Beretta M1951

[illinois_buckeye]

So waiting on my foid to get here. In the meantime been poking around online and saw some of those as surplus. Are they legal in Illinois, Madison county specifically. My apologies for any confusion as I've never owned a handgun. Just on these, saw them at buds gun shop online, and the price seems in my ballpark. I know they are surplus but always have heard Beretta was a good firearm.

 

The reason for my question is I asked a gun shop in Missouri if they sell to residents in Illinois. I work in Missouri about 20 minutes from that shop and was recommended to check them out. The response was they can sell long guns with a foid, but not handguns. So would hate to purchase after I get my card and find that I'm not allowed to get it. Anyone have any insight?

 

This is the one I was looking at for after my foid arrives in the mail.

 

https://www.budsgunshop.com/mobile/product/411559417/used+surplus+beretta+m1951+9mm+8%2b1

[Tim85]

you can get it, but it has to be shipped to an in state ffl

[chislinger]

Get a C&R license (03 FFL) and you can get that M1951 shipped right to your door from anywhere in the USA, or buy it in any state.

[RS1]

As stated above, handguns can be sold out of state but can only be transferred in-state. You can buy it in Missouri but they will have to ship to an FFL (licensed transfer agent, essentially) in your state who can then transfer the handgun to you.

 

There are various exceptions but most of the time that is how it goes.

 

 

Long guns can be sold and transfered out of state but Illinois has stupid laws that they expect other states to follow. Technically Illinois residents can only get long guns in adjacent states (WI, IN, MO, KY). I was denied in MI because of this but some shops that aren't in Illinois don't follow Illinois laws (imagine that!). Again, you can buy from any state but with the exception of the 4 above, you have to have them shipped to your FFL.

[Rilo]

Get a C&R license (03 FFL) and you can get that M1951 shipped right to your door from anywhere in the USA, or buy it in any state.

Most of these are not c+r eligible that I have found.

[Euler]

Those Berettas have been available for about 6 months or so from several places, including Sportsmans Outdoor Superstore and Palmetto State Armory. Ironically they're inexpensive and still available now.

 

Be aware that they are sold "as-is" although many work just fine. They come with only 1 magazine. You're unlikely to find more. They're single action only and have a rather odd, cross-frame safety.

 

As mentioned above, you need to buy handguns through an in-state FFL. That's federal law.

[illinois_buckeye]

Ok. Cool. Still learning much of this. My thought was to get it shipped in to a local place and maybe see what they would charge to inspect it and clean it up. I was looking for magazines and was seeing them for about 40 bucks.

 

Even though I've never fired the gun, my dad has a gun that's a Czechoslovakian police pistol that grandpa brought back from ww2. He was in the 82nd and had actually captured a German Luger. But he had to ship it back to the states. By the time he got back, someone switched it on him. But dad says the police pistol works just fine. I think he can shoot 9mm in it.

[chislinger]

Most of these are not c+r eligible that I have found.

Lots on gunbroker that are. Here's one: https://www.gunbroker.com/item/870745533

[Rilo]

 

Most of these are not c+r eligible that I have found.

Lots on gunbroker that are. Here's one: https://www.gunbroker.com/item/870745533

That’s why I said “most”

[Benbow]

They are legal in Madison County. I am located in Mad Co and can order one for you.

[illinois_buckeye]

Thanks. I'm in limbo at the moment. Applied June 2nd for foid, it showed as active on July 9th. So I can't buy until it arrives.

[cybermgk]

Be aware that they are sold "as-is" although many work just fine. They come with only 1 magazine. You're unlikely to find more. They're single action only and have a rather odd, cross-frame safety.

 

 

For illinois_buckeye, a translation, as you say you are new to firearms.

 

"They're single action only" This means the hammer has to be cocked to fire the pistol. Which means, in reality, before firing, pulling, or racking, the slide back to both chamber a round from the magazine, and pullback (or word for Male Rooster that begins with C and rhymes with Lock) the hammer. After that first round is fired, the semi-auto action will do all of that for 2nd, 3rd etc shots.

 

Since there is no decocker, it's not that safe to chamber around, hold the hammer and gently lower the hammer after pulling the trigger. I don't think it is drop safe in that position. It does have a half cocked position for that situation, but you would still have to put the cross bolt safety on, to carry. So to fire, you would have to draw, click the safety off, fully pullback (or word for Male Rooster that begins with C and rhymes with Lock) the hammer. I believe most Military/Police that carried with the gun, 'ready to rock' did so by chambering a round by racking the slide back, then engaging the safety, and then holstering in a holster with flap to protect from the safety button being hit.

 

Also, as to the safety. It's button operated. I.e. a button near the top of the grip, push in on left side to engage, push in on right to disengage. THis is not easily done, without a lot of practice for when it 'counts'. It is also somewhat near where most people expect a mag release on more modern handguns.

 

Also, the mag release button is on the bottom of the grip. Not a biggy, really, but it isn't where most americans would expect it.

 

ALL that said, should you get one? If you collect Beretta's, or just firearms in general, you bet. If you want it as a range gun, have at it. If you want it as a primary home defense, or self defense weapon? It is better than nothing, but for a new gun owner, I would recommend against it. A Beretta 92, used would be a better choice. Even a Taurus PT92 imho would be better (Much more capacity, made in Beretta's old factory in Brazil, with their former machines, and blueprints. AND, it has a better safety, imho than the Beretta 92, and can be gotten used, for the price of the M1951) That is if you want the Beretta design. But, there are simpler to use and learn 9mm semi-auto handguns. For carry? I definitely would say there are so many better choices, even at that price range,

 

I would

[Quiet Observer]

Why was the word c-o-c-k censored?

It has been used for centuries to describe a specific action when using firearms.

Does the auto-censor block a phrase like "screw on the nut"?

Why does it allow F him?

[cybermgk]

Why was the word "****" censored?

Seems odd on a site that deals with firearms, doesn't it. See above for changes to get around

[illinois_buckeye]

I'll do some looking around as well. I do want to eventually get a concealed carry. But my thought is that when carrying I would not keep a round chambered anyway just to avoid mishaps. I did see someone had a Smith and Wesson shield. May take a further look at that as well.

 

https://www.budsgunshop.com/mobile/product/93435/smith+%26+wesson+m%26p9+shield+9mm+31+7%2f8r+nms

 

I did also see this other one before, I like the idea of more rounds but haven't heard their name much if it all.

 

https://www.budsgunshop.com/mobile/product/411559418/arex+delta+black+4in+17%2b1

[cybermgk]

I'll do some looking around as well. I do want to eventually get a concealed carry. But my thought is that when carrying I would not keep a round chambered anyway just to avoid mishaps. I did see someone had a Smith and Wesson shield. May take a further look at that as well.

 

https://www.budsgunshop.com/mobile/product/93435/smith+%26+wesson+m%26p9+shield+9mm+31+7%2f8r+nms

 

I did also see this other one before, I like the idea of more rounds but haven't heard their name much if it all.

 

https://www.budsgunshop.com/mobile/product/411559418/arex+delta+black+4in+17%2b1

FYI, both those links at Bud's Gun Shop require you to have a Team Buds membership. It requires a fee of $30 a year

https://www.budsgunshop.com/teambuds.php

 

Normally, I'd say it's a waste of time, but with the shortages right now due to demand, it may be worth it. It allows you first crack at high demand firearms and special Team Buds only offerings.

 

Shield is a very solid, first gun. Solid maker, solid warranty, reliable, easy to use etc. Can be concealed carried, or at home defense. It i what is called a 'single stack' as it just has a line of rounds in the magazine, one on top of the other (like the M1951), as apposed to two lines, next to each other, staggered until the very top. They do this to keep the firearm thin. Thin is good for concealed carry.

 

Not personally experienced with the Arex, so I won't comment out of ignorance. I'd just say google reviews on it, look for pros and cons. My quick look at it, I see a lot of nice features, but know nada about how durable or well constructed or not they are.

 

As to not keeping a round chambered while carrying there are pros to that, but one big con. In a self-defense situation, tenths of a second can matter. Yes, you can train to draw, rack and aim and fire. But, you will always be just a bit slower than draw aim and fire. Again, research both sides of that, aas there is two schools for the pros and cons. WHEN you buy your first handgun, take classes to learn to use properly and safely. Take a class on holster draw. Get some snap caps, so you can practice both drawing techniques. Most modern semi-auto handguns, are very safe, chambered and ready to go, in a proper holster, and with proper technique.

[illinois_buckeye]

Thanks for the advice. I'll do some looking then. Although I haven't owned many guns, my first gun was a Remington 1100 semi auto 16 guage. Which is still at my parents house. But the barrel needs to be re blued on it I think. As far as Arex, I'd just not heard of them. Been around guns enough to know the bigger names, but just hadn't owned any except the Remington above. I remember bird hunting with it at about 8 years old. Good to know information. Thanks folks. I'll try to let you all know what I select when I get my card and am able to buy.

 

Let me ask this though, I've been looking mostly at 9mm. Everyone says they are cheaper rounds and I get that. One guy says 9mm is the best, another guy I know prefers .45. I've also looked at a bit at .40 which I'm assuming is slightly smaller than .45. Then my dad says he carries a 380 for concealed, but I think has 9mm.

 

I think the argument against 9mm was that 9mm is a supersonic round typically and can penetrate walls easier. In our home(older house), the walls are plaster, and outside walls are bricks. No kids, just my wife and I and two yorkies. At least they are good watch dogs and noise makers if people are around. Anyone have a preference, or should I stick more toward 9mm? I'm open to suggestions if there is a good option. But I'm assuming that almost all guns/ammo are going to be harder to find.

 

Wasn't aware of team buds. Maybe this one will be a good fit.

 

https://www.budsgunshop.com/product_info.php/products_id/45096/smith+%26+wesson+11808+m%26p+9+shield+m20+9mm+31

[cybermgk]

Thanks for the advice. I'll do some looking then. Although I haven't owned many guns, my first gun was a Remington 1100 semi auto 16 guage. Which is still at my parents house. But the barrel needs to be re blued on it I think. As far as Arex, I'd just not heard of them. Been around guns enough to know the bigger names, but just hadn't owned any except the Remington above. I remember bird hunting with it at about 8 years old. Good to know information. Thanks folks. I'll try to let you all know what I select when I get my card and am able to buy.

 

Let me ask this though, I've been looking mostly at 9mm. Everyone says they are cheaper rounds and I get that. One guy says 9mm is the best, another guy I know prefers .45. I've also looked at a bit at .40 which I'm assuming is slightly smaller than .45. Then my dad says he carries a 380 for concealed, but I think has 9mm.

 

I think the argument against 9mm was that 9mm is a supersonic round typically and can penetrate walls easier. In our home(older house), the walls are plaster, and outside walls are bricks. No kids, just my wife and I and two yorkies. At least they are good watch dogs and noise makers if people are around. Anyone have a preference, or should I stick more toward 9mm? I'm open to suggestions if there is a good option. But I'm assuming that almost all guns/ammo are going to be harder to find.

 

Wasn't aware of team buds. Maybe this one will be a good fit.

 

https://www.budsgunshop.com/product_info.php/products_id/45096/smith+%26+wesson+11808+m%26p+9+shield+m20+9mm+31

LOL, oh lord, not the Caliber Wars topic. A Lot of people feel very strongly about proper caliber to have for self-defense.

 

NORMALLY, 9mm is super abundant and super cheap, compared to a lot of calibers. Right now, is a weird time.

 

To be honest, there are loads in many calibers that will penetrate far enough, with enough expansion to be worthy, and dependable for self defense, even down to 32 acp. More than enough can be found for 9MM.

 

Full metal Jacket loads in most handguns calibers will penetrate walls.of drywall.

[Euler]

All calibers in common use for self-defense attempt to achieve 12-18 inch penetration in ballistic gel, because that's the standard the FBI uses, so that's the standard most of the industry follows. Whatever caliber your religion preaches, it mostly performs the same as the calibers of other religions.

 

Greg Ellifritz (Ohio cop) did a survey of police reports a while ago to compare performance in real-world situations (i.e., people getting shot, not paper or gel). 380 acp through 44 magnum (the most powerful handgun in the world, do you feel lucky, punk?) had virtually identical performance (% of one-shot stops, average # of shots required, etc.). 22, 25, and 32 did not perform well, so he recommends not using them.

 

Chris Baker (Lucky Gunner) commented that Ellifritz's study was done from a cop's point of view, where the objective is to disable a perpetrator completely. Baker pointed out that the objective of self-defense is to make an attacker stop attacking. It's completely acceptable if a defender shoots an attacker and the attacker decides it hurts too much and runs away. 22, 25, and 32 can work for that.

 

Meanwhile, pistols are more popular than revolvers, and 9mm is the most popular handgun caliber, in the world and in the US.

 

FYI, when I took MAG40 last year, there were 28 people in the class. One had a 10mm SIG, and two had something in 45 acp. Everyone else had a 9mm pistol. No one had a revolver.

[Benbow]

the Beretta 1951 is a very simple pistol and I actually prefer single action pistols.

 

that being said, I've got more modern "polymer" pistols in stock, if you want to take a look, it you want to order a 1951, like I said, you can order it and sent it to me (I'm an FFL in Mad Co), and I will hold it til your FOID comes in, heck, I've even got one AR15 type "pistol" left in stock, I can show you whats out there, and you can decide, just PM me during work hours.

[illinois_buckeye]

Ok. I work about an hour over the river in Missouri. Not sure where you are located. When I get my card I can pm you, or if you want to pm me that's fine. My cars only went active the 9th, but I'm hopeful that they got it out and the mail moves quick.

[cybermgk]

the Beretta 1951 is a very simple pistol and I actually prefer single action pistols.

 

that being said, I've got more modern "polymer" pistols in stock, if you want to take a look, it you want to order a 1951, like I said, you can order it and sent it to me (I'm an FFL in Mad Co), and I will hold it til your FOID comes in, heck, I've even got one AR15 type "pistol" left in stock, I can show you whats out there, and you can decide, just PM me during work hours.

Most online shippers won't ship unless he has a valid FOID.

[illinois_buckeye]

Which I should as my status shows active online. But I am waiting until I have an actual card in hand then I can compare. Will probably try to find a local range or two to see about getting at least a basic class at first on shooting a handgun, how to clear jams etc and just general safety. Then after that I think I'd like to look into getting CCL and just further classes beyond the basics. I'm not applying to join the army or something, but I would like to be proficient with a weapon if I'd ever have to be. Hopefully what happens is that I never have to defend myself with a weapon and just get really good at the range.

[cybermgk]

Which I should as my status shows active online. But I am waiting until I have an actual card in hand then I can compare. Will probably try to find a local range or two to see about getting at least a basic class at first on shooting a handgun, how to clear jams etc and just general safety. Then after that I think I'd like to look into getting CCL and just further classes beyond the basics. I'm not applying to join the army or something, but I would like to be proficient with a weapon if I'd ever have to be. Hopefully what happens is that I never have to defend myself with a weapon and just get really good at the range.

Yea, most online sellers require you to send a scan or preferably a picture of the FOID.

[spanishjames]

 

the Beretta 1951 is a very simple pistol and I actually prefer single action pistols.

 

that being said, I've got more modern "polymer" pistols in stock, if you want to take a look, it you want to order a 1951, like I said, you can order it and sent it to me (I'm an FFL in Mad Co), and I will hold it til your FOID comes in, heck, I've even got one AR15 type "pistol" left in stock, I can show you whats out there, and you can decide, just PM me during work hours.

 

Most online shippers won't ship unless he has a valid FOID.

I've never had to provide a FOID card to an online retailer for a firearm. As long as it's going to an FFL, there's no need to do so. Online purchases of ammunition is a different story, as it can be shipped to your home.

[cybermgk]

 

 

the Beretta 1951 is a very simple pistol and I actually prefer single action pistols.

 

that being said, I've got more modern "polymer" pistols in stock, if you want to take a look, it you want to order a 1951, like I said, you can order it and sent it to me (I'm an FFL in Mad Co), and I will hold it til your FOID comes in, heck, I've even got one AR15 type "pistol" left in stock, I can show you whats out there, and you can decide, just PM me during work hours.

Most online shippers won't ship unless he has a valid FOID.

I've never had to provide a FOID card to an online retailer for a firearm. As long as it's going to an FFL, there's no need to do so. Online purchases of ammunition is a different story, as it can be shipped to your home.

 

For Firearms Firearms, I have had to with Midway USA, Buds Guns and Gallery of Guns, and definitely anyone selling ammo. Granted, it is just once, and then kept on record. Some of those also required valid DL as well.

[spanishjames]

the Beretta 1951 is a very simple pistol and I actually prefer single action pistols.

 

that being said, I've got more modern "polymer" pistols in stock, if you want to take a look, it you want to order a 1951, like I said, you can order it and sent it to me (I'm an FFL in Mad Co), and I will hold it til your FOID comes in, heck, I've even got one AR15 type "pistol" left in stock, I can show you whats out there, and you can decide, just PM me during work hours.

 

Most online shippers won't ship unless he has a valid FOID.

I've never had to provide a FOID card to an online retailer for a firearm. As long as it's going to an FFL, there's no need to do so. Online purchases of ammunition is a different story, as it can be shipped to your home.

For Firearms Firearms, I have had to with Midway USA, Buds Guns and Gallery of Guns, and definitely anyone selling ammo. Granted, it is just once, and then kept on record. Some of those also required valid DL as well.

I haven't bought from those stores in a long time. Good to know, thanks.

[cybermgk]

 

I haven't bought from those stores in a long time. Good to know, thanks.

Buds Guns gives me a popup EVERYTIME I log on about it, LOL, even though they already have it.

[Euler]

I've never had to provide a FOID card to an online retailer for a firearm. As long as it's going to an FFL, there's no need to do so. Online purchases of ammunition is a different story, as it can be shipped to your home.

Ditto, although I've never bought from Midway USA, Bud's Gunshop, or Davidson's (Gallery of Guns).

 

FYI, Brownell's doesn't require you to supply a FOID, either. I have bought from them. I could make a list of all the places that have not required me to supply an image of my FOID, but it's easier to summarize: all of them.

[Benbow]

I'm in downtown Wood River, near city hall. Like I said, I can ORDER or SELL you whatever you want, FOID card or no. I just cannot let you leave with any of the stuff without a FOID card.

 

If you want a gun that I don't have in stock, you can buy it online, have it shipped to my FFL, and when you get your FOID, we do your background check and 4473.

 

I am generally available weekdays during normal business hours, by appointment, and Wed and Fri afternoons "officially"

 

you can see my website at www.illinoissbr.com