bbkchicago Posted March 16, 2020 at 09:52 PM Share Posted March 16, 2020 at 09:52 PM I reached my peak BS threshold with the ISP quite a while ago. It's beyond frustrating that as citizens we are expected to abide by the letter of the law and the time frames laid out, or we will be deprived of our freedom. It seems that those in authority, however, have special privileges and ostensibly more rights than us lowly citizens. Nevermind that we have to jump through all of these hoops just to exercise a constitutional right. They break the law literally all day every day by not abiding by the law, yet the only thing that happens is it gets worse and worse. After the SNAFU that was my wait for both FOID and CCW, I was angry enough to do something about it. Now guiding my wife through the process (she works with law enforcement and has a perfectly clean record - not even a speeding ticket her entire life) and we're almost on month three and they can't even bother to look at her FOID application...that's just it. It's too much. #1: They break the law by almost always going past the legally allowed time frames.#2: They break the law by misappropriating the monies raised as part of the licensing process. #3: The process is clearly unconstitutional, not to mention unfair. ...yet nothing happens to them. Nothing changes. If WE as citizens were to take the same approach, we would be in jail. All of that in and of itself is bad enough, but the fact that it's impossible to get a response from anyone via phone or email (the only way they allow you to contact them) is just infuriating. I don't care how much time or money it costs me, I am suing the Illinois State Patrol. I've spoken with a law firm and they're taking my retainer Friday, they say we're going to start early next month. I asked if they thought we had a good chance of winning and I wasn't given a positive answer, but they also didn't laugh me out of the room. I realize that it's Illinois and our overlords hate guns and the people that own them, but I've got to at least try instead of just complaining about how awful up it is without ever doing anything to change it. Once I cross the $5k threshold, I'm going to start a GoFundMe for legal expenses, and I hope I can rely on some of you here for support with that. If I have to sell a kidney to get the money, though, I will. Enough is enough. I'll update this thread as things progress, but I was told this is going to be a lengthy process and that I should be patient. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubbacs Posted March 16, 2020 at 10:27 PM Share Posted March 16, 2020 at 10:27 PM Can we get this as a stickyI’d like to be able to get updates and follow without it being archived Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geo.ulrich Posted March 16, 2020 at 10:29 PM Share Posted March 16, 2020 at 10:29 PM Please make it a sticky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quiet Observer Posted March 16, 2020 at 10:33 PM Share Posted March 16, 2020 at 10:33 PM The ISRA and Second Amendment Foundation have already filed suit about this. https://week.com/2020/02/05/illinois-state-police-sued-for-not-acting-on-foid-card-concealed-carry-appeals/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubbacs Posted March 16, 2020 at 11:53 PM Share Posted March 16, 2020 at 11:53 PM But we don’t get regular updates from them.This is an individual suit which might get some notice.Couldn’t hurt to sticky.......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeffrey Posted March 16, 2020 at 11:59 PM Share Posted March 16, 2020 at 11:59 PM Good luck to you, and your wife. You’re gonna get her a speeding ticket with that talk. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quiet Observer Posted March 17, 2020 at 12:14 AM Share Posted March 17, 2020 at 12:14 AM But we don’t get regular updates from them.This is an individual suit which might get some notice.Couldn’t hurt to sticky.......... I was not disagreeing with you. I was just adding information. Perhaps they could combine the two suits? That would be up to the OP and his lawyers and the other plaintiffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bo69 Posted March 17, 2020 at 12:35 PM Share Posted March 17, 2020 at 12:35 PM It took over 11 months for me to receive my CCL renewal. I renewed in Feb 2019 as my CCL was gonna expire in May. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RacerDave6 Posted March 17, 2020 at 12:53 PM Share Posted March 17, 2020 at 12:53 PM Good luck.What will be the relief you are seeking? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbkchicago Posted March 17, 2020 at 02:02 PM Author Share Posted March 17, 2020 at 02:02 PM I saw the ISRA suit and it doesn't surprise me one bit - I've never met a better group of people and I'm in the process of joining their organization now (as a member, no affiliation with their lawsuit). I suggest everyone else do the same if for no other reason because of how genuinely good those guys are... plus their range is pretty cool! As far as the lawsuit and combining them or something like that, I haven't even considered it and I think it's way too soon for that, but who knows what might happen later? Anything is possible. I would certainly do anything I could to support such an awesome organization, but for now my suit is it's own thing. It's very possible that theirs could make mine moot or who even knows what will happen at this point... As far as updates, I will keep them coming just as often as I can...but I'm being told that I have to keep my mouth shut about a lot of things, which for me is NOT easy. That being said, I think there will be a plenty of info I can share, and I will do so with whatever I can. To be honest, I probably won't have the answers to about 99% of the questions everyone has at this point because it's just too early. I do know this is going to cost me quite a bit of money and so I'm digging in deep to sell some investments and if need be even some real estate to pay for all of this. I may end up a broke loser, but at least I can look at myself in the mirror and say I tried my best. Thanks for the responses, guys! I should have more solid info by next week, we're (hopefully still) meeting later this week to discuss and transfer the initial payment. I suppose the meeting might be delayed due to the commie cough, but I don't think so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ragsbo Posted March 17, 2020 at 04:53 PM Share Posted March 17, 2020 at 04:53 PM Good luck, kick butt and take not prisoners! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mkhalil61 Posted March 17, 2020 at 05:36 PM Share Posted March 17, 2020 at 05:36 PM Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davel501 Posted March 17, 2020 at 05:43 PM Share Posted March 17, 2020 at 05:43 PM I would like to see a mandamus case where as part of the settlement the ISP is forced to use technology and automation to reduce the processing times down to a few minutes. The ideal is the FOID goes away but making it a minor speedbump works for the time being. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
357 Posted March 17, 2020 at 08:25 PM Share Posted March 17, 2020 at 08:25 PM I reached my peak BS threshold with the ISP quite a while ago. It's beyond frustrating that as citizens we are expected to abide by the letter of the law and the time frames laid out, or we will be deprived of our freedom. It seems that those in authority, however, have special privileges and ostensibly more rights than us lowly citizens. Nevermind that we have to jump through all of these hoops just to exercise a constitutional right. They break the law literally all day every day by not abiding by the law, yet the only thing that happens is it gets worse and worse. After the SNAFU that was my wait for both FOID and CCW, I was angry enough to do something about it. Now guiding my wife through the process (she works with law enforcement and has a perfectly clean record - not even a speeding ticket her entire life) and we're almost on month three and they can't even bother to look at her FOID application...that's just it. It's too much. #1: They break the law by almost always going past the legally allowed time frames.#2: They break the law by misappropriating the monies raised as part of the licensing process. #3: The process is clearly unconstitutional, not to mention unfair. ...yet nothing happens to them. Nothing changes. If WE as citizens were to take the same approach, we would be in jail. All of that in and of itself is bad enough, but the fact that it's impossible to get a response from anyone via phone or email (the only way they allow you to contact them) is just infuriating. I don't care how much time or money it costs me, I am suing the Illinois State Patrol. I've spoken with a law firm and they're taking my retainer Friday, they say we're going to start early next month. I asked if they thought we had a good chance of winning and I wasn't given a positive answer, but they also didn't laugh me out of the room. I realize that it's Illinois and our overlords hate guns and the people that own them, but I've got to at least try instead of just complaining about how awful up it is without ever doing anything to change it. Once I cross the $5k threshold, I'm going to start a GoFundMe for legal expenses, and I hope I can rely on some of you here for support with that. If I have to sell a kidney to get the money, though, I will. Enough is enough. I'll update this thread as things progress, but I was told this is going to be a lengthy process and that I should be patient.About time, I commend you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All Pro Posted March 18, 2020 at 06:43 PM Share Posted March 18, 2020 at 06:43 PM What would be the legal reason for the suit ? Do not give them 5k, until its explained. They are protected by the 11th amendment.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quiet Observer Posted March 18, 2020 at 07:41 PM Share Posted March 18, 2020 at 07:41 PM There are four 11th Amendment examples of exceptions to the ban when suing state courts. These exceptions to the ban include: A person can bring a state lawsuit in federal court if the lawsuit is against a state’s subdivisions, like its counties or cities. A state can consent to becoming a party to a state suit in federal court. Congress can strip a state’s immunity from the suit, provided Congress makes its intention for doing so “unmistakably clear.” While no one can sue a state in state court under normal conditions, if a state breaks a federal law, the federal court can order that state’s officials to comply with the law. https://legaldictionary.net/11th-amendment/ They are suing the ISP, not the state of Illinois. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChicagoRonin70 Posted March 20, 2020 at 05:50 AM Share Posted March 20, 2020 at 05:50 AM This is relevant to my interests! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubbacs Posted March 20, 2020 at 08:04 PM Share Posted March 20, 2020 at 08:04 PM Do we have a Mod who can pin this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Molly B. Posted March 20, 2020 at 09:06 PM Share Posted March 20, 2020 at 09:06 PM Maybe when the suit is filed and we have links and stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmagloo Posted March 20, 2020 at 09:51 PM Share Posted March 20, 2020 at 09:51 PM I'm good with just the stuff part. lol. (I'll keep my day job) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubbacs Posted April 9, 2020 at 04:44 AM Share Posted April 9, 2020 at 04:44 AM Any updates? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneGun Posted April 11, 2020 at 09:55 PM Share Posted April 11, 2020 at 09:55 PM Any updates? Not much has happened with the Federal lawsuit against the ISP by the two gentlemen, the SAF and the ISRA. I have access to the Federal Court docket system (called PACER) so I looked it up. The case docket number is 1:20-cv-734. if you want to get access to the PACER system. They charge for this service, but it is open to the public. The latest entry is below. The 2nd amended general order is an order extending deadlines due to Covid-19. What this means is that the State of Illannoy has until May 18 to either answer the complaint or plead. The parties will meet with the Judge on June 11, 2020 to give a status conference where the parties will explain their plans to either settle the matter or prosecute the case. Wish I had better news, but court dockets generally move slow without a Pandemic. By the way, I'm not an attorney. I'm a litigation consultant / expert witness. 04/02/2020 12 MINUTE entry before the Honorable Mary M. Rowland: In light of Second Amended General Order 20-0012 dated March 30, 2020, the deadline for Defendants to answer or otherwise plead is extended to 5/18/20. Initial status set for 4/14/20 is stricken and reset to 6/18/20 at 9:30am. Joint Initial Status Report due 6/11/20. Mailed notice. (dm, ) (Entered: 04/02/2020) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quiet Observer Posted April 11, 2020 at 10:05 PM Share Posted April 11, 2020 at 10:05 PM Any updates? Not much has happened with the Federal lawsuit against the ISP by the two gentlemen, the SAF and the ISRA. I have access to the Federal Court docket system (called PACER) so I looked it up. The case docket number is 1:20-cv-734. if you want to get access to the PACER system. They charge for this service, but it is open to the public. The latest entry is below. The 2nd amended general order is an order extending deadlines due to Covid-19. What this means is that the State of Illannoy has until May 18 to either answer the complaint or plead. The parties will meet with the Judge on June 11, 2020 to give a status conference where the parties will explain their plans to either settle the matter or prosecute the case. Wish I had better news, but court dockets generally move slow without a Pandemic. By the way, I'm not an attorney. I'm a litigation consultant / expert witness. 04/02/2020 12 MINUTE entry before the Honorable Mary M. Rowland: In light of Second Amended General Order 20-0012 dated March 30, 2020, the deadline for Defendants to answer or otherwise plead is extended to 5/18/20. Initial status set for 4/14/20 is stricken and reset to 6/18/20 at 9:30am. Joint Initial Status Report due 6/11/20. Mailed notice. (dm, ) (Entered: 04/02/2020) Thanks for the update, but I think that Bubbacs was referring to the independent suit that the OP said that he would be filing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubbacs Posted April 11, 2020 at 10:35 PM Share Posted April 11, 2020 at 10:35 PM ^ yes thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbkchicago Posted April 12, 2020 at 09:08 AM Author Share Posted April 12, 2020 at 09:08 AM I have bad news. Not only do I not have a substantial update, I have been very firmly told that posting here puts the whole case in potential jeopardy. I'm not going to be able to give any sort of updates for quite a while. I was laid off a few weeks ago like many others have been, but we're going to move forward anyway. I probably won't do any sort of fund raiser for this because I'm confident I can pay for it on my own - I suspect the delays we are currently experiencing in the courts (basically they've shut down for anything non-emergency) are going to time nicely with my employment/ability to keep paying for this. I promise I'll keep bugging them and if there's anything I *am* allowed to post, I will. For now, however, I have to go quiet. I will add one thing I think is funny - I received the nicest phone call from the ISP PIO not long after they learned I was suing. Asking what he can do to help and offering very White glove service. Tired of waiting for the ISP? Sue them like me Say a prayer for me, guys! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE KING Posted April 12, 2020 at 01:33 PM Share Posted April 12, 2020 at 01:33 PM Very Good Luck with your lawsuit. With all of the information that is shared on this forum with all of the issues, delays and other problems acquiring and renewing our "unconstitutional ID's I'm surprised there aren't more lawsuits. I have said it before and I will say it again. This state needs to have a barrage of lawsuits filed against them challenging their infringements on our rights. Again, good luck and thanks for stepping up. KING Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubbacs Posted April 12, 2020 at 05:45 PM Share Posted April 12, 2020 at 05:45 PM So the ISP knows about the suit as you stated, wants to help you and make it go away?How did they find out?Are there listening devices in our FOID cards? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Fife Posted April 12, 2020 at 05:49 PM Share Posted April 12, 2020 at 05:49 PM Squeeky wheel gets p***** on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneGun Posted April 12, 2020 at 11:08 PM Share Posted April 12, 2020 at 11:08 PM I have bad news. Not only do I not have a substantial update, I have been very firmly told that posting here puts the whole case in potential jeopardy. I'm not going to be able to give any sort of updates for quite a while. I was laid off a few weeks ago like many others have been, but we're going to move forward anyway. I probably won't do any sort of fund raiser for this because I'm confident I can pay for it on my own - I suspect the delays we are currently experiencing in the courts (basically they've shut down for anything non-emergency) are going to time nicely with my employment/ability to keep paying for this. I promise I'll keep bugging them and if there's anything I *am* allowed to post, I will. For now, however, I have to go quiet. I will add one thing I think is funny - I received the nicest phone call from the ISP PIO not long after they learned I was suing. Asking what he can do to help and offering very White glove service. Tired of waiting for the ISP? Sue them like me Say a prayer for me, guys! This is not exactly bad news. If the ISP PIO offered to assist you, then you may get the resolution you seek before your lawsuit gets expensive. Its very clear that the attorneys for the ISP watch this forum. What is annoying is having to actually file a lawsuit. I wish you the best and Happy Easter! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChicagoRonin70 Posted April 13, 2020 at 03:56 AM Share Posted April 13, 2020 at 03:56 AM So the ISP knows about the suit as you stated, wants to help you and make it go away?How did they find out?Are there listening devices in our FOID cards? This is pretty much what occurred when I got an affidavit from a psychologist at the VA stating that not only was I not a danger to myself or others, that due to my training of domestic violence and sexual assault victims in self-protection, I was probably the least-likely individual to commit any sort of crime with a firearm. That, and my wife sending in testimony berating the CPD and Cook County Police for daring to deny a disabled veteran his right to bear arms that he had fought and sacrificed for in combat, caused the governor's office at the time to send a memo fast-tracking my CCL application for approval because they wanted to avoid me taking them to Federal court, since having a representative of a Federal agency (my doctor) providing the testimony that he did, if the state further denied my application, it would have bypassed the state courts. They were terrified that me getting my case to Federal court would have allowed me to get the whole state licensing scheme overturned without any chance for the state courts to muddy up the waters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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