 PM Share Posted August 9, 2017 at 07:55 PM I'm not discounting that it's a problem. I'm only stating that smacking it with a hammer to cause a discharge is just...what are you trying to prove by brutalizing a pistol? I'd also like to know which revision of the pistol they used. They've messed with the design since launch and mine is different from the current version. Different trigger, takedown lever, slide lock, some of the springs are different. I'm sure they revised more parts besides those, I just don't keep up on that info. I can say that the defect was discovered simply due to how the weight is distributed. The pistol will drop at that angle because of it being heavy in the rear. The defect would not have been discovered had the design been different, different distribution of weight. It's been a while since I've handled a Glock (sold two of mine a few years ago) and I seem to recall that Glocks have a more uniform weight distribution. Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helpdesk9 Posted August 9, 2017 at 08:11 PM Share Posted August 9, 2017 at 08:11 PM 3) He hammers the point of the army not knowing how the p320 will function in cold weather and altitude while just glancing over the fact that the glock also has these questions unanswered. Please tell me you're joking. Glocks are used by like half the planet.Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drumgod Posted August 9, 2017 at 08:54 PM Share Posted August 9, 2017 at 08:54 PM yup. The youtube guys are mostly just Average Joes being all average. Their over-the-top antics don't have any real bearing on the issue. I don't know much about the p320 but I've run thousands of rounds through glocks. Glocks have the infamous "trigger dingus" specifically to keep inertia from moving the trigger enough to deactivate the striker safety when the pistol is jarred hard enough to disengage the sear. If I'm understanding correctly this is exactly what's happening with the p320. FWIW, I've read California's safety testing procedure requires the pistol be dropped in this orientation specifically to test this scenario. So, if the p320 had been submitted for Cali compliance the issue would have been identified almost immediately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinnyb82 Posted August 9, 2017 at 09:20 PM Share Posted August 9, 2017 at 09:20 PM That doesn't explain why Sig has the P320 on its list of California compliant pistols. https://www.sigsauer.com/california-compliant-pistols/ Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinnyb82 Posted August 9, 2017 at 09:25 PM Share Posted August 9, 2017 at 09:25 PM And yet when going to the actual product page, it has MA, CT, HI, NY compliant models but no California compliant model. Apparently the only reason why is because Sig didn't wanna deal with that microstamping BS. Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomC727 Posted August 10, 2017 at 12:20 AM Share Posted August 10, 2017 at 12:20 AM 3) He hammers the point of the army not knowing how the p320 will function in cold weather and altitude while just glancing over the fact that the glock also has these questions unanswered. Please tell me you're joking. Glocks are used by like half the planet. Sent from my SM-G930P using TapatalkRefer to the video. No. I'm not joking. And to be honest, is Glock truely used by half the planet. I'm interested in discussing facts rather than emotion on personal feelings toward which firearm brand is the end all be all of amazingness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDW Posted August 10, 2017 at 03:39 AM Share Posted August 10, 2017 at 03:39 AM Guys and Gals, Chris was one of the very first guys to comment on this contract on youtube. His background info. is posted below. I was passing along a video I found interesting. I was NOT trying to create a debate, for I have zero knowledge on Sig or Glock. Other than shooting several models from each company, at the range, plinking, I know less about these companies than most. IMO, they both make very reliable and nice firearms. http://smallarmssolutions.com/uploads/3/3/6/7/3367673/1383360549.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallbore Posted August 10, 2017 at 12:48 PM Share Posted August 10, 2017 at 12:48 PM What we learn from history is that we learn nothing.It is well documented that due to budget restraints the military seeks the cheapest and most versatile small weapon. M16 being a prime example.I have switched out frames on a P320. I also have a Sig P228. The difference in the quality between the two is night and day. Even though, the P320 functions well.The problem with the P320 is not the gun but the current generation of gun owners.Only a fool advocates and carries a round chambered in a SA striker fired gun that does not have an external safety. A wise man learns from others.I have never heard anyone advocate carrying a SA revolver with all rounds chambered and hammer cocked. I suspect the 1800s generation instinctively understood the inherit danger. It probably did not take long to learn by example to keep the hammer down on an empty chamber. We have several decades of examples why carry with a round chambered in a SA striker fired pistol is not good but wisdom is not yet developing.The 1800s also saw the development of double action trigger which improved getting the gun into action faster but it still took close to a hundred years for Bill Ruger to solve the dropped gun problem for the revolver.So here we are today with many claiming it is foolish to carry with an empty chamber for striker fired but I bet recognize how foolish it is to carry chamber loaded and hammer cocked for a revolver.There is a simple and safe solution for those adamant about having a loaded chamber. Carry a modern DAO striker fired pistol.(Or leave the gun home so as to protect those around you from your negligent discharge) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drumgod Posted August 10, 2017 at 01:49 PM Share Posted August 10, 2017 at 01:49 PM ... Only a fool advocates and carries a round chambered in a SA striker fired gun that does not have an external safety. ... Are the p320 pistols actually Single Action? The strikers I'm most familiar with (Glock, XD, XDm) are sort of half-cocked when the slide is cycled then the trigger pull draws it fully before release. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quackersmacker Posted August 10, 2017 at 02:14 PM Share Posted August 10, 2017 at 02:14 PM ...Only a fool advocates and carries a round chambered in a SA striker fired gun that does not have an external safety....Are the p320 pistols actually Single Action? The strikers I'm most familiar with (Glock, XD, XDm) are sort of half-cocked when the slide is cycled then the trigger pull draws it fully before release. It technically is single action. They tried to make it feel like a DA. Here's a good article about it: https://www.americanrifleman.org/articles/2015/4/23/clarifying-double-action-only-dao/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drumgod Posted August 10, 2017 at 02:49 PM Share Posted August 10, 2017 at 02:49 PM Ah. Thanks for the link... So it is, more or less, Single Action: The striker is spring loaded and becomes fully cocked when the slide comes all the way to the rear, either manually or when the act of firing drives it back. To fire, the shooter presses the trigger, an act that clears safeties and releases the striker. This initial trigger pull does feel a great deal like several other guns (Glock, S&W M&P) that partially pre-c0cked the striker and are called DAOs (for double-action-only). Edited to fix censorship... lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiliconSorcerer Posted August 10, 2017 at 03:07 PM Share Posted August 10, 2017 at 03:07 PM I definitely would. It want to be in that room! These guy are crazy lol That was my first impression too. But if you review the links in posts #1 and #3, you will see that the guns were loaded with primed cases, not will a full cartridge will a projectile. I do not see the reason for the vests. No bullet means nothing to penetrate skin. If they were using complete cartridges, then their head, belly, and extremities would be subject to penetration. As for as the angle involved: does it really matter? Maybe when I decide to clumsily drop my pistol or it is knocked off a counter, I will be sure it falls and strikes at a safe angle. I think you would be surprised by the amount of people that have been injured or even killed by blanks... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinnyb82 Posted August 13, 2017 at 03:09 PM Share Posted August 13, 2017 at 03:09 PM Eh well I'm gonna send mine into Sig as soon as they make the "voluntary upgrade" available. Got an Apex flat-face trigger on it now, gonna have to swap it out for the original. Hope to God I don't have to send the entire pistol. Apex is offering RMAs or Apex product vouchers for their aftermarket P320 triggers. Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patriot1776 Posted August 13, 2017 at 10:42 PM Share Posted August 13, 2017 at 10:42 PM Hope for those that own them and send them in it does not take months to get back and change the trigger like Springfields XDS fiasco . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomC727 Posted August 14, 2017 at 02:35 PM Share Posted August 14, 2017 at 02:35 PM https://www.sigsauer.com/support/p320-voluntary-upgrade-program-2/ Seems reasonable. Will cover shipping both ways. Turnaround time may take 4-6 weeks but this is probably expected with the amount of pistols likely to be arriving to Sig. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweeper13 Posted August 14, 2017 at 03:48 PM Share Posted August 14, 2017 at 03:48 PM https://www.sigsauer.com/support/p320-voluntary-upgrade-program-2/ Seems reasonable. Will cover shipping both ways. Turnaround time may take 4-6 weeks but this is probably expected with the amount of pistols likely to be arriving to Sig. Thanks for the link. I liked Sigs FB page hoping they would post the info there. I haven't seen anything yet. How did you find the link? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomC727 Posted August 14, 2017 at 04:00 PM Share Posted August 14, 2017 at 04:00 PM https://www.sigsauer.com/support/p320-voluntary-upgrade-program-2/ Seems reasonable. Will cover shipping both ways. Turnaround time may take 4-6 weeks but this is probably expected with the amount of pistols likely to be arriving to Sig. Thanks for the link. I liked Sigs FB page hoping they would post the info there. I haven't seen anything yet. How did you find the link? Another forum (SigTalk). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InterestedBystander Posted August 14, 2017 at 04:08 PM Share Posted August 14, 2017 at 04:08 PM https://www.sigsauer.com/support/p320-voluntary-upgrade-program-2/ Seems reasonable. Will cover shipping both ways. Turnaround time may take 4-6 weeks but this is probably expected with the amount of pistols likely to be arriving to Sig. Thanks for the link. I liked Sigs FB page hoping they would post the info there. I haven't seen anything yet. How did you find the link?Another forum (SigTalk).Error 404 - Page not found Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweeper13 Posted August 14, 2017 at 04:09 PM Share Posted August 14, 2017 at 04:09 PM LOL...It crashed, It was there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweeper13 Posted August 14, 2017 at 09:07 PM Share Posted August 14, 2017 at 09:07 PM Just found the updated page for the Sig P320 voluntary upgrade program. I haven't seen anything on FB yet. https://www.sigsauer.com/support/p320-voluntary-upgrade-program/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweeper13 Posted August 14, 2017 at 10:49 PM Share Posted August 14, 2017 at 10:49 PM A friend ended up calling Sig today after the site was down. He was told not to expect a return shipping label for up to possibly 2 months. They are in the process of getting the replacement parts. We shall see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinnyb82 Posted August 15, 2017 at 12:47 AM Share Posted August 15, 2017 at 12:47 AM I filled out the form on the website, submitted it, and it gave me the good, old "We'll let you know...." They don't mention any timetable whatsoever like taking X weeks/months to get parts, turnaround, etc. Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tkroenlein Posted August 15, 2017 at 03:45 AM Share Posted August 15, 2017 at 03:45 AM I bet the FedEx guys are walkin' on eggshells... Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubbacs Posted August 15, 2017 at 04:01 AM Share Posted August 15, 2017 at 04:01 AM I bet the FedEx guys are walkin' on eggshells...Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkBecause people are gonna send loaded Sig's back in and they don't want to drop the Pkg? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweeper13 Posted August 15, 2017 at 11:13 AM Share Posted August 15, 2017 at 11:13 AM Anyone know how they will handle this voluntary upgrade program? Do they release X amount of shipping labels, give X amount of time to get the firearms back to them, fix in X amount of time, then release X amount of labels again? Just wondering.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinnyb82 Posted August 20, 2017 at 04:09 PM Share Posted August 20, 2017 at 04:09 PM I have no idea. Sig sent me an email notifying me that I'm on "the list" so I guess I'll have to wait. Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweeper13 Posted August 20, 2017 at 06:41 PM Share Posted August 20, 2017 at 06:41 PM I have no idea. Sig sent me an email notifying me that I'm on "the list" so I guess I'll have to wait. Sent from my VS987 using TapatalkWHAT..U gots an email .... Nothing over here yet. Well, at least we know they are doing something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinnyb82 Posted August 20, 2017 at 10:55 PM Share Posted August 20, 2017 at 10:55 PM No, I meant an email telling me I'll get an email when the parts are ready. Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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