Euler Posted September 16, 2019 at 10:44 PM Share Posted September 16, 2019 at 10:44 PM Petition for Certiorari In 2012, Zina Daniel Haughton obtained a domestic abuse restraining order against her estranged husband. The order prohibited the husband from possessing a gun and made him a "prohibited" firearms purchaser under federal and state criminal laws. He obtained a handgun and three "high-capacity" magazines, facilitated by Armslist.com, in an cash deal consummated in a McDonald's parking lot three days after the restraining order was issued. The next day, he murdered Zina Daniel Haughton and two of her coworkers and wounded four others before killing himself, while her daughter, Yasmeen Daniel, witnessed it. Yasmeen Daniel is the petitioner, on behalf of herself for the trauma she says she experienced and on behalf of the estate of her mother, appealing to SCOTUS. The suit contends that, not only is Armslist specifically designed to facilitate the circumvention of gun laws, evidenced by its own terms of service which assures users that Armslist does not check or enforce the legality of any sale, but that it knowingly engages in conduct specifically to attract felons and other prohibited persons while making no attempt to flag any potentially illegal gun sales, such as by identifying the parties in a firearm transfer, checking their criminal backgrounds, or enforcing mandatory waiting periods. Wisconsin courts dismissed the case, on the grounds that Armslist is not itself involved in any transaction, therefore granting it safe harbor. Armslist has waived its right to respond. The cert petition is scheduled for conference October 1. Docket Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
357 Posted September 17, 2019 at 03:26 AM Share Posted September 17, 2019 at 03:26 AM Let's blame cars and car dealers for drunk driving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borgranta Posted September 17, 2019 at 06:23 AM Share Posted September 17, 2019 at 06:23 AM It is good that the lawsuit against Armslist was dismissed since it would have sent a dangerous precedent that could open the door to someone suing a newspaper like Chicago Tribune over a car being sold through an add to a drunk driver. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Euler Posted September 17, 2019 at 06:51 AM Author Share Posted September 17, 2019 at 06:51 AM It is good that the lawsuit against Armslist was dismissed ... It was only dismissed in Wisconsin. It's scheduled for SCOTUS conference in October. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lockman Posted September 17, 2019 at 05:08 PM Share Posted September 17, 2019 at 05:08 PM What makes Armslist.com any different than a magazine ad or a community bulletin board listing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talonap Posted September 17, 2019 at 05:19 PM Share Posted September 17, 2019 at 05:19 PM It's not up to Armslist or any online seller to check anything. It's up to the FFL at which the firearm is picked up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flynn Posted September 17, 2019 at 05:35 PM Share Posted September 17, 2019 at 05:35 PM What makes Armslist.com any different than a magazine ad or a community bulletin board listing? Nothing beyond the fact it's an easy anti-gun target. If the Supreme Court does accept this it they best rule that Armslist and other advertising platforms have safe harbor, because if not a big can of worms would be opened up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Euler Posted September 20, 2019 at 05:47 AM Author Share Posted September 20, 2019 at 05:47 AM ... Armslist has waived its right to respond. The cert petition is scheduled for conference October 1. Docket SCOTUS has requested a response, due October 18 (which is after the Oct 1 conference, obviously). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soundguy Posted September 21, 2019 at 02:01 AM Share Posted September 21, 2019 at 02:01 AM National FOID... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTHunter Posted September 21, 2019 at 03:25 AM Share Posted September 21, 2019 at 03:25 AM National FOID... Bite your tongue !! We shouldn't give them any ideas as the ones they are already dreaming up are bad enough !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tango7 Posted September 22, 2019 at 09:06 PM Share Posted September 22, 2019 at 09:06 PM National FOID... Here you go: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTHunter Posted September 23, 2019 at 02:49 AM Share Posted September 23, 2019 at 02:49 AM Good reply Tango ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Euler Posted October 19, 2019 at 06:20 AM Author Share Posted October 19, 2019 at 06:20 AM The SC requested Armslist to respond to the cert petition. It did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Euler Posted October 31, 2019 at 06:47 PM Author Share Posted October 31, 2019 at 06:47 PM Daniel has replied to Armslist's response. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Euler Posted November 25, 2019 at 08:02 PM Author Share Posted November 25, 2019 at 08:02 PM SCOTUS denied the cert petition today. As always, the court doesn't say why it was denied, only that it was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomKoz Posted November 26, 2019 at 01:43 AM Share Posted November 26, 2019 at 01:43 AM So what does that mean for us non-lawyerly types ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Euler Posted November 26, 2019 at 02:06 AM Author Share Posted November 26, 2019 at 02:06 AM Armslist continues to be Armslist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flynn Posted November 26, 2019 at 02:07 AM Share Posted November 26, 2019 at 02:07 AM So what does that mean for us non-lawyerly types ? It means the lower court in this case the Supreme Court of Wisconsin's reversal and dismissal of the appeals courts reversal (that said it could go forward) stands, case dismissed and closed no lawsuit can go forward on those claims. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomKoz Posted November 26, 2019 at 04:23 AM Share Posted November 26, 2019 at 04:23 AM A Win for the 2A ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flynn Posted November 26, 2019 at 04:27 AM Share Posted November 26, 2019 at 04:27 AM A Win for the 2A ! And 1st! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raw Power Posted November 26, 2019 at 10:50 AM Share Posted November 26, 2019 at 10:50 AM Great news. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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