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Could this be true.....no more renewals for now?


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#1 joedav1228

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 07:13 AM

Someone got a response from their rep's secretary.  I wonder if this is the story this one rep is giving to everyone rather than dealing with all of us people calling and "bugging" them...

 

In theory, is this even a big deal.  If the FOID is still good for an extra 18 months then I personally wouldn't care.  I am not sure why people are so upset, is it just because they want to take care of the renewal so it's not on their mind?

 

got a reply from my reps chief of staff , not him . this is the reply i got ,

The Governor put an Emergency Rules Act in place for all renewals of FOID and CCL cards. The Act states that as long as you are in processing with your renewal in the Illinois State Police database your card is still active for 18 months after the cards expiration date. Illinois State Police are only processing new FOID and CCL applicants that are coming in. All registered guns and ammunition shops have received letters and emails from the Illinois State Police with this information. So since you have paid the fee for renewal and are in the database as processing you are still allowed to purchase these items.

If you have any other state related questions feel free to reach out to us.

Thank you,

Rachel Schmock

Chief of Staff

Representative Tim Butler (87th-District)

Suite E-1 Stratton Building
Springfield, IL 62706


Edited by joedav1228, 15 October 2020 - 07:14 AM.


#2 InterestedBystander

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 07:35 AM

The 18 month extension has been discussed here before. Can still be a matter of store policy if they choose to accept a card with an expired date on it. As for not processing renewals, the ISP web page indicates that new apps are being processed ahead of renewals not that they have stopped although waiting 4+ months may feel like it.
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#3 byxlaw

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 07:45 AM

Deleted...

Edited by byxlaw, 15 October 2020 - 07:54 AM.


#4 RandyP

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 07:49 AM

I have already filed online for my FOID renewal (Jan 1, 2021 expiration) and just yesterday received a snail mail letter from the ISP - dated 10-1-2020 - reminding me of that upcoming expiration and providing the necessary link to renew etc.

 

FWIW the letter does detail that my card will remain valid as long as I have already requested said renewal, and that since I've submitted my renewal, my FOID will remain active during the duration of the State's disaster declaration and for a period of 12 months following the termination of the current disaster. 


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#5 BobPistol

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 08:11 AM

Then there should be something posted in a public place about this 18-month extension policy.

 

For example, on an official ISP web page, or the governor's web page.

 

Then you print it out, print your status screen and carry it with your license. 


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#6 soundguy

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 08:20 AM

It is probably good to remember to file your renewals on time...


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#7 MagSlap

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 08:39 AM

Speaking of 'store policy'....

A few weeks ago...I got 'bit'...for the first time

 

I happen to be in C®ook county... Stopped at a walmart..cuz it was there..just to pick up some soda.

Of course I had to wander by the ammo.

They had CCI stingers!! Dont see em much.  My neighbor said he wants some...so I'd figure I'd buy em up for him (even with the 1 cent rim fire tax)

Used my CCL... Nope... they said it law..then walmart policy....FOID only.

Really? Before the tax, I always used my CCL at that location. Talked to the manager..blah..blah... Tried explaining the law..He would have none of it..He was 'the manager'...

Told of em my Dupage store that I always used my CCL without issue.  I was told 'they were doing it wrong..they can be busted..etc..etc"

Walked away saying "Oh well..at least you kept me from doing a stoopid thing by paying C®ook county their ammo tax)

I was a mildly miffed...but...at least I can still say I've never paid c®ook thier ammo tax.

So..being spiteful..I went out of my way on the way home and stopped at my Dupage walmart.

They had two boxes of run of the mill CCI (40gr I think it was)...

Whipped out the CCL...nobody batted an eye..no issue as usual. (I never mentioned the C®ook walmart)

Purchased em...Walked out with my ammo..no issue.



#8 InterestedBystander

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 08:52 AM

Then there should be something posted in a public place about this 18-month extension policy.
 
For example, on an official ISP web page, or the governor's web page.
 
Then you print it out, print your status screen and carry it with your license.

https://www.ispfsb.com/Public/Faq.aspx

Q. What is the impact of the state's disaster declaration on my FOID expiration date?

A. Firearms Owners Identification (FOID) card holders and Concealed Carry License (CCL) holders, who submit their renewal application will remain valid during the duration of the state's disaster proclamation and for a period of 18 months (previously 12 months) following the termination of the disaster, even if their renewal application is/was not submitted prior to expiration

Q. My FOID card shows that it is expired, but these rules mean that it is still valid. I went to my local dealer and they refused to sell me ammunition and/or a firearm. Why?

A. Dealers are required to check your FOID card before selling ammunition and/or a firearm. A dealer may decline to sell ammunition and/or a firearm if they so choose. Policies on this issue may vary from store to store. Federal regulations pertaining to the purchase of ammunition and firearms have not changed

Q. I submitted a FOID/CCL application last month. How long is this going to take?

A. Because of the executive order and emergency administrative rules, new applications are being processed ahead of renewals, but you should expect CONSIDERABLE delays in all cases. Like all entities, our normal operations have been impacted by COVID

COVID info not on the new ISP site FSB section (yet) though
https://isp.illinois.gov/Foid

Edited by InterestedBystander, 15 October 2020 - 09:00 AM.

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#9 Bitter Clinger

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 08:57 AM

What if I want to buy ammo on line?

All suppliers require a FOID and they are probably not going to sell you anything if your FOID is expired.

This is a huge problem IMO.

 

What if I want to carry my firearm out of state and I get stopped.

My CCL shows "expired".  Are out of state cops going to know all the details of "Covid" rules for IL CCL's?  I'm guessing no.

 

If IL wants to require FOID's and CCL's, then they must renew them in a timely manner (before they expire), Covid or no Covid.



#10 MagSlap

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 09:03 AM

What if I want to buy ammo on line?

All suppliers require a FOID and they are probably not going to sell you anything if your FOID is expired.

This is a huge problem IMO.

 

What if I want to carry my firearm out of state and I get stopped.

My CCL shows "expired".  Are out of state cops going to know all the details of "Covid" rules for IL CCL's?  I'm guessing no.

 

If IL wants to require FOID's and CCL's, then they must renew them in a timely manner (before they expire), Covid or no Covid.

 

Agree'd!!

IL thinks its in its own lil universe with its captured tax slaves...

 

Has anybody tried to order ammo online (out of state) with an expired FOID?



#11 InterestedBystander

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 09:07 AM

What if I want to buy ammo on line?
All suppliers require a FOID and they are probably not going to sell you anything if your FOID is expired.
This is a huge problem IMO.
 
What if I want to carry my firearm out of state and I get stopped.
My CCL shows "expired".  Are out of state cops going to know all the details of "Covid" rules for IL CCL's?  I'm guessing no.
 
If IL wants to require FOID's and CCL's, then they must renew them in a timely manner (before they expire), Covid or no Covid.

I think online ammo is going to be at the discretion of seller as you wrote. I think we have already seen a couple of posts where the buyer was denied.

IIRC, we have also seen a couple of posts where out of state inquiries came back with the current license status, not the expired card date. Not sure if any out of state LE have a direct interface to Illinois LEADS, but states/organizations who are Nlets members also get feeds with the current CCL license status. So while they may not know the full details of IL COVID emergency process, they should see an active license.

Maybe if they had not swept $30M+ in Firearm Services fees to other IL funds, they could have hired more people and bought/upgraded new software and IT infrastructure. That $750k spent this summer on a new improved VoiP phone system does not seem to be a miracle solution.

edit: to fix typos

Edited by InterestedBystander, 15 October 2020 - 09:36 AM.

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#12 MagSlap

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 09:27 AM

 

What if I want to buy ammo on line?
All suppliers require a FOID and they are probably not going to sell you anything if your FOID is expired.
This is a huge problem IMO.
 
What if I want to carry my firearm out of state and I get stopped.
My CCL shows "expired".  Are out of state cops going to know all the details of "Covid" rules for IL CCL's?  I'm guessing no.
 
If IL wants to require FOID's and CCL's, then they must renew them in a timely manner (before they expire), Covid or no Covid.

 

<SNIP>

Maybe if they had not swept $30M+ in Firearm Services fees to other IL funds, they could have hired more people and bought/upgraded new software and IT infrustructure. That $750k spent this sumner on a new improved VoiP phone system does not seem to be a miracle solution.

 

 

Gee...I think I made an image thing about that last year that kinna 'predicts' how will it would work...

 

post-15072-0-70043600-1602775562.jpg

 

I was right?? Gee..knock me over with a feather...

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#13 BobPistol

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 10:03 AM

 

https://www.ispfsb.com/Public/Faq.aspx

Q. What is the impact of the state's disaster declaration on my FOID expiration date?

A. Firearms Owners Identification (FOID) card holders and Concealed Carry License (CCL) holders, who submit their renewal application will remain valid during the duration of the state's disaster proclamation and for a period of 18 months (previously 12 months) following the termination of the disaster, even if their renewal application is/was not submitted prior to expiration

Q. My FOID card shows that it is expired, but these rules mean that it is still valid. I went to my local dealer and they refused to sell me ammunition and/or a firearm. Why?

A. Dealers are required to check your FOID card before selling ammunition and/or a firearm. A dealer may decline to sell ammunition and/or a firearm if they so choose. Policies on this issue may vary from store to store. Federal regulations pertaining to the purchase of ammunition and firearms have not changed

Q. I submitted a FOID/CCL application last month. How long is this going to take?

A. Because of the executive order and emergency administrative rules, new applications are being processed ahead of renewals, but you should expect CONSIDERABLE delays in all cases. Like all entities, our normal operations have been impacted by COVID

COVID info not on the new ISP site FSB section (yet) though
https://isp.illinois.gov/Foid

 

 

 

Good.

Print this out, along with a copy of your application screen showing your application for FOID/FCCL is in the system, and you're good. 


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#14 Redlin

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 11:27 AM

There has never been a time more than now when the whole FOID System has been proven not to work,an unjust burden upon gun owners and potential gun owners.The whole system has always been a joke, but it is way beyond that now. I know people who have been waiting to get their first FOID for six months now. How is that not an infringement on their rights?


Edited by Redlin, 15 October 2020 - 03:45 PM.

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#15 jim123

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 11:41 AM

Maybe covid 19 could lead to constitutional carry and ending the foid. God knows how much trouble one would get in if they were stopped with a gun and an expired foid or ccl before the scamdemic. It was all in the name of safety and saving lives. All of a sudden, it doesn't matter!



#16 joedav1228

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 12:24 PM

I was not aware that I was posting something already discussed at great length.  If any moderator would like to delete this post then please do so, my feelings won't be hurt by any means ;-)

 

 

They had CCI stingers!! Dont see em much.  My neighbor said he wants some...so I'd figure I'd buy em up for him (even with the 1 cent rim fire tax)

 

Jeepers creepers, ammo is expensive enough not to mention another 10 bucks for a box of 1,000 rounds because you're in a different county within the same state.  

 

 

There has never been a time more than now when the whole FOID System has been proven not to work,an unjust burden upon gun owners and potential gun owners.The whole system has always been a joke, but it is way beyond that now. I know people who have been waiting to get their first FOpID for six months now. How is that not an infringement on their rights?

 

Massachusetts is in the same boat.  They have a FID card for just rifles and shotguns then a license to carry B (you can buy but cant carry) and a license to carry A (you can carry and have large capacity which is an oxymoron because post AWB magazines over 10 rounds are banned, it just allows you buy magazines made pre AWB that can hold more than 10 rounds).  If you are trusted with a firearm you should be trusted with a firearm, the different levels are a blatant and intentional deterrent and hassle.  As I typed all of this out I realized how a** backwards Massachusetts was, I am so overly happy and still excited that I like in Illinois.  You can't buy ANYTHING online in Massachusetts, nothing at all, it's all banned.  Before I moved they also banned assault rifles (I literally cringe at that term because it's so obscene/sky is falling and such an uneducated way of looking at those specific types of firearms).

 

What if I want to buy ammo on line?

All suppliers require a FOID and they are probably not going to sell you anything if your FOID is expired.

This is a huge problem IMO.

 

What if I want to carry my firearm out of state and I get stopped.

My CCL shows "expired".  Are out of state cops going to know all the details of "Covid" rules for IL CCL's?  I'm guessing no.

 

If IL wants to require FOID's and CCL's, then they must renew them in a timely manner (before they expire), Covid or no Covid.

 

You make an extremely good point.  On face value, until the card is actually ran in the database it looks really sketchy and even the slightest "off" feeling is enough to warrant so many dealers lacking common sense to just not even want to deal with you.


Edited by joedav1228, 15 October 2020 - 12:37 PM.


#17 FR8TRAIN

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 01:44 PM

Maybe covid 19 could lead to constitutional carry and ending the foid. God knows how much trouble one would get in if they were stopped with a gun and an expired foid or ccl before the scamdemic. It was all in the name of safety and saving lives. All of a sudden, it doesn't matter!

 

One can only hope.


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#18 ragsbo

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 02:59 PM

I find it very frustrating that the state gets to violate the law by going past the time frame listed in the laws with out any punishment when if a person did that they would be thrown under the jail. The law is the law and the state should follow the law and when they break it they should be punished. I know there is no punishment listed for the state not doing their job, but there sure should be!



#19 Rmac702

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 03:49 PM

Last week at Shoot Point Blank, I showed my CCL for range shooting, and I was told I must show my FOID.  They do have different expiration dates and that's probably why.

 

On a different note, we talked about the 18 months added to your expiration date, and I was told you must show a copy of your renewal request/email or it will not be valid.  I countered that was not necessary to renew per the ISP news release:

 

Firearms Owners Identification (FOID) card holders and Concealed Carry License (CCL) holders, who submit their renewal application will remain valid during the duration of the state's disaster proclamation and for a period of 18 months (previously 12 months) following the termination of the disaster, even if their renewal application is/was not submitted prior to expiration

 

Note the last sentence, even if their renewal application is/was not submitted prior to expiration.

 

That tells me I'm valid up 18 months after expiration, as long as I renew anytime before that 18 month expiration. I could renew 14 months after expiration and it would still be valid.

 

What am I missing here?



#20 joedav1228

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 05:18 PM

will remain valid during the duration of the state's disaster proclamation and for a period of 18 months (previously 12 months) following the termination of the disaster

 

Umm, the wording of that makes it sound like once the "disaster" is over you get your 18 months STARTING from that point in time.  So if the disaster last 6 months you are safe during those 6 months and after the disaster ends you are safe for an additional 18 months.

 

It's probably to give the ISP time to catch up with everything without being sued because they took too long and something happened to someone.


Edited by joedav1228, 15 October 2020 - 05:19 PM.


#21 Rmac702

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 05:23 PM

 

will remain valid during the duration of the state's disaster proclamation and for a period of 18 months (previously 12 months) following the termination of the disaster

 

Umm, the wording of that makes it sound like once the "disaster" is over you get your 18 months STARTING from that point in time.  So if the disaster last 6 months you are safe during those 6 months and after the disaster ends you are safe for an additional 18 months.

 

It's probably to give the ISP time to catch up with everything without being sued because they took too long and something happened to someone.

 

That's correct, but does not answer my question though.  The current news release says my CCL/FOID is valid for 18 months even if I don't renew before expiration..


Edited by Rmac702, 15 October 2020 - 05:36 PM.


#22 soundguy

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 06:28 PM

 

 

will remain valid during the duration of the state's disaster proclamation and for a period of 18 months (previously 12 months) following the termination of the disaster

 

Umm, the wording of that makes it sound like once the "disaster" is over you get your 18 months STARTING from that point in time.  So if the disaster last 6 months you are safe during those 6 months and after the disaster ends you are safe for an additional 18 months.

 

It's probably to give the ISP time to catch up with everything without being sued because they took too long and something happened to someone.

 

That's correct, but does not answer my question though.  The current news release says my CCL/FOID is valid for 18 months even if I don't renew before expiration..

 

 

Remember, you are in Illinois.

 

When it is time to renew, do so at your earliest convenience before it expires.


Edited by soundguy, 15 October 2020 - 06:30 PM.

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#23 Rmac702

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 06:45 PM

Being in Illinois still does not answer the question. It clearly says even if you don not renew after your card is expired.



#24 soundguy

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 06:54 PM

Being in Illinois still does not answer the question. It clearly says even if you don not renew after your card is expired.

It is clearly foolish to not renew before your expiration date.

Please don't mislead others down the wrong path.

 

Whatever the new rules seem to be, I cannot imagine a good reason to not renew on time short of a CoVid coma.


Edited by soundguy, 15 October 2020 - 06:58 PM.

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#25 InterestedBystander

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 06:54 PM

Whats the question? You are correct that is what it says... Once renewal option opens up, not sure why you would not go ahead since we know its going to take forever to process. SPB may have a store policy, but they are off in terms of stating a renewal receipt is required for your FOID/CCL to be valid.

Q. My FOID/CCL expired three months ago, and I haven't submitted a renewal application as of today. Can I submit my late FOID/CCL renewal application now in order for my expired FOID/CCL to remain valid, or was there a specific time frame I needed to do this in, in order for it to remain valid?

A. If your card expired on or after March 9, 2020: During the COVID-19 pandemic, and under the emergency administrative rules issued as a result of the state's disaster declaration, FOID card holders and CCL card holders who submit their renewal applications will remain valid during the duration of the state's disaster proclamation and for a period of 18 months following the termination of the disaster, even if their renewal application is/was not submitted prior to expiration.

Q. What is the impact of the state's disaster declaration on my FOID expiration date?

A. Firearms Owners Identification (FOID) card holders and Concealed Carry License (CCL) holders, who submit their renewal application will remain valid during the duration of the state's disaster proclamation and for a period of 18 months (previously 12 months) following the termination of the disaster, even if their renewal application is/was not submitted prior to expiration

Edited by InterestedBystander, 15 October 2020 - 07:44 PM.

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#26 Rmac702

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 07:08 PM

Being foolish for not renewing before your expiration date is not the question.  It clearly says you do not have to renew before expiration to extend the valid active status of your CCL/FOID.  Why am I the only person who interprets this?  Anyone, give me a legal answer to this question.


Edited by Rmac702, 15 October 2020 - 07:10 PM.


#27 InterestedBystander

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 07:42 PM

I personally agree that renewal is not needed to stay active for 18 months, previously 12. I dont think you are the only one taking it at what it says. Its clearly stated on the ISP site. But Im still not sure on what the question is that you keep asking to have answered.
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#28 Rmac702

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 07:57 PM

I personally agree that renewal is not needed to stay active for 18 months, previously 12. I dont think you are the only one taking it at what it says. Its clearly stated on the ISP site. But Im still not sure on what the question is that you keep asking to have answered.

Thanks for replying.  I just see all these posts saying you must renew before expiration.  Here was sort of my question or statement: I posted:

 

That tells me I'm valid up to 18 months after expiration, as long as I renew anytime before that 18 month expiration. I could renew 14 months after expiration and it would still be valid.

 

What am I missing here?


Edited by Rmac702, 15 October 2020 - 07:58 PM.


#29 InterestedBystander

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 08:22 PM

I personally agree that renewal is not needed to stay active for 18 months, previously 12. I dont think you are the only one taking it at what it says. Its clearly stated on the ISP site. But Im still not sure on what the question is that you keep asking to have answered.

Thanks for replying.  I just see all these posts saying you must renew before expiration.  Here was sort of my question or statement: I posted:
 
That tells me I'm valid up to 18 months after expiration, as long as I renew anytime before that 18 month expiration. I could renew 14 months after expiration and it would still be valid.
 
What am I missing here?
Dont think you are missing anything. Take it as written by the FSB. Disaster declaration ends, card is good for another 18 months. Submit renewal before expiration and a cert (not necessarily at same time) then regardless of what date is on card, license remains active while application is processing.

Does an FFL have to honor? No. They can have their own policies. Do they not understand how the rules really work...maybe or maybe not. Think how many times youve heard wrong or ridiculous crap in a retail store.

IANAL

Edited by InterestedBystander, 15 October 2020 - 08:24 PM.

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#30 Bubbacs

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Posted 15 October 2020 - 08:34 PM

You do not have to renew before the expiration date...but why wouldn’t you just renew and be done?
It doesn’t expire, ok
But the laziness to just click and pay seems to be the most prevalent disease currently!

Yes I renewed, yes it took forever, yes I went past the listed/printed expire date, no I did not panic.
I did get a new card and it looks just pretty as he l l and still has that new car’d smell....




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