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Revoked FOID aftef beeing in Mental Faclity


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#1 simson943

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Posted 22 August 2017 - 01:18 PM

Hello!

About 15 month ago I was voluntarily  taken to Mental Hospital in Chicago

Of course I have received revocation letter from ISP.

How can to get my FOID back? Attorney said there is 5 years waiting period - is that true?

Maybe just fill  out appeal and send without  waiting?

Thanks!



#2 Glock23

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Posted 22 August 2017 - 02:12 PM

Your lawyer is correct. You can't have been a patient in a mental health facility for the past 5 years. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N920A using Tapatalk

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#3 simson943

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Posted 22 August 2017 - 02:25 PM

How about appeal,there are documents provided on this forum to fill and send to ISP. Including mental health form,two letters from adults and documentation from the Hospital.

Is it worth to send before 5 years?



#4 mkhalil61

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Posted 22 August 2017 - 02:32 PM

How about appeal,there are documents provided on this forum to fill and send to ISP. Including mental health form,two letters from adults and documentation from the Hospital.

Is it worth to send before 5 years?

 

I'm not sure if it's worth it. I know of a family friend that was involuntarily taken to the cook county mental facility. He tried to file an appeal and lost.  


Edited by mkhalil61, 22 August 2017 - 02:34 PM.


#5 Glock23

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Posted 22 August 2017 - 02:34 PM

So another member has PMd me informing me that I'm wrong (and your lawyer is wrong), claiming the 5 year time frame can be appealed. I'm not playing middle man, though, so he can either provide you the details here or maybe Molly will tell you different if she chimes in. I'm just going by the info under section 8(e) of the FOID act. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N920A using Tapatalk

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#6 Hazborgufen

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Posted 22 August 2017 - 02:52 PM

I just want to say that it's absolutely ridiculous that voluntary mental health treatment triggers an automatic revocation of your FOID. It can lead to people not seeking out mental healthcare out of fear of losing their rights.

 

If you have all the necessary paperwork I hope that an appeal can be initiated prior to the 5 year mark and that the process is speedy.



#7 InterestedBystander

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Posted 22 August 2017 - 03:57 PM

Molly is who you want to be in contact with!

I thought it was only involuntary admissions but the ISP FAQ has the following mental health items

Who is eligible for a FOID Card?

To be eligible for a FOID card, a person must be 21 years of age or have a parent or guardian sponsor that is eligible for a FOID card. An applicant must not be prohibited from possessing firearms in accordance with state or federal law. This requires the applicant is/has:

Not been a patient in a mental health facility within the past five years.
Not been a patient in a mental health facility more than five years ago, unless the applicant submits a Mental Health certification under 430 ILCS 65/8(u).
Not been adjudicated as a mentally disabled person.
Not been involuntarily admitted into a mental health facility.
Not a person whose mental condition is of such a nature that it poses a clear and present danger to the applicant, or any other person or the community.
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#8 Glock23

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Posted 22 August 2017 - 04:35 PM

Ok, read section 10 of the FOID Act... mental health admission (voluntary or otherwise) does not disqualify you from appealing the revocation. Talk to Molly to get the detailed steps required for an appeal, but in the meantime you'll at least need a certified letter from a mental health professional stating that you're not a danger to yourself or others. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N920A using Tapatalk

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#9 InterestedBystander

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Posted 22 August 2017 - 04:59 PM

Still talk with Molly

List of mental health forms for appeal are in this thread
http://illinoiscarry...showtopic=66326

Appealing a revoked FOID
http://illinoiscarry...showtopic=47227
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#10 Molly B.

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Posted 22 August 2017 - 05:39 PM

http://illinoiscarry...66326&p=1099014

 

The forms to file the appeal are available at this link.  It does not cost anything to file the appeal. When you submit it, make sure you have all your documents together and send them via Fedex or some other service that offers signed receipt of delivery.  The letter from the doctor must be sent directly to the ISP.

 

There are circumstances where the five year period is not a barrier but I do not know if the opening poster qualifies.


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#11 mikescooling

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Posted 27 August 2017 - 11:49 AM

The incident in question that brought you to the mental health facility is what's holding you up?  The mental health privacy laws are so strict the ISP would never know you had a stay at a facility, but they would know about what brought you there.  



#12 Gamma

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Posted 27 August 2017 - 12:49 PM

The mental health privacy laws are so strict the ISP would never know you had a stay at a facility

Mental health facilities in Illinois are mandated by state law to report to the ISP to facilitate revoking firearms rights.

Other states not having such laws is the rationale for why Illinois won't issue CCLs to non-residents.

And why any Illinois resident voluntarily seeking mental health care would be advised to go somewhere outside Illinois.
Illinois' FCCA is a prime example of the maxim that sufficiently advanced incompetence is indistinguishable from malice.

#13 InterestedBystander

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Posted 27 August 2017 - 01:05 PM

The mental health privacy laws are so strict the ISP would never know you had a stay at a facility

Mental health facilities in Illinois are mandated by state law to report to the ISP to facilitate revoking firearms rights.Other states not having such laws is the rationale for why Illinois won't issue CCLs to non-residents.And why any Illinois resident voluntarily seeking mental health care would be advised to go somewhere outside Illinois.

Wasn't there also something in the CCL application about giving up your privacy rights in regard to mental health records?

And I dont recall the specifics but there was a bill for a pilot program thru 2020 where some eastern IL and western IA facilities were sharing patients for mental health treatment?

...here it is...guess it would not affect FOIDs/CCLs after reading it.

Synopsis As Introduced
Creates the Out-of-State Person Subject to Involuntary Admission on an Inpatient Basis Mental Health Treatment Act. Provides that on or before January 1, 2018, there is created a 2-year mental health pilot project for which a mental health facility located in Rock Island County, Illinois may accept the admission of an Iowa resident from the Eastern Iowa Mental Health Region who is a person subject to involuntary admission on an inpatient basis under an order issued by an Iowa court for treatment at a mental health facility in this State for which the Iowa court shall have jurisdiction over the recipient while committed to a mental health facility in this State. Provides that the pilot project shall also provide that a resident of Rock Island County, Illinois who is a person subject to involuntary admission on an inpatient basis under an order issued by a court of this State for treatment at a mental health facility in this State may receive inpatient treatment in an Iowa mental health facility. Provides that the Iowa or Illinois mental health facility shall provide mental health services to the recipient for the duration of the court order and shall return the recipient to his or her state of legal residence upon discharge. If a recipient has to enter a State-operated facility, the recipient must be returned to his or her state of legal residence. Defines "Eastern Iowa Mental Health Region", "person subject to involuntary admission on an inpatient basis", "mental health facility", "Pilot project area", "receiving agency", "receiving state", and "sending state". Provides that the Act is repealed on January 1, 2020. Effective July 1, 2017.
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#14 skinnyb82

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Posted 27 August 2017 - 02:09 PM

I believe voluntary admission paperwork explicitly states you'll be reported to the ISP FSB and your FOID card will be revoked. Have an ex who's...been a guest at one such facility a decade or so ago and she showed me the intake forms. That was back when they caught most (as in like 99%) of counties not reporting admissions, before the reporting framework changed. Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk
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#15 The66News

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Posted 27 August 2017 - 08:24 PM

Anyone that has an FOID should have been fully aware once you even WALK in a mental facility, or even as simple as signing your name on a sign in board, just you don't want ANY indication you were at one....figure you lost your FOID, no whining, it's over, done, we might not live 5 years longer to get it back, a real pickle of a law for us to get stuck with.  So TRUE, many are refusing to go to these facilities all for that reason, sometimes even a simple Dr. office thing with getting a mental health thing report could trigger it too if the ISP had a way to look into everyone's regular DR files, do not doubt they'll axe a lot more off the FOID rolls if they knew there were such!  So myself I am very wary of ANY of these facilities, even if my DR wants me to stop in one for even a simple report or procedure, I simply REFUSE it as I don't want it on record and it WILL be at some point.  Just not worth the chance of losing our FOID over it, so good luck on all the appeals cases but most of them, NEVER get lucky, just a waste of time.



#16 RandyP

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Posted 28 August 2017 - 05:03 AM

Tangent to this discussion is the issue that I think most all support - the mentally ill should not have access to firearms and should seek or be provided proper health care to treat their condition. Strikes me as a true Catch 22 situation.



#17 Hazborgufen

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Posted 28 August 2017 - 08:39 AM

Tangent to this discussion is the issue that I think most all support - the mentally ill should not have access to firearms and should seek or be provided proper health care to treat their condition. Strikes me as a true Catch 22 situation.

 

The catch is that people's rights are still revoked even after they are healthy. If people had faith in the system and that they would be reinstated speedily upon recovery then this wouldn't be an issue. As it stands, this is viewed as merely another avenue for restricting gun rights.

 

A lot of the negativity toward these laws is the lack of faith in the system due to the anti-gunner's obvious disregard for the 2nd Amendment. 



#18 skinnyb82

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Posted 29 August 2017 - 09:42 AM


Tangent to this discussion is the issue that I think most all support - the mentally ill should not have access to firearms and should seek or be provided proper health care to treat their condition. Strikes me as a true Catch 22 situation.


 
The catch is that people's rights are still revoked even after they are healthy. If people had faith in the system and that they would be reinstated speedily upon recovery then this wouldn't be an issue. As it stands, this is viewed as merely another avenue for restricting gun rights.
 
A lot of the negativity toward these laws is the lack of faith in the system due to the anti-gunner's obvious disregard for the 2nd Amendment. 

Personally I would advise (and take my own advice) to try everything in one's power to avoid the head shrinker. Go to your GP, go to a counselor, but do not go to a shrink or psychologist. Hospitalization should be an absolute last resort. But I can say that I would never check myself into a mental health facility unless I'm out of my mind and then I'd probably have no choice. It's truly sad that most, if not all of us, would avoid mental health treatment until we're at the point where we can't make an informed decision. Hypothetically, that is.

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#19 jeterlancer

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Posted 07 September 2017 - 11:02 AM

I just want to say that it's absolutely ridiculous that voluntary mental health treatment triggers an automatic revocation of your FOID. It can lead to people not seeking out mental healthcare out of fear of losing their rights.

 

If you have all the necessary paperwork I hope that an appeal can be initiated prior to the 5 year mark and that the process is speedy.

 

Yeah, it's disgusting. It actually might prevent people from getting the help they need.

 

Instead of revoking the permit, why not ask the person for more information as to why they were in the hospital. If they were released, they're obviously not a threat to themselves or others.



#20 Black Flag

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Posted 07 September 2017 - 01:17 PM

Tangent to this discussion is the issue that I think most all support - the mentally ill should not have access to firearms and should seek or be provided proper health care to treat their condition. Strikes me as a true Catch 22 situation.

 

Why?  Because they are mentally ill?  Because they are troubled?

 

Perhaps we should limit their access to motorways and kitchen utensils, too.

 

I bet the statistics show that only a small percentage of mentally ill people are dangerous or violent.

I would further bet that those that are violent could be identified.


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