Pistol storage in Vehicle

[soylentgreen]

 

 

If they ask, they also already have a probable cause, they don't do it for fun.

Lawyers are expensive no matter how innocent you are.

No, soylentgreen is absolutely correct on this one. If they ASK, they do not have probable cause. They just have a "hunch" that is inadmissible in court.

 

If they have PC, they will not ask for permission to search your vehicle. They will just do it.

 

Actually, it is the reverse. They will ask even if they do have probable cause. If you consent, they search. If not, they search. That way, if the probable cause gets thrown out by the judge, but you consented, they got you.

 

 

Potentially, yeah. So, why submit? If you don't, there's a good chance whatever they find will be inadmissible. You want the prosecutor to be unsure if he can win the case. The more unsure he is, the higher the chances he won't press charges. Worst case, they need to be confident that they can convince a judge and jury...because that's where it could go.

 

I'm not breaking the law. So, why should I submit to overlords who want to search for contraband? Let them prove I have the contraband first...or at least prove that they have a reasonable suspicion that I have contraband. Until then, leave me alone. There are plenty of real criminals out there.

[soylentgreen]

I keep my LOADED gun in a holster, in a lockbox in my car. I am the only one who drives the car. I am the only one who has a key to the lockbox...

 

HOWEVER, my wife might drive the car some day--she only has a FOID--no ccw

I believe it is legal because she cannot access the lock box. She has no key, never did.

 

Technically, she's transporting a loaded weapon, which is not legal for a FOID card holder...even if locked up and inaccessible. That being said...how would the police know it's there unless she gives them permission for a search? They can't. And how would they have probable cause to search for a locked up and loaded gun in the car? I can't see a way.

[mikegoob]

This site has 100 different opinions on a locked loaded gun in a car. I guess we have to wait for case law to sort it out...

[THE KING]

 

I keep my LOADED gun in a holster, in a lockbox in my car. I am the only one who drives the car. I am the only one who has a key to the lockbox...

 

HOWEVER, my wife might drive the car some day--she only has a FOID--no ccw

I believe it is legal because she cannot access the lock box. She has no key, never did.

 

Technically, she's transporting a loaded weapon, which is not legal for a FOID card holder...even if locked up and inaccessible. That being said...how would the police know it's there unless she gives them permission for a search? They can't. And how would they have probable cause to search for a locked up and loaded gun in the car? I can't see a way.

 

With the bolding being mine, she can transport a loaded gun if it is not immediately accessible. She has no key and she has a FOID.

 

Please read 720 ILCS 5/24-1 (a) (4) (i) (ii) (iii) Number (ii) is the exception that covers her under the UUW statute.

[mikegoob]

 

 

I keep my LOADED gun in a holster, in a lockbox in my car. I am the only one who drives the car. I am the only one who has a key to the lockbox...

 

HOWEVER, my wife might drive the car some day--she only has a FOID--no ccw

I believe it is legal because she cannot access the lock box. She has no key, never did.

 

Technically, she's transporting a loaded weapon, which is not legal for a FOID card holder...even if locked up and inaccessible. That being said...how would the police know it's there unless she gives them permission for a search? They can't. And how would they have probable cause to search for a locked up and loaded gun in the car? I can't see a way.

 

With the bolding being mine, she can transport a loaded gun if it is not immediately accessible. She has no key and she has a FOID.

 

Please read 720 ILCS 5/24-1 (a) (4) (i) (ii) (iii) Number (ii) is the exception that covers her under the UUW statute.

 

 

Yes this was my understanding! It really is a hassle to unload an auto pistol that is safely in a holster and fits nicely in a lockbox. Not glove compartment.

[quackersmacker]

Soylent and King, you are absolutely dead on - spot on. Goob, don't wait for the case law. Precedents from case law are weak unless they cover very general concepts and principles. In situations like guns in cars, just like YMMV, it's likely that YFMV. F=Facts

[soylentgreen]

 

 

I keep my LOADED gun in a holster, in a lockbox in my car. I am the only one who drives the car. I am the only one who has a key to the lockbox...

 

HOWEVER, my wife might drive the car some day--she only has a FOID--no ccw

I believe it is legal because she cannot access the lock box. She has no key, never did.

 

Technically, she's transporting a loaded weapon, which is not legal for a FOID card holder...even if locked up and inaccessible. That being said...how would the police know it's there unless she gives them permission for a search? They can't. And how would they have probable cause to search for a locked up and loaded gun in the car? I can't see a way.

 

With the bolding being mine, she can transport a loaded gun if it is not immediately accessible. She has no key and she has a FOID.

 

Please read 720 ILCS 5/24-1 (a) (4) (i) (ii) (iii) Number (ii) is the exception that covers her under the UUW statute.

 

 

I stand corrected.

[Blackbeard]

Anyone driving a car alone is "in possession" of everything in the car. If you borrow your buddy's car and the cops find drugs in the trunk, YOU are busted for drug possession. So, if your son goes and moves the car even a block with your gun in the trunk, he's transporting and must have a FOID.

 

This is why you always ALWAYS refuse consent for a search. If they have PC to search they'll do it anyway, but they'll have to demonstrate PC to the court, and your lawyer can get the search suppressed (if there was no PC). If you consent, then it doesn't matter if they had PC because you waived your fourth amendment rights.

[kevintb7]

Remember transporting is federal law. Super grey area, just don't make your son the test case, too expensive

[soylentgreen]

Anyone driving a car alone is "in possession" of everything in the car. If you borrow your buddy's car and the cops find drugs in the trunk, YOU are busted for drug possession. So, if your son goes and moves the car even a block with your gun in the trunk, he's transporting and must have a FOID.

 

This is why you always ALWAYS refuse consent for a search. If they have PC to search they'll do it anyway, but they'll have to demonstrate PC to the court, and your lawyer can get the search suppressed (if there was no PC). If you consent, then it doesn't matter if they had PC because you waived your fourth amendment rights.

 

+1

[gangrel]

Remember transporting is federal law. Super grey area, just don't make your son the test case, too expensive

Nope.

 

Federal Transport Law (FOPA) applies when transporting through a state with more stringent firearm transportation laws than contained within FOPA itself. Furthermore, FOPA transport protection is only applicable to intrastate transportation, and only when transporting a firearm through a state, not within a state. Basically, if you aren't driving in one end of a state and out the other without stopping for anything but food or gas, FOPA does not apply to you. And since most states have more lenient firearms transport laws than FOPA, unless you are travelling through New Jersey, New York, California, or Hawaii (lol), FOPA transport rules aren't really likely to come into play at all. Considering that the OP was asking about leaving his FOID holder son in the car with his pistol locked away, that is pretty much a giveaway that this is an Illinois resident asking a question about firearm possession within Illinois, so Federal law has very little if anything to do with it.

 

Illinois law requires that a FOID holder transport a firearm in one of four conditions. Note the "or" between the described conditions:

1) Disassembled in a non-functioning state, or

2) Not immediately accessible, or

3) Unloaded and enclosed in a case, or

4) Legally carried under the Firearm Concealed Carry Act.

 

"Not immediately accessible" is separate from "unloaded and enclosed in a case." Therefore, loaded and locked away in a lock box for which the son does not have a key pretty much meets this standard.

 

The main concern I have here is, if the son is a minor, does transporting a pistol in accordance with the FOID act pose a problem? Over 18, he can legally be in possession of a handgun but cannot own one. But under 18, he can't legally be in possession either. But now, we're back to the question of probable cause, warrants, and consenting to searches.

[tseeker]

If they ask, they also already have a probable cause, they don't do it for fun.Lawyers are expensive no matter how innocent you are. I don't care if they're motivated by "fun" or not. I don't care what their motivations are. They are violating your forth amendment rights. If you are willing to relinquish your forth amendment rights due to the cost of a lawyer, that's your business. I'm not. AND, we know there are cases where officers violating your rights typically induce payouts in the tens of thousands of dollars at least. I am willing to take my chances with my constitutional rights and I will stand up for them. If it costs me legal fees, so be it.

Freedom is not, nor has ever been free! There is always a price to be paid...

 

 

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[soylentgreen]

 

Freedom is not, nor has ever been free! There is always a price to be paid...

 

 

Sent from my SM-N900P using Tapatalk

 

 

Amen. I'm very pro-cop...but when they act outside of their authority or use their power to intimidate people into relinquishing their freedoms, I will call them out on it and I will stand up to it. If it costs me a little money and inconvenience, fine.