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Pike man aims to pass weapons carry initiative


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#151 kurt555gs

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 07:16 PM

I think many here are underestimating the impact of what Pike county has done. I would strongly disagree that this hurts ongoing right to carry legislation like HB5745. I also think that every county in Forgotonia will have a similar Constitutional Carry initiative ready for the ballot in the General Election this fall.

Coolness!
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#152 Buzzard

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 07:19 PM

Just to bring everyone up to speed - as you may have guessed this ordinance has created a real stir... The States Attorney is working on a press release now.

He is in a difficult position for a number of reasons but understand he is not against Con Carry or CCW or any of that. He is, however in a position not having a definitive court decision or an Attorney General decision to help him know which way to go.
Now he may end up popping bubbles but at least we will know what direction he is going to take and can act accordingly based a written statement.

I am guessing that he will tend to go the statist route until a decision from a higher court is made...... So hold the line for now and more will be forth coming when I get it........

Regards, Drd...

One of our members at one time tried to drag a position out of the AG's office and they played games with him. If memory serves, he asked in a letter to the AG how he could legally carry in Illinois. He received a letter from an "underling" who said there WAS NOT a provision within Illinois law that enabled him to do so. He wrote back and asked, then what exactly the Second Amendment meant to the AG and he got another letter back restating that he could NOT legally carry in Illinois. And that - as they say - was that.

#153 snubjob

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 07:41 PM

I think many here are underestimating the impact of what Pike county has done. I would strongly disagree that this hurts ongoing right to carry legislation like HB5745. I also think that every county in Forgotonia will have a similar Constitutional Carry initiative ready for the ballot in the General Election this fall.

Coolness!

I agree that it is "sending a message". But the people that have controlled these issues for so long in this state are already aware of the "message". They don't care what anybody outside of their little kingdom wants. I admire the good people of pike county for what they've done. But rest assured, the machine has heard this message many times before.

#154 Buzzard

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 07:45 PM

This is not so much about Pike county as it is a wake up call to both the anti gun Chicago forces and the NRA/ISRA to either pass HB5745 or lose control of the whole situation. That is something neither organization wants.

I hope they will see this and stop the foot dragging on both sides.

* Carthago delenda est *


Stop the foot dragging? . . . Stop the foot dragging?? . . . Just WHO do you think is foot dragging??

Chicago Dems DO NOT want concealed carry . . . PERIOD!!

And the NRA. . . ( AKA TVandermyde ) and the ISRA has worked very hard to negotiate a bill that is acceptable to enough Reps in by Chicago to get it passed!! There has been NO foot dragging on the side of those wanting concealed carry. For you to say that there is just demonstrates how disconnected from the process you really are!!

Have you been paying attention at all??

#155 glock29

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 07:46 PM

http://voxvocispubli...-of-Athens.html
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#156 ishmo

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 07:49 PM

I think many here are underestimating the impact of what Pike county has done. I would strongly disagree that this hurts ongoing right to carry legislation like HB5745. I also think that every county in Forgotonia will have a similar Constitutional Carry initiative ready for the ballot in the General Election this fall.

Coolness!

If Illinois = Forgotonia you have to be dreaming. Do you really think Preckwinkle, Dart and Emmanuel will ever allow a referendum like that on the ballot? I know what the law says but I've also lived in Cook all my life. I have my doubts a referendum like that will ever appear on a ballot in Cook or any number of the other collar counties.

#157 Molly B.

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 08:13 PM

just because you don't have the courage to do the same?

This is uncalled for Harley. It would be asinine to put something like this on the ballot in Cook and you know it. To personally attack another member in this way is almost unforgivable. Don't do it again.
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#158 vezpa

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 08:21 PM

just because you don't have the courage to do the same?

This is uncalled for Harley. It would be asinine to put something like this on the ballot in Cook and you know it. To personally attack another member in this way is almost unforgivable. Don't do it again.


Molly,

Its OK, I have thick skin, too be honest I didn't really think anything of it. Its not about having courage, its about being smart and knowing when a situation will be stacked against you in every way and the opposition plays way to dirty and cheats in every way they can.

and Uncle Harley felt so bad about it he offered to make me a new Holster for my revolver. :rolleyes: ...... :woohoo:

Edited by vezpa, 21 March 2012 - 08:22 PM.

Laws that forbid the carrying of arms disarm only those

who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes.

                                                    

                                                                                                                                                     

                                                                    - Thomas Jefferson


#159 Molly B.

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 08:21 PM

I hope they will see this and stop the foot dragging on both sides.

* Carthago delenda est *

I am not a swearing woman but this just about pushes the limits of every limit I have. This is an insult to
everyone on this board and in this state that have been working their rear ends off, giving life and blood to
get this done. I find this to be one of the worst kinds of violation of our Code of Conduct as far as
insulting and disrespectful. You don't have to agree with everyone or every method but this is going too far.

Take it back or get off of here.
"It does not take a majority to prevail ... but rather an irate, tireless minority, keen on setting brushfires of freedom in the minds of men." --Samuel Adams

#160 Molly B.

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 08:23 PM

Molly,

Its OK, I have thick skin, too be honest I didn't really think anything of it. Its not about having courage, its about being smart and knowing when a situation will be stacked against you in every way and the opposition plays way to dirty and cheats in every way they can.

and Uncle Harley felt so bad about it he offered to make me a new Holster for my revolver. :poke: ...... :D

LOL, show me the new holster when it's done and I'll think about it!!
"It does not take a majority to prevail ... but rather an irate, tireless minority, keen on setting brushfires of freedom in the minds of men." --Samuel Adams

#161 vezpa

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 08:26 PM


I hope they will see this and stop the foot dragging on both sides.

* Carthago delenda est *

I am not a swearing woman but this just about pushes the limits of every limit I have. This is an insult to
everyone on this board and in this state that have been working their rear ends off, giving life and blood to
get this done. I find this to be one of the worst kinds of violation of our Code of Conduct as far as
insulting and disrespectful. You don't have to agree with everyone or every method but this is going too far.

Take it back or get off of here.



Molly,

Whats with you tonight getting so upset? :poke:

We are all on the same team but we do bicker sometimes. Everyone here knows you always do your best for CCW and Illinois carry.

Its OK, I'll give you a hug. Posted Image

Edited by vezpa, 21 March 2012 - 08:29 PM.

Laws that forbid the carrying of arms disarm only those

who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes.

                                                    

                                                                                                                                                     

                                                                    - Thomas Jefferson


#162 abolt243

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 08:32 PM

Molly,

Its OK, I have thick skin, too be honest I didn't really think anything of it. Its not about having courage, its about being smart and knowing when a situation will be stacked against you in every way and the opposition plays way to dirty and cheats in every way they can.

and Uncle Harley felt so bad about it he offered to make me a new Holster for my revolver. Posted Image ...... Posted Image

LOL, show me the new holster when it's done and I'll think about it!!




Gents, methinks the normally quiet and laid back Miss Molly has about reached her limits with this thread! I'm thinkin' we'd better back off, let this story play out a little and understand that there will be as many opinions as there are posters.

Let's see how Lisa, the ISP, and the local officials in Pike County react in the days to come.
Are you a member of the ISRA?? If not, why not?? Join over 18,000 other Illinois gun owners in the fight for your rights!!!

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"..it does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brush fires in people's minds.."
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#163 Buzzard

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 10:38 PM

I did some digging and found the thread where IC member "Ashrak" went about asking the Attorney General's office......

"How can I go about fully exercising my Second Amendment rights lawfully in Illinois?"

http://illinoiscarry...ndpost&p=222305

And here is the answer he received from the AG's office by a Mr. Mike Matulis:


"As we discussed when you visited, I am sure there will be many legislative and court actions concerning this decision.
But the answer to your question now is that open/concealed carry outside the home remains illegal in Illinois."

http://illinoiscarry...ndpost&p=222993



#164 Hatchet

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 06:32 AM

I personally wouldn't want to see this on the ballot in Cook. Only for one reason, the way chicago(cook) votes. I see numbers being changed no matter which way people voted. In a city of the motto "Vote early and vote often." & "The dead vote and they vote democrat." I dont see a fair representation would prevail on the ballot. Then they would just have a pile of faux numbers saying people dont want it.

But as Abolt said, I cant wait to see how the ISP and Lisa handle this.

Edited by Hatchet, 22 March 2012 - 06:32 AM.

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#165 miztic

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 06:46 AM

I think it would be amusing to see all the other counties doing the same thing en masse.
Nice going Pike County!

The welfare of humanity is always the alibi of tyrants.


#166 Scots

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 07:03 AM

This is not so much about Pike county as it is a wake up call to both the anti gun Chicago forces and the NRA/ISRA to either pass HB5745 or lose control of the whole situation. That is something neither organization wants.

I hope they will see this and stop the foot dragging on both sides.

* Carthago delenda est *


What the he11 do you think the NRA/ISRA/the officers on this board have been trying to do???? I haven't read the rest of the thread yet - couldn't help responding to this.

To clarify, you're saying that you're hoping that this action by Pike county makes Todd and the ISRA realize that a concealed carry bill needs to be passed? This garbage is ignorant and downright insulting to everyone trying to make this happen.

EDIT: I see I wasn't the first one to respond to that - oh well, it needed to be said more than once.

Edited by dnielson, 22 March 2012 - 07:04 AM.

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#167 Scots

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 07:18 AM

In my humble, humble opinion, this is sadly short-sighted. Once county rising up, trying to be a savior of the state - all just before the season when passing a state-wide carry bill is a realistic possibility. If I'm the anti-gunners in Chicago, I'm licking my chops because of this. I will not be at all surprised if this is used against us. Even if it works there, a county by county setup would be a huge mess.
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#168 TyGuy

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 07:36 AM

what nobody is realizing is, If the sheriff speculated correctly, There were ALOT of people Carrying in Pike county today, and there is no blood running in the street! AND NO ARRESTS!



How do you know many people carried? Is it CCW or OCW also?

I talked to some people offline about this and let me say that while I am still not 100% sure if this HELPS or HURTS us in the GA I will follow Todd V's lead on this issue. He's got his finger on the pulse of the GA, not me. Also, I was NEVER upset by any of the discussion here. Perhaps some took my, "I said good day," statement as being upset. It was my attempt at humor. Although I've disagreed with others on this forum in the past, quite vehemently at times, I still vlaue the work of Illinoiscarry, and those that I've disagreed with and I have put that behind us and continue to work together towards the goal of right to carry in illinois.

Everyone have a great day!
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#169 kurt555gs

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 08:47 AM

Molly. I am sorry. No one has worked harder than you for this cause. I chose the wrong words when I said "foot dragging". Let me explain what I meant.

Most of the population in Illinois lives near or in Chicago. That means most of the firearm owners, and also most of the ISRA/NRA members. Both are honorable organizations and work very hard to serve members. Because they MUST serve all of their membership, neither organization could ever support a carry bill that left out Chicago. They wouldn't abandon those that support them.

Chicago doesn't want any type of carry. If it up to Rahm, the ISP would be out collecting all of our guns. That means negotiating a carry bill to serve all of Illinois will be full of compromises designed to limit the number of carry permits. Things like no reciprocity with other states, must inform, excessive training, etc.

Many people in the rest of Illinois, like those in Pike County are frustrated with trying to come up with all of the restrictions needed to satisfy Chicago, if that is ever really possible, and want to take action now. The NRA/ISRA can't possibly go along with that because they can't, and wouldn't abandon a large percentage of those that support them that live in Northern Illinois.

This stalemate is what causes tempers to flair between many here, including myself. Then I being human write things that I shouldn't have.

I do not think what Pike County did, has any harmful effect on the statewide concealed carry effort. I do not think efforts outside of what the NRA/ISRA is doing to bring some form of carry to the rest of Illinois excluding Chicago are bad either. Of course the ISRA/NRA can never support those because they wouldn't serve all of their members equally, but I don't think they should fight them either.

I hope this post helps, and again, I'm sorry for my poorly chosen words, posted in frustration. You are the best.
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#170 Uncle Harley

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 09:01 AM

what nobody is realizing is, If the sheriff speculated correctly, There were ALOT of people Carrying in Pike county today, and there is no blood running in the street! AND NO ARRESTS!



How do you know many people carried? Is it CCW or OCW also?

I talked to some people offline about this and let me say that while I am still not 100% sure if this HELPS or HURTS us in the GA I will follow Todd V's lead on this issue. He's got his finger on the pulse of the GA, not me. Also, I was NEVER upset by any of the discussion here. Perhaps some took my, "I said good day," statement as being upset. It was my attempt at humor. Although I've disagreed with others on this forum in the past, quite vehemently at times, I still vlaue the work of Illinoiscarry, and those that I've disagreed with and I have put that behind us and continue to work together towards the goal of right to carry in illinois.

Everyone have a great day!



that was loosly based off a comment that Dr D. stated the " Sheriff stated that he fully expects people to start carrying tommorow" it was in one of the 2 threads. I don't think it was an official statement by the sheriff, just an off the record comment that was made to Dr D in person that he shared here.
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#171 TyGuy

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 09:11 AM

roger that, thanks
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#172 Uncle Harley

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 09:22 AM

just because you don't have the courage to do the same?

This is uncalled for Harley. It would be asinine to put something like this on the ballot in Cook and you know it. To personally attack another member in this way is almost unforgivable. Don't do it again.



Molly I have nothing to apologize for! If you would have quoted the entire post and not just pick and choose comments out of context. You would have read this. Which I lead off my statement BTW.


"Really? You don't want to do it there ( I don't blame you BTW ) not yet anyways" I AGREED to the lack of courage at this time! The TOTALITY of the comment was to ask why he couldn't be happy for someone to accomplish something that can not be done by him. OF COURSE he doesn't have the courage to do it now! WHO THE heck WOULD in that county?..... because like you AND I stated the time is not right! heck I DON'T HAVE THE COURAGE TO TRY IT IN MY COUNTY YET But that wasn't the point. If anybody needs to apologise you should be apologising for jumping my a** for a partial quote out of context. And like he said we are cool, no need to get all mamma bear on us!
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#173 Drylok

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 09:34 AM

just because you don't have the courage to do the same?

This is uncalled for Harley. It would be asinine to put something like this on the ballot in Cook and you know it. To personally attack another member in this way is almost unforgivable. Don't do it again.



Molly I have nothing to apologize for! If you would have quoted the entire post and not just pick and choose comments out of context. You would have read this. Which I lead off my statement BTW.


"Really? You don't want to do it there ( I don't blame you BTW ) not yet anyways" I AGREED to the lack of courage at this time! The TOTALITY of the comment was to ask why he couldn't be happy for someone to accomplish something that can not be done by him. OF COURSE he doesn't have the courage to do it now! WHO THE heck WOULD in that county?..... because like you AND I stated the time is not right! heck I DON'T HAVE THE COURAGE TO TRY IT IN MY COUNTY YET But that wasn't the point. If anybody needs to apologise you should be apologising for jumping my a** for a partial quote out of context. And like he said we are cool, no need to get all mamma bear on us!


Ok that's fair enough but let's take it easy on Valinda.


This is not directed just specifically at you harley just in general, Let's everyone take a breath it's ok, the antis can see this thread and we really don't want for them to see this kind of infighting.
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#174 kurt555gs

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 09:44 AM

I posted this in the Illinois politics thread by mistake. Admins, feel free to poof the other one:

Molly. I am sorry. No one has worked harder than you for this cause. I chose the wrong words when I said "foot dragging". Let me explain what I meant.Most of the population in Illinois lives near or in Chicago. That means most of the firearm owners, and also most of the ISRA/NRA members. Both are honorable organizations and work very hard to serve members. Because they MUST serve all of their membership, neither organization could ever support a carry bill that left out Chicago. They wouldn't abandon those that support them.Chicago doesn't want any type of carry. If it up to Rahm, the ISP would be out collecting all of our guns. That means negotiating a carry bill to serve all of Illinois will be full of compromises designed to limit the number of carry permits. Things like no reciprocity with other states, must inform, excessive training, etc.Many people in the rest of Illinois, like those in Pike County are frustrated with trying to come up with all of the restrictions needed to satisfy Chicago, if that is ever really possible, and want to take action now. The NRA/ISRA can't possibly go along with that because they can't, and wouldn't abandon a large percentage of those that support them that live in Northern Illinois.This stalemate is what causes tempers to flair between many here, including myself. Then I being human write things that I shouldn't have.I do not think what Pike County did, has any harmful effect on the statewide concealed carry effort. I do not think efforts outside of what the NRA/ISRA is doing to bring some form of carry to the rest of Illinois excluding Chicago are bad either. Of course the ISRA/NRA can never support those because they wouldn't serve all of their members equally, but I don't think they should fight them either.I hope this post helps, and again, I'm sorry for my poorly chosen words, posted in frustration. You are the best.

Edited by kurt555gs, 22 March 2012 - 09:45 AM.

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#175 pyre400

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 09:49 AM

I've been considering a thread merger... Both threads grew pretty quickly, but they're essentially the same. Objections?

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#176 Uncle Harley

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 09:53 AM

Ok that's fair enough but let's take it easy on Valinda.


This is not directed just specifically at you harley just in general, Let's everyone take a breath it's ok, the antis can see this thread and we really don't want for them to see this kind of infighting.



I'm not mad or even upset, I bet my blood pressure hasn't even gone up half a point! LOL .................. But I WILL defend my positions and opinions no matter who is trying to knock them down. I don't know how to say this with out it sounding WAAAY worse than what I actually mean, but lets face it I'm no eloquent word smith. Im a simple guy that states his mind, With that being said she needs to stick to her role as a leader and quit trying to get into the middle of every squabble. I have told her this before in PMs and I am saying this out in the open, not to call her out about it, but because I wouldn't ever say anything about anyone in private to someone else that I would not say to that persons face. So yes I hope everyone calms down, especially Molly , she needs to conserve that energy to be the leader we need and stay focused on the goal.


Here is the thing I want EVERYONE to understand, not only in this thread, but in ALL threads that get heated. Just because we are argueing doesn't mean that we are degrating one another. Much of human communication is lost through typing. The audible clues and the general demenor of the person tells more about what they are saying then their actual words. These can not be passed on through the internet. SO we all need to take each others comments with a grain of salt and realize that we are all on the same team, therefore give each other the benifit of doubt. When we think we should be offended, stop and ask does he really mean to offend or am I missing non verbal communication? I liken it to barn yard boxing matches we like to do so often down here. We may beat the heck out of each other every once in awhile, but it's just to burn off steam because we are bored or restless , we are still friends before and we are still friends AFTER ..................after all that's what guys do!
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#177 Uncle Harley

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 09:54 AM

I've been considering a thread merger... Both threads grew pretty quickly, but they're essentially the same. Objections?



Probably a good idea..............and move to the back room?

Edited by Uncle Harley, 22 March 2012 - 09:55 AM.

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#178 willxjcherokee

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 10:04 AM

I've been considering a thread merger... Both threads grew pretty quickly, but they're essentially the same. Objections?



Probably a good idea..............and move to the back room?

I agree, this needs to go to backroom...

Please guys we really need to put aside our differences and fight for a common goal.
I am kinda as new comer but I hope we don't fight :thumbsup:

Edited by willxjcherokee, 22 March 2012 - 10:11 AM.


#179 Ashdump

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 10:21 AM

I've had it with the bad mouthing, especially against Valinda! Nobody, I mean NOBODY has done more to further our cause here in this stinking assed backwards state. The lady is nothing short of a wonder. I shudder to think where we would be right now without her hard work and guidance. Let's knock all of this off and get back to working together.

#180 pyre400

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 10:46 AM

Redundant topics have been merged.
Lets remember who our friends are and "keep the muzzles pointed down range". No friendly fire, please!

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