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Convicted of Animal Abuse? No Guns For The Rest of Your Life!


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#31 mauserme

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Posted 15 November 2017 - 11:07 AM

Hes not a member of the Senate or House so he wont be submitting the bill. Curious to see which member of the legislature decides to go along with him to introduce it.

An interesting combination...

ILLINOIS STATE CRIME COMMISSION / POLICE ATHLETIC LEAGUE OF ILLINOIS

..."Jerry Elsner, executive director of the Illinois State Crime Commission."...

..."Elsner admits he will likely face a stiff backlash from the NRA and defenders of the Second Amendment, but says if such a law saves even one life, it will have been worth the effort"...

 

A Senator from Deerfield wouldn't surprise me at all.


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Let all bitterness and wrath and anger and clamor and slander be put away from you, along with all malice. (Ephesians 4:31)

 

On 5/25/2017, Superintendent Eddie Johnson predicted a 50% reduction is Chicago violence within 3 years of SB1722 becoming law.  The bill was signed into law on 6/23/2017. The clock is now ticking.


#32 Just some guy

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Posted 15 November 2017 - 12:55 PM

(510 ILCS 70/) Humane Care for Animals Act already makes animal abuse a felony. Felons are prohibited from possessing firearms. isn't this issue already addressed?


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#33 ChicagoRonin70

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Posted 15 November 2017 - 01:02 PM

(510 ILCS 70/) Humane Care for Animals Act already makes animal abuse a felony. Felons are prohibited from possessing firearms. isn't this issue already addressed?

 

How dare you bring such irrefutable logic and factual support for your opinion into the discussion of such an idiotic proposal.


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#34 BigJim

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Posted 15 November 2017 - 01:40 PM

People who intentionally hurt dogs should be executed on the spot.  Then we don't need this law.


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#35 Kingcreek

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Posted 15 November 2017 - 01:43 PM

 

I shudder to give more power to take away rights to the gov. If they are not to be trusted with firearms, why are they in public?

Some underage **** cut the throat of a puppy here, nearly killed him, and it took a local media and social media backlash like nothing I've ever seen to get the SA to entertain felony charges. Some kid a county over from me viciously beat a puppy to death and was allowed to plead to a misdemeanor. These scumbags should be felons. And they should be in prison. Anyone who bashes a dog's skull for kicks is unfit for society. And I don't wanna hear the "I was abused as a child" (really? So was I, but I didn't become a sociopath) since it would shock me that the scumbag WASN'T abused as a child.

 

I know a little bit about this^

I'm no bleeding heart but this is a screwed up kid from a screwed up family that was living in a car with a puppy they couldn't feed. The 17 year old felt sorry for the puppy and thought he was saving it from suffering starvation. The SA and the media got all over it and it blew up. The kid and probably the whole family needs help more than another tried-as-adult felony on the books. I'm usually a hang em all type when it comes to criminals but sometimes its a lot deeper than the 6 oclock news.

and you won't find a bigger dog lover than me



#36 mauserme

    Eliminating the element of surprise one bill at a time.

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Posted 15 November 2017 - 01:48 PM

(510 ILCS 70/) Humane Care for Animals Act already makes animal abuse a felony. Felons are prohibited from possessing firearms. isn't this issue already addressed?


Thank you for tracking that down.

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Link to ILGA House Audio/Video..........Link to ILGA Senate Audio/Video ..........Advanced Digital Media Link ..........Blue Room Stream Link

Let all bitterness and wrath and anger and clamor and slander be put away from you, along with all malice. (Ephesians 4:31)

 

On 5/25/2017, Superintendent Eddie Johnson predicted a 50% reduction is Chicago violence within 3 years of SB1722 becoming law.  The bill was signed into law on 6/23/2017. The clock is now ticking.


#37 Jeffrey

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Posted 15 November 2017 - 02:13 PM

 

 

I shudder to give more power to take away rights to the gov. If they are not to be trusted with firearms, why are they in public?

Some underage **** cut the throat of a puppy here, nearly killed him, and it took a local media and social media backlash like nothing I've ever seen to get the SA to entertain felony charges. Some kid a county over from me viciously beat a puppy to death and was allowed to plead to a misdemeanor. These scumbags should be felons. And they should be in prison. Anyone who bashes a dog's skull for kicks is unfit for society. And I don't wanna hear the "I was abused as a child" (really? So was I, but I didn't become a sociopath) since it would shock me that the scumbag WASN'T abused as a child.

 

I know a little bit about this^

I'm no bleeding heart but this is a screwed up kid from a screwed up family that was living in a car with a puppy they couldn't feed. The 17 year old felt sorry for the puppy and thought he was saving it from suffering starvation. The SA and the media got all over it and it blew up. The kid and probably the whole family needs help more than another tried-as-adult felony on the books. I'm usually a hang em all type when it comes to criminals but sometimes its a lot deeper than the 6 oclock news.

and you won't find a bigger dog lover than me

 

That particular case doesn't sound like a "deeper than the news" situation.  If they were that hard up, why not try to sell the dog?  There was plenty of other options than what happened.


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#38 Jeffrey

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Posted 15 November 2017 - 02:14 PM

(510 ILCS 70/) Humane Care for Animals Act already makes animal abuse a felony. Felons are prohibited from possessing firearms. isn't this issue already addressed?

STOP WITH THE FACTS!


...and justice for all

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#39 Cerus

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Posted 15 November 2017 - 03:59 PM

(510 ILCS 70/) Humane Care for Animals Act already makes animal abuse a felony. Felons are prohibited from possessing firearms. isn't this issue already addressed?


The problem is the laws are not often enforced to the fullest extent. Its usually plead down to a misdemeanor with a pocket change fine unless the courts are animal lovers. Take that psycho Kirkpactrick down here in Southern IL.

A former vet charged with multiple counts of animal cruelty and operating without a license and people DEFEND her. She winds up with no jail time and two years probation and she only got that because of the license thing. If she wasnt a former vet she probably wouldn't have been charged at all.

http://thesouthern.c...1baad6ca2c.html


Is the abuse of children a disqualifier?  What if someone pled down to a misdemeanor for that? 
 
If not, then we have a huge double standard, when it comes to this bill. 
 
Then again, the left always put animals above human beings.   They humanize animals and animalize humans.


Well they do have a point. Whens the last time you saw a bunch of masked dogs burning down neighborhoods because their candidate lost an election or one of their own was killed?

Animals are just being animals and cant choose to be anything else. Humans have a choice of whether or not to act like one. Animals cant speak for themselves and are at our mercy. The laws should at least treat them equally. A man beating up another man - at least the guy stands a chance. A man beating up a dog is just pathetic.

Edited by Cerus, 15 November 2017 - 04:03 PM.


#40 mauserme

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Posted 15 November 2017 - 04:11 PM

As bad as animal cruelty is, I have a very difficult time seeing the connection between it and gun ownership.

I think it's true to an extent that serial killers have often felt no empathy toward animals or their fellow human beings. Jeffery Dahmer and John Wayne Gacy come to mind.  But conflating that sort of serial killing with gun use does no one any good.  And implying that all people who treat animals badly are necessarily serial killers is just wrong.

 


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Link to ILGA House Audio/Video..........Link to ILGA Senate Audio/Video ..........Advanced Digital Media Link ..........Blue Room Stream Link

Let all bitterness and wrath and anger and clamor and slander be put away from you, along with all malice. (Ephesians 4:31)

 

On 5/25/2017, Superintendent Eddie Johnson predicted a 50% reduction is Chicago violence within 3 years of SB1722 becoming law.  The bill was signed into law on 6/23/2017. The clock is now ticking.


#41 tkroenlein

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Posted 15 November 2017 - 04:26 PM

People who intentionally hurt dogs should be executed on the spot.  Then we don't need this law.


Comments like this make all gun owners look like extremists.

#42 Dx54r

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Posted 15 November 2017 - 06:03 PM

 

People who intentionally hurt dogs should be executed on the spot.  Then we don't need this law.


Comments like this make all gun owners look like extremists.

 

 PETA makes these same comments. :laugh:



#43 skinnyb82

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Posted 15 November 2017 - 06:10 PM

The part that slays me is they are basically saying that this will stop a budding serial killer in his or her tracks. That's insane. Yeah let's take away guns from a potential murderer. That leaves...well, every other weapon available to them. Some sicko serial killer isn't gonna care about not being able to buy a gun when a (insert weapon of choice here) could be purchased at the local hardware store. Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk
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#44 BobPistol

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Posted 15 November 2017 - 06:56 PM

 


Well they do have a point. Whens the last time you saw a bunch of masked dogs burning down neighborhoods because their candidate lost an election or one of their own was killed?

Animals are just being animals and cant choose to be anything else. Humans have a choice of whether or not to act like one. Animals cant speak for themselves and are at our mercy. The laws should at least treat them equally. A man beating up another man - at least the guy stands a chance. A man beating up a dog is just pathetic.

 

 

No, they don't have a point.

 

The same violent leftists you describe do not describe all of humanity.   Therefore painting all of humanity with that brush and dehumanizing them is bad logic and bad reasoning.

 

We don't do that with Muslims.   We don't do that with gun owners.   We don't do that with any other group.    We don't even do that with all animals!  

I've said it many times - bad philosophy leads to bad results.   If the bad philosophy that humans are evil can be allowed to propagate, we will see more violence.

 

Every bloodthirsty regime on the planet started with a belief of dehumanizing people.    Mao.  Lenin.  Stalin.  Pol Pot.  Hitler.   Every single one of them started with this belief.

 

It is wrong to animalize (and dehumanize) people.  Period.    You're not going to convince me of this.   

 

I do agree we should not abuse animals.   I would never do that.   

 

On the other hand, we must not humanize animals.   That would lead to animals having more rights than people.   Do you seriously believe that the totalitarians among us will  NEVER let that happen, and NEVER use that situation to rob people of their rights?   People have brought up examples in this thread.


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#45 soundguy

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Posted 15 November 2017 - 08:57 PM

Some animals are bad animals. All you can do is put them down.

 

Same with humans...


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#46 rebel49

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Posted 16 November 2017 - 12:31 AM

Many years ago on a planet far ,far away. A neighbor left a 10-12 week old puppy chained in the back yard . No food or water, 35-40 degrees, well the little guy kept barking and barking and barking.

Finally the owner came out after several hours and the pup ran away from him. So the owner walked the chain down and proceeded to kick the pup. Why he was so busy doing that that he didn't see the 250 pound biker neighbor next door jump the fence and land on him. The pups owner got the pudding knocked out of him and couldn't work for a couple of days due to injuries. He was warned 1. no cops, 2. no beating of animals or children ( he liked to do that also) or next time it will be worse than this time. 

More people should stand up for what's right and do the right thing. Not necessarily violently like this, but call law enforcement, animal control and notify them what's going on.

We have enough laws on the books without making more, enforce the ones we have.



#47 skinnyb82

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Posted 16 November 2017 - 10:32 AM

More people should stand up for what's right and do the right thing. Not necessarily violently like this, but call law enforcement, animal control and notify them what's going on. We have enough laws on the books without making more, enforce the ones we have.
I would happily do that if I didn't think the person was gonna call the police on me, fabricate some BS statement, and I end up with a disorderly citation or arrested on some bogus crap. I'd call the cops and let them handle it, but I wish it were the old days. When society looked the other way whenever someone caught doing this crap to animals, women, children, all of the above, gets the snot beaten out of him. People don't wanna get involved with this stuff. That's why we have these people coming unglued and shooting up churches or something like the Orlando and San Bernardino terrorist attacks (all of the people who know mass shooters, know they have screws loose, do nothing about it). Yet everyone gossips on Facebook. They're afraid to say stuff to someone's face. Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk
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#48 IH8IL

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Posted 16 November 2017 - 10:37 AM

Hey, just a thought, don't kick your dog and you have nothing to worry about.

No way they would ever abuse that power or wrongly convict you. Nook wayyyyy!
Isn't animal abuse already a felony?

#49 IH8IL

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Posted 16 November 2017 - 10:39 AM

Also they grouping people into a category without having commited a crime yet. Precrime here we come.

#50 soylentgreen

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 03:50 PM

"Elsner admits he will likely face a stiff backlash from the NRA and defenders of the Second Amendment, but says if such a law saves even one life, it will have been worth the effort."

 

Putting the entire population under lock and key would potentially save one life...is that worth the effort? I choose freedom. Freedom means there is a chance some nut will abuse his freedoms and harm me. That's the price of freedom. I accept it.



#51 Cerus

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 04:14 PM

Well they do have a point. Whens the last time you saw a bunch of masked dogs burning down neighborhoods because their candidate lost an election or one of their own was killed?
Animals are just being animals and cant choose to be anything else. Humans have a choice of whether or not to act like one. Animals cant speak for themselves and are at our mercy. The laws should at least treat them equally. A man beating up another man - at least the guy stands a chance. A man beating up a dog is just pathetic.

 
No, they don't have a point.
 
The same violent leftists you describe do not describe all of humanity.   Therefore painting all of humanity with that brush and dehumanizing them is bad logic and bad reasoning.
 
We don't do that with Muslims.   We don't do that with gun owners.   We don't do that with any other group.    We don't even do that with all animals!  

I've said it many times - bad philosophy leads to bad results.   If the bad philosophy that humans are evil can be allowed to propagate, we will see more violence.
 
Every bloodthirsty regime on the planet started with a belief of dehumanizing people.    Mao.  Lenin.  Stalin.  Pol Pot.  Hitler.   Every single one of them started with this belief.
 
It is wrong to animalize (and dehumanize) people.  Period.    You're not going to convince me of this.   
 
I do agree we should not abuse animals.   I would never do that.   
 
On the other hand, we must not humanize animals.   That would lead to animals having more rights than people.   Do you seriously believe that the totalitarians among us will  NEVER let that happen, and NEVER use that situation to rob people of their rights?   People have brought up examples in this thread.

Please re read what I posted. Do you think those participating in violent protests, riots etc are acting like human beings? I don’t think so. They’re behaving worse than most animals. Animals don’t use violence out of malice, to be cruel or to intimidate. They use it for survival because it is necessary.

Now where did I say to treat all humans like animals. I’m pretty sure it was implied that if you act like an animal then you get treated like one. Why? Because humans are capable of NOT acting like an animal. It is a choice for humans.

Why shouldn’t animals have equal or greater rights? They are all but helpless and at the mercy of humans. We need them more than they need us. Any human harming an animal does so because animals are easy targets. They don’t have the balls to do the same to another human being.

Now don’t take this as some sort of PETA, pro veggie BS. Humans are meat eaters, always have been. But that doesn’t mean that we shouldn’t show them respect. More rights? That’s sorta hard to do unless you stop even eating them. But the punishments can certainly be more severe so in that way you could call it more rights. Would you not agree that a person who rapes or murders a child deserves harsher punishment?




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